the_way
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Post by the_way on May 29, 2007 12:08:39 GMT -5
Me personally, I don't think there is, RIGHT NOW.
Not all time.
Just right now.
I always said Pitino was the best in the game, but JTIII is my #1 right now.
I'd put JTIII against anybody. X's and O's, strategy, preparation, and maximizing the talent on your roster, player development, etc.
What do you think?
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SirSaxa
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Post by SirSaxa on May 29, 2007 12:15:25 GMT -5
I think that argument can be made very legitimately and convincingly. Of course, there are a few other coaches who could make a similar claim and have solid arguments to back them up.
But for Georgetown, I would not trade JT3 for any coach in the country -- even if we did have the money to hire them.
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Post by HoyaSinceBirth on May 29, 2007 12:28:30 GMT -5
I wouldn't trade JTIII for anyone in the world, but right now if one took an objective point of view people would probably come to the conclusion that billy D is currently the best coach.
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Boz
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Post by Boz on May 29, 2007 12:41:27 GMT -5
JTIII is tops right now, but that's only because Ken Reeves, David Greene and Steve Adler don't currently have coaching jobs. (I'm not including Pete Bell, as he was never really that great a coach in my opinion anyway). ;D
Is he the best? Maybe, maybe not (as much as he outcoached Duke two years ago, I I think he got outcoached in Durham this year), but he's one of the best, no doubt. I can't think of a coach I'd rather have, that's for sure.
These next few years will be interesting. Everything looks great right now. After next season though, all the Apollo astronauts of JTIII ball will be gone. Don't get me wrong, I'm not doomsaying. I think everything will continue to go very well, based on the quality of kids/players III is attracting (and continuing to dominate Sweaty, which is great as well). It'll just be interesting to see the next generation after the "founding" players of this system have all moved on.
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the_way
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Post by the_way on May 29, 2007 12:41:43 GMT -5
I wouldn't trade JTIII for anyone in the world, but right now if one took an objective point of view people would probably come to the conclusion that billy D is currently the best coach. Not really. In one game, talents on the court being equal, you would take Billy D over JTIII?
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Post by HoyaSinceBirth on May 29, 2007 12:54:11 GMT -5
I wouldn't, but that would only be evaluating in game coaching. Recruiting and developing talents is another part. in almost no game is the talent on the court equal. I' just saying you'd have a hard time proving III was a better coach than donavan at this point. I don't think anyone outside of the hoya family would argue JTIII is the best coach in college basketball right now. there are plenty of coaches that have accolades and results right now that could back up an argument for being the best coach. I think III is the best coach and i could provide some arguments for it as well. such as the two coaching awards he's one over the past two seasons and the fact that he's gotten a team to the final four in just 3 yrs. I just think if you polled the country on who the best coach was I think names like Donavan, K, Roy Williams, Bob night, Izzo might come up a lot more than III's. I think they'd have valid arguments as well. For my money 3 is the man but i don't think you could say that definetively he is the best coach.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2007 12:54:33 GMT -5
Not really. In one game, talents on the court being equal, you would take Billy D over JTIII? Until proven otherwise, yes. Donovan's won two titles, been to the Final Four numerous times. I understand III has a few years left to catch up, but (1) Donovan beat III head-to-head and (2) in the biggest game of his G'Town career to date, III didn't make the adjustments necessary to overcome a stuggling Jeff Green and take advantage of a (thanks to Roy Hibbert) neutralized Greg Oden. Besides, considering recruiting is as valuable a part of being a D-1 coach as on-court, in-game coaching, to say "talent being equal" is a bit disingenuous. Florida has had better talent recently because - at least recently - Donovan has been a better recruiter. I wouldn't trade III for anyone, but I'm not sure he's the best coach in college basketball right now. Although he HAS led one of the most impressive ressurections in recent memory.
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the_way
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Post by the_way on May 29, 2007 12:59:40 GMT -5
I wouldn't, but that would only be evaluating in game coaching. Recruiting and developing talents is another part. in almost no game is the talent on the court equal. I' just saying you'd have a hard time proving III was a better coach than donavan at this point. I don't think anyone outside of the hoya family would argue JTIII is the best coach in college basketball right now. there are plenty of coaches that have accolades and results right now that could back up an argument for being the best coach. I think III is the best coach and i could provide some arguments for it as well. such as the two coaching awards he's one over the past two seasons and the fact that he's gotten a team to the final four in just 3 yrs. I just think if you polled the country on who the best coach was I think names like Donavan, K, Roy Williams, Bob night, Izzo might come up a lot more than III's. I think they'd have valid arguments as well. For my money 3 is the man but i don't think you could say that definetively he is the best coach. I'm not talking about polls, though. Polls are biased anyway. I'm talking right now. Its not clear cut and dry to say Donovan is the best coach. Izzo? Knight? Williams? We saw what happened to Williams against III didn't we? I'd put Coach K, Pitino, III, Calhoun over Donovan.
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Post by FromTheBeginning on May 29, 2007 13:00:55 GMT -5
We know one thing for sure - dollar for dollar - no one can touch him. Let's hope that changes soon - if it hasn't already and we just don't know it.
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Post by HoyaSinceBirth on May 29, 2007 13:25:54 GMT -5
I'm a little confused about your definition of "right now" Way. What is the definition we are working off of. is their body of work e.g past success included? Just who would win head to head if everything else was equal? I mean night is the winningest coach of all time, Izzo and K have had tons of success and so has Pitno and Calhoun. I'm just saying reasonalbe people can disagree on who the best coach is. I also think UNC's loss wasn't really roy's fault. More just his team couldn't close out and we made an incredible run. What exactly could he have done to win that game. He can't help that his team went completely cold in OT.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2007 13:37:38 GMT -5
I wouldn't, but that would only be evaluating in game coaching. Recruiting and developing talents is another part. in almost no game is the talent on the court equal. I' just saying you'd have a hard time proving III was a better coach than donavan at this point. I don't think anyone outside of the hoya family would argue JTIII is the best coach in college basketball right now. there are plenty of coaches that have accolades and results right now that could back up an argument for being the best coach. I think III is the best coach and i could provide some arguments for it as well. such as the two coaching awards he's one over the past two seasons and the fact that he's gotten a team to the final four in just 3 yrs. I just think if you polled the country on who the best coach was I think names like Donavan, K, Roy Williams, Bob night, Izzo might come up a lot more than III's. I think they'd have valid arguments as well. For my money 3 is the man but i don't think you could say that definetively he is the best coach. I'm not talking about polls, though. Polls are biased anyway. I'm talking right now. Its not clear cut and dry to say Donovan is the best coach. Izzo? Knight? Williams? We saw what happened to Williams against III didn't we? I'd put Coach K, Pitino, III, Calhoun over Donovan. Yes - any poll is biased. But this thread - created on the Hoyatalk board - RIGHT NOW - is entirely unbiased.
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joey0403p
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Post by joey0403p on May 29, 2007 13:47:26 GMT -5
The best basketball coach right now? Its all about situations in my opinion. Coach K is the best for Duke, Billy D the best for Florida etc etc. JT III is certainly the best for G town and he is certainly better than many of the talking heads give him credit when they talk about 'great coaches'.
To be honest, the guy that coaches at WVa has always impressed me. I hate that team with a passion, and usually think they are a bunch of no talent ***clowns. But they are always competitive which speaks to the coach I suppose. Not as much to his recruiting, but to his coaching ...
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Post by HoyaSinceBirth on May 29, 2007 14:01:25 GMT -5
the one who just left WV or the one who is there now?
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hifigator
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Post by hifigator on May 29, 2007 14:07:39 GMT -5
For the record, I like JTIII a lot. He is a very good x's and o's guy and he runs a clean program, turning out fine representatives off the court. I weigh that along with on court successes. I think JTIII is among the elite coaches and deserves to be compensated accordingly. Do I think he is better than Billy D.? No, but they are both fine coaches. In a sense it's true in any sport. Is Tony Dungy all of a sudden a great coach because he finally won a Super Bowl? Is Bill Cowher no longer a good coach because he is taking time off? I don't think so in either case. I think Billy D. obviously elevated himself to among the elite coaches historically by guiding his team to back-to-back titles. That is a very impressive feat. John Wooden obviously has 4 or 5 legs up on everyone else in this regard, and I would certainly not put Billy D. above him or many other legendary coaches. But he is to be thought of along with the SMith's, Pitino's, Rupp's, Knight's, Coach K's of the world for sure. Is JTIII at that level yet? I would honestly say no, but that really doesn't matter. All that matters is direction and pace. And in my mind JT is moving in the right direction at a solid pace. In a couple of years he may very well be at that level. Just 2 short years ago some people down here were complaining about Billy D. They ranged from working the kids too hard, resulting is fatigue and early exit come March, to running off too many talented kids for some reason.
We had a stretch of kids trasferring and having success at their new schools. Guys like Orien Greene from right here in Gainesville, trasferred and ended up being drafted by the Celtics. Guys like Muhammed Abukar were leading San Diego St. in scoring and leading them into the NCAAs. And then heading into 2 seasons ago, we had lost Mario Boggan and Ryan Appleby to other schools (Oklahoma St. and Washington). The point is a lot has changed in those 2 years. Is Billy D. that much better of a coach now than he was then? I think there is certainly some improvement there, but with regard to his legacy, his skills have now improved tremendously. See the irony? I think he is certainly some degree of a better coach, but just 2 years ago, we were on a streak of not having made it out of the first weekend since 2000, and our miracle run to the Championship game. But many forget that had it not been for a last second off balance shot by Mike Miller against Butler, we wouldn't have made it out of the first weekend in 2000 either. The point is that JTIII is in a much more positive light at this point than Billy D. was just 2 short years ago. I wouldn't put JTIII at Billy's level now, but he would be on the short list of candidates in the next group. And if truth be told, the only real difference between those two groups is what they have already accomplished. Such accomplishments will hold solidly on your resume' for histoical purposes, but I'm not so sure they improve future expectations all that much.
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HealyHoya
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Post by HealyHoya on May 29, 2007 14:10:17 GMT -5
The best basketball coach right now? Its all about situations in my opinion. Coach K is the best for Duke, Billy D the best for Florida etc etc. JT III is certainly the best for G town and he is certainly better than many of the talking heads give him credit when they talk about 'great coaches'. To be honest, the guy that coaches at WVa has always impressed me. I hate that team with a passion, and usually think they are a bunch of no talent ***clowns. But they are always competitive which speaks to the coach I suppose. Not as much to his recruiting, but to his coaching ... He is the best coach ever. I would take him over Wooden. Iba. Rupp. Knight. K. Izzo. Donovan. And probably Esherick.
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on May 29, 2007 14:22:05 GMT -5
The best basketball coach right now? Its all about situations in my opinion. Coach K is the best for Duke, Billy D the best for Florida etc etc. JT III is certainly the best for G town and he is certainly better than many of the talking heads give him credit when they talk about 'great coaches'. To be honest, the guy that coaches at WVa has always impressed me. I hate that team with a passion, and usually think they are a bunch of no talent ***clowns. But they are always competitive which speaks to the coach I suppose. Not as much to his recruiting, but to his coaching ... He is the best coach ever. I would take him over Wooden. Iba. Rupp. Knight. K. Izzo. Donovan. And probably Esherick. What about over Whoopi Goldberg?
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guru
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Post by guru on May 29, 2007 14:25:35 GMT -5
He is second only to Norman Dale.
Also to Reggie Theus (saturday morning version).
Oh, and Nick Nolte.
Um, and Kevin Bacon.
JTIII is definitely top 5.
Just a hair above Josh Lucas.
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on May 29, 2007 14:27:46 GMT -5
What about the coach from Teen Wolf? Not much of a strategist, but he taught those boys some key life lessons.
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hifigator
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Post by hifigator on May 29, 2007 14:39:41 GMT -5
What about the coach from Teen Wolf? Not much of a strategist, but he taught those boys some key life lessons. Yeah, and he really got the crowd into it too: Wolf, wolf, wolf, wolf, wolf WOLF!!!!" As if that movie wasn't bad enough, can you all believe they made a Teen Wolf 2?
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Post by hoya8185 on May 29, 2007 14:42:42 GMT -5
And for high school coaches don't forget the talented Coach Ken Reeves
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