HoyaFanNY
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Never throw to the venus on a spider 3 Y banana!
Posts: 4,995
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Post by HoyaFanNY on Dec 2, 2006 21:42:18 GMT -5
i never really had a sense that we were going to win this game when we couldn't blow them out when they played miserably in the first 10 minutes. another game, the same problems. way too may tunrovers, too many offensive boards given up, no 3 pt shooting, and the continued decline in the play of green. he is invisible on the floor. he just dribbles the ball on the perimeter and passes off. clowns from the chat room keep making excuses, or click 'ignore' to keep your heads buried in the sand.
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Post by aleutianhoya on Dec 2, 2006 21:44:05 GMT -5
The difference in the game was Hibbert, and Duke's effective zone (and man) defense, not the "system". Down the stretch, the clear strategy was to get Hibbert looks in the post. Several times, he was single-teamed, and either turned it over or took an ugly shot. When they doubled-him, he was unable to find the open man. They seemed to be trying to play a two-man game with Green and Hibbert, but couldn't execute it. That was the same strategy that worked effectively in the post-season run last year.
In the first half, I thought we mixed up the offense well...running where we could, using the back door, and setting up some post isolations. In the second half, we struggled against the zone and the extended pressure, and then relied too much (in hindsight because Roy wasn't playing well) on the post. I don't think it was a bad strategy; it just didn't work.
And, if anything, the second half offense was a deviation from traditional Princeton-offense principles.
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Massholya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,010
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Post by Massholya on Dec 2, 2006 21:47:37 GMT -5
I am increasingly finding myself in the school of thought that leadership by example is no leadership at all. Unfortunately, those are the types of personalities that we have on this team right now. Things is it works great when you're up big. But when we're down, we don't have the personalities to put the team on their backs and compel them to win. It has little to do with personalities - we just don't have anyone that can create a shot consistently. It's hard to come back when it takes us 20 seconds at minimum to get a shot every possession. Well, I can see your point but jeff turned it over or got blocked in about half of the last 10 possessions. This game was there but there was no on the floor to make things happen. I will concede your point though that maybe the offense isn't providing the tools to allow that to happen. Certainly we need to develop the ability to change gears at the end of games. We will NOT win games if we continue to run 30 sec sets when we're down 6 pts with 60 secs to go. That makes absolutely NO sense. I still can't quite understand what we were doing out there at the end of the game.
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KHoyaNYC
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,901
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Post by KHoyaNYC on Dec 2, 2006 21:49:25 GMT -5
we did take too long in our last few possessions to get off a shot.
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Post by essex on Dec 2, 2006 21:55:37 GMT -5
We've heard all the excuses over and over. Is it possible that the root of the problem actually lies with an overmatched coaching ensemble???
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KHoyaNYC
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,901
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Post by KHoyaNYC on Dec 2, 2006 21:57:26 GMT -5
I cant believe you are calling out the coaches on this. Are you really serious?
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hoyaboy1
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,346
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Post by hoyaboy1 on Dec 2, 2006 22:01:19 GMT -5
Yea, chill. The coaches have struggled so far this year (haven't adjusted the offense for our talent, poor in game adjustments, questionable rotations, players have no idea what to do at the end of games), but to say that they are 'overmatched" is over the top.
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KHoyaNYC
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,901
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Post by KHoyaNYC on Dec 2, 2006 22:01:20 GMT -5
Let me amend my statement. I think the coaches do need to do a better job with having an alternative to the princeton offense when we are down and the minutes are starting to matter. But I think the players, especially two certain juniors, are more at fault here than the coaching staff.
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DanMcQ
Moderator
Posts: 31,997
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Post by DanMcQ on Dec 2, 2006 22:05:47 GMT -5
I am not certain it is entirely the fault of any of: the juniors, the new players, or the coaching staff. It's a combination. The old and new players clearly have not gotten to the point where they can run the offense against pressure and do it instinctively - that leads to hesitation, bad passes, etc. It's frustrating, but the team clearly is not at the point it needs to be yet.
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Bahstin
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 624
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Post by Bahstin on Dec 2, 2006 22:06:49 GMT -5
Wow. Both those teams suck. They just suck less.
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RDF
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 8,835
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Post by RDF on Dec 2, 2006 22:24:21 GMT -5
Wow. Both those teams suck. They just suck less. POST OF NIGHT and 1000000000% on the money!!!
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Locker
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,265
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Post by Locker on Dec 2, 2006 22:32:24 GMT -5
I agree that Jeff and Roy need to score when they get in the post against man to man defense.
But if I see our perimeter players stand around and watch once the ball gets dumped down one more time, I will have a conniption.
That's NOT the system, but JT3 needs to get it fixed.
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KHoyaNYC
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,901
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Post by KHoyaNYC on Dec 2, 2006 22:35:01 GMT -5
Gotta love this quote from the AP:
"Georgetown was quicker and better inside than Duke but for some reason kept firing 3s, finishing 1-for-8 from there for the half."
We finished 2/14 from 3.
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Grandpa
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 732
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Post by Grandpa on Dec 2, 2006 22:54:40 GMT -5
Gotta love this quote from the AP: "Georgetown was quicker and better inside than Duke but for some reason kept firing 3s, finishing 1-for-8 from there for the half." We finished 2/14 from 3. In a twisted, masochistic way, I'm almost looking forward to what Barker has to say about the 3-point efforts in this game (and thus far this season).
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HoyaInsomniac
Bulldog (over 250 posts)
This is it. Don't get scared now.
Posts: 360
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Post by HoyaInsomniac on Dec 2, 2006 22:57:26 GMT -5
It was bad enough to suffer such an awful second half, but DV did us no favors either. Ugh. We finally watched the game on mute for the last 2 minutes rather than listen to his insipid slobbering over K and "his kids."
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TC
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 9,477
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Post by TC on Dec 2, 2006 23:07:30 GMT -5
Duke is not a great team. It's too bad that we made them look good, but I saw the Marquette game, and Marquette is a far more scary team.
That said, the team played a lot better than I thought we would. You know going into Cameron that you aren't going to get any whistles, and that every time a Duke player makes contact they'll be going to the line.
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Post by JohnnyJones on Dec 2, 2006 23:22:14 GMT -5
Duke is not a great team. It's too bad that we made them look good, but I saw the Marquette game, and Marquette is a far more scary team. That said, the team played a lot better than I thought we would. You know going into Cameron that you aren't going to get any whistles, and that every time a Duke player makes contact they'll be going to the line. I agree with you generally, but I thought tonight's gamewas pretty evenly and fairly officiated.
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Filo
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,920
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Post by Filo on Dec 2, 2006 23:35:21 GMT -5
I thought the officiating was OK -- better than expected in terms of calling the fouls and walks against Duke, but there were some pretty bad missed calls. Whatever...it did not impact the outcome.
The Hoyas' failure to adjust to Duke's adjustments is what caused the loss. Terrible way to lose, scoring only 18 points in the second half against a very mediocre Duke team. Talk about blown opportunties.
One more item of dismay -- how do you let a mediocre guard like Paulus (who was so bad in the first half that he was almost like the Hoyas' sixth man) become the pivotal force at the end of the game. Embarrassing.
Real sloppy and unsure out there when the game was on the line. Let's hope they can build on the first half performance, because the margin for error is getting slimmer and slimmer...
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bubbrubbhoya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
We are the intuitive minds that plot the course. Woo-WOOO!
Posts: 1,369
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Post by bubbrubbhoya on Dec 2, 2006 23:51:30 GMT -5
I am surprised RDF has not ranted yet about Dookie V soiling himself with excitement about Coach K. That was tough to listen to. Good call. As the second half progressed and Dickie V's arousement level was heightened, it became almost physically sickening. How about when Dook made a backdoor cut, and it was all he could do to restrain himself from laughing at Georgetown? A man whose own grandson can't stand him has no business calling basketball games.
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nodak89
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Roy Roy Royyyyy!!!
Posts: 1,881
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Post by nodak89 on Dec 3, 2006 0:14:24 GMT -5
Some semi-random thoughts......
I really wanted Wallace to take a 3 when we were down 5 in the last minute. He's our one deep threat. Last year we had DJ, AC, and Bobo as well.
I think we felt a little too secure with a 7 point lead to start the second half. I didn't see the guys taking care of the ball and trying to work for a good shot. Too many quick threes (which of course we missed.) I think that if we had even one FG out of those 3 or so early wasted possesions, we could have broke out of the funk.
I was happy to see the Hoyas retake the lead from 4 down in the middle of the second half. They could have folded right then, but hung around.
Sapp was aggressive and looked like a scorer. Thank goodness.
Did you notice how when we were desperate for a hoop, Roy drives from the top of the key? But then, when were desperate for another hoop, Roy airballs from 5 feet. I thought he shot better turning to the middle for a lefty hooker, rather than turning baseline for the righty shot put.
All in all, it was disappointing to let those dookstraps off the hook. One can only hope that the team and staff will use this experience and learn how to put teams away come January.
dang....
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