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Post by hoyalove4ever on Dec 6, 2022 16:35:38 GMT -5
Not saying I agree with it, but I believe some are discounting pure loyalty. IMHO that is a huge factor.
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1427hoya
Bulldog (over 250 posts)
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Post by 1427hoya on Dec 6, 2022 16:37:32 GMT -5
I think it makes sense that if Ewing stays the whole season and it’s another disaster then they are more likely to clean the entire house. Although firing Ronny now would definitely make it easier to talk to potential coaches. Ideally fire Ewing the day after we exit from the BET and already have spoken to pitino or whoever well before that and make it all official the second after Iona’s season is over at their conference tournament or when they exit March madness I am not sure how you can even begin talking to other coaches unless you fire Ronny first. Unless, of course, you want Ronny to be the one talking to potential coaches - which you don't. No one else at the University or on behalf of the University is going to be talking to any coach (or agent) with Ronny still in place. It makes no sense. Would GU work around Ronny in speaking with a potential coach or his agent and then just hire him with Ronny still running the program after Ronny didn't have anything to do with the hiring? No. As long as Ronny is still there, no one at GU is talking to any potential future coach. If Ronny is still there, Ronny is the one having discussions with potential coaches or their agents if there are talks of a coaching change. Firing Ronnie now is critical. Assuming GU doesn't do something dumb like hire another "Thompson family crony" into Ronny's position (which is a scary thought no one is even talking about), GU could fire Ronny now and then spend the next several months getting the program back under the control of the AD office and making things smoother for a real coaching change the day after the BET. If GU wants to move beyond both RT and PE in 2023, getting rid of everyone at once in March just creates more unnecessary scrambling. There is literally no downside in getting rid of RT right now. None. But right now, Ronny is still there - so you know nothing is getting done. 4 scenarios:1) Keep PE, Keep RT (terrible, but sadly realistic) 2) Fire PE, Keep RT (worse than #1 because then we go down another very long path of a coach picked by RT who will be terrible. It will add years to the problem. Might as well let PE coach out is contract). 3) Keep PE, Fire RT (kind of nonsensical, but possible given that it is GU. There are two scenarios. It's possible in that another unqualified member of the Thompson/Family clan takes RT's position and then it's just stupid games just to buy PE more time like last year's canning of the assistants to by PE more time. If the position is eliminated and the program falls under the AD, I just don't see them keeping PE after taking the time to restructure). 4) Fire PE, Fire RT (the DREAM scenario so long as that in addition to firing RT, the position is eliminated altogether and the program falls under the AD again. Otherwise, we have another person with a family agenda in the job and this person is unaccountable and creating another crony empire).
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1427hoya
Bulldog (over 250 posts)
Posts: 351
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Post by 1427hoya on Dec 6, 2022 16:39:56 GMT -5
”Unless he’s got blackmail material on the university or it’s leadership.” This board (Hoya Talk) is the place you make up whatever conspiracy theory you think is going to make sense. 😂 Besides blackmail on the university or its leadership, what justification could there possibly be to keep Ronny employed? It's blackmail Or It'a cult-like view of Ronny and the Thompson/Ewing family (which, is a perverted brand of loyalty - the only kind of loyalty that exists to keep you attached to an underperforming disgrace). Or It's just plain laziness. Or They want the program to fail so they can eventually get rid of it. Who better than Ronny for that?
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Elvado
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by Elvado on Dec 6, 2022 16:44:01 GMT -5
Just looked at Howze’s bio on the team page.
Shockingly, his stellar tenure at Ball Stare with Ronny does not merit a mention.
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alleninxis
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,216
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Post by alleninxis on Dec 6, 2022 17:03:27 GMT -5
Worth repeating, but JTIII *fired* Howze.
As for Ronny - any credible D1 coach would laugh at the idea of him being 'chief of staff' and surely would tell him to get lost immediately. But I share the same fear at hiring an up and comer that he can sell himself to and promise to show him the ropes or the lay of the land.
Ronny knows he and his cronies are on borrowed time -and that no Division I program in America would see them fit for another job (none did before this)- so I imagine they will fight this tooth and nail and they will got to their playbook and try to pull out every stop imaginable.
Let's hope we have some real leadership somewhere to deal with it.
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Post by FromTheBeginning on Dec 6, 2022 17:06:21 GMT -5
Best scenario -
1)RT steps down now citing "opportunities in broadcasting"
2) PE announces this will be his last year due to "health concerns" - This allows interested parties to express interest above board and in plenty of time
3) This allows current players to plan for the portal if they want but still have the option to "wait and see" what happens coaching wish and still have time to pull the trigger at the end of the season. It might prevent another mid year jail break of the current team.
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1427hoya
Bulldog (over 250 posts)
Posts: 351
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Post by 1427hoya on Dec 6, 2022 17:15:41 GMT -5
Best scenario - 1)RT steps down now citing "opportunities in broadcasting" 2) PE announces this will be his last year due to "health concerns" - This allows interested parties to express interest above board and in plenty of time 3) This allows current players to plan for the portal if they want but still have the option to "wait and see" what happens coaching wish and still have time to pull the trigger at the end of the season. It might prevent another mid year jail break of the current team. Yes.. and I'd add this 4) RT's position is eliminated altogether and men's basketball is placed under the AD's control. No more "man behind the curtain" position where a guy runs the program in low profile.
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hoyaroc
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Post by hoyaroc on Dec 6, 2022 17:27:40 GMT -5
Any more news on Ronny Thompson? 😂
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Elvado
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by Elvado on Dec 6, 2022 17:32:06 GMT -5
Any more news on Ronny Thompson? 😂 No still useless on his best day.
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CTHoya08
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Bring back Izzo!
Posts: 2,879
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Post by CTHoya08 on Dec 6, 2022 21:49:29 GMT -5
I think it makes sense that if Ewing stays the whole season and it’s another disaster then they are more likely to clean the entire house. Although firing Ronny now would definitely make it easier to talk to potential coaches. Ideally fire Ewing the day after we exit from the BET and already have spoken to pitino or whoever well before that and make it all official the second after Iona’s season is over at their conference tournament or when they exit March madness I am not sure how you can even begin talking to other coaches unless you fire Ronny first. Unless, of course, you want Ronny to be the one talking to potential coaches - which you don't. No one else at the University or on behalf of the University is going to be talking to any coach (or agent) with Ronny still in place. It makes no sense. Would GU work around Ronny in speaking with a potential coach or his agent and then just hire him with Ronny still running the program after Ronny didn't have anything to do with the hiring? No. As long as Ronny is still there, no one at GU is talking to any potential future coach. If Ronny is still there, Ronny is the one having discussions with potential coaches or their agents if there are talks of a coaching change. Firing Ronnie now is critical. Assuming GU doesn't do something dumb like hire another "Thompson family crony" into Ronny's position (which is a scary thought no one is even talking about), GU could fire Ronny now and then spend the next several months getting the program back under the control of the AD office and making things smoother for a real coaching change the day after the BET. If GU wants to move beyond both RT and PE in 2023, getting rid of everyone at once in March just creates more unnecessary scrambling. There is literally no downside in getting rid of RT right now. None. But right now, Ronny is still there - so you know nothing is getting done. 4 scenarios:1) Keep PE, Keep RT (terrible, but sadly realistic) 2) Fire PE, Keep RT (worse than #1 because then we go down another very long path of a coach picked by RT who will be terrible. It will add years to the problem. Might as well let PE coach out is contract). 3) Keep PE, Fire RT (kind of nonsensical, but possible given that it is GU. There are two scenarios. It's possible in that another unqualified member of the Thompson/Family clan takes RT's position and then it's just stupid games just to buy PE more time like last year's canning of the assistants to by PE more time. If the position is eliminated and the program falls under the AD, I just don't see them keeping PE after taking the time to restructure). 4) Fire PE, Fire RT (the DREAM scenario so long as that in addition to firing RT, the position is eliminated altogether and the program falls under the AD again. Otherwise, we have another person with a family agenda in the job and this person is unaccountable and creating another crony empire). I hear you, but I think that firing RT midseason is a pipe dream, even beyond firing PE midseason. That said, I don’t see any reason why they can’t make the decision to fire RT midseason and very quietly approach Pitino or whoever. Maybe this is just semantics, but I think a midseason firing of a dude that they barely acknowledge as part of the program is unlikely. It won’t “send a message” to any but the diehards, and if anything, will open the school to more ridicule from the national press—“PE is ‘leading’ the team to another winless BE season and GU responds by firing an A-10 broadcaster!?” To echo RB, I don’t really care when they formally pull the ripcord so long as they decide to do it ASAP and get their ducks in a row.
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Post by ColumbiaHeightsHoya on Dec 7, 2022 9:11:33 GMT -5
When is Ronny's next broadcast gig? I might need to go and booo him at that. He sure as hell isn't making himself open to criticism at a Hoya game (especially when he bounces at halftime).
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prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by prhoya on Dec 7, 2022 10:04:58 GMT -5
When is Ronny's next broadcast gig? I might need to go and booo him at that. He sure as hell isn't making himself open to criticism at a Hoya game (especially when he bounces at halftime). Being stealthy at CapOne… very Thompson…
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madgesiq92
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by madgesiq92 on Dec 7, 2022 10:14:16 GMT -5
He likes to hang out in the tunnel.
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drquigley
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by drquigley on Dec 7, 2022 10:53:16 GMT -5
Face it, those of us reading and posting on this Board care a hell of a lot more about the Basketball program than DeG and the GU administration. The University has become so much more than it's intercollegiate sports teams that the suggestion that DeG and the administration would actively step in to address the rot in the basketball program is ridiculous. The only way this ends is with Ewing resigning after another disastrous year and we beginning another multi-year rebuild under someone with connections to the Thompson family.
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DFW HOYA
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Post by DFW HOYA on Dec 7, 2022 11:31:04 GMT -5
Face it, those of us reading and posting on this Board care a hell of a lot more about the Basketball program than DeG and the GU administration. The University has become so much more than it's intercollegiate sports teams that the suggestion that DeG and the administration would actively step in to address the rot in the basketball program is ridiculous. The only way this ends is with Ewing resigning after another disastrous year and we beginning another multi-year rebuild under someone with connections to the Thompson family. They care but I also sense that it's much lower on the priority list than many of us would prefer. Five tough questions: 1. Does men's basketball raise the national prestige of the school? At this point, no. 2. Does it increase admissions competitiveness? No. 3. Does it bring in significant philanthropy? No. 4. Does it attract students that want to study there? No. 5. Does it elevate Georgetown's core principles? Not recently. Sports elevated Villanova to the US News Top 50. Sports elevated TCU to a $2.5 billion endowment and a 30% increase in students. But it's been 25 or more years since men's basketball has had a material impact on Georgetown. There are simply bigger fish to fry right now.
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Bigs"R"Us
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,642
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Post by Bigs"R"Us on Dec 7, 2022 11:37:26 GMT -5
Face it, those of us reading and posting on this Board care a hell of a lot more about the Basketball program than DeG and the GU administration. The University has become so much more than it's intercollegiate sports teams that the suggestion that DeG and the administration would actively step in to address the rot in the basketball program is ridiculous. The only way this ends is with Ewing resigning after another disastrous year and we beginning another multi-year rebuild under someone with connections to the Thompson family. They care but I also sense that it's much lower on the priority list than many of us would prefer. Five tough questions: 1. Does men's basketball raise the national prestige of the school? At this point, no. 2. Does it increase admissions competitiveness? No. 3. Does it bring in significant philanthropy? No. 4. Does it attract students that want to study there? No. 5. Does it elevate Georgetown's core principles? Not recently. Sports elevated Villanova to the US News Top 50. Sports elevated TCU to a $2.5 billion endowment and a 30% increase in students. But it's been 25 or more years since men's basketball has had a material impact on Georgetown. There are simply bigger fish to fry right now. You could argue that PE & RT have had a negative effect on 1-5. It’s like we’ve given up after Esh/JT3/PE.
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EtomicB
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Member is Online
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Post by EtomicB on Dec 7, 2022 13:47:51 GMT -5
Face it, those of us reading and posting on this Board care a hell of a lot more about the Basketball program than DeG and the GU administration. The University has become so much more than it's intercollegiate sports teams that the suggestion that DeG and the administration would actively step in to address the rot in the basketball program is ridiculous. The only way this ends is with Ewing resigning after another disastrous year and we beginning another multi-year rebuild under someone with connections to the Thompson family. They care but I also sense that it's much lower on the priority list than many of us would prefer. Five tough questions: 1. Does men's basketball raise the national prestige of the school? At this point, no. 2. Does it increase admissions competitiveness? No. 3. Does it bring in significant philanthropy? No. 4. Does it attract students that want to study there? No. 5. Does it elevate Georgetown's core principles? Not recently. Sports elevated Villanova to the US News Top 50. Sports elevated TCU to a $2.5 billion endowment and a 30% increase in students. But it's been 25 or more years since men's basketball has had a material impact on Georgetown. There are simply bigger fish to fry right now. So the same person who found time to authorize a multi-million dollar extension to a coach who wasn't going anywhere is now too busy to address the multiple issues in the basketball program? If so that makes zero sense... Of course, the president of the university has much bigger fish to fry which is why he should delegate the responsibility to someone in the athletic department. Look at all the folks who report to Reed, I find it hard to believe JD is too busy to assign someone to go on a fact-gathering mission on the state of the program(it'd take less than an hour IMO)... guhoyas.com/staff-directory
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TC
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 9,459
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Post by TC on Dec 7, 2022 13:50:14 GMT -5
Not saying I agree with it, but I believe some are discounting pure loyalty. IMHO that is a huge factor. 50 years and 3 subsequent coaches is not loyalty, it's mindless devotion.
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Dec 7, 2022 13:51:44 GMT -5
They care but I also sense that it's much lower on the priority list than many of us would prefer. Five tough questions: 1. Does men's basketball raise the national prestige of the school? At this point, no. 2. Does it increase admissions competitiveness? No. 3. Does it bring in significant philanthropy? No. 4. Does it attract students that want to study there? No. 5. Does it elevate Georgetown's core principles? Not recently. Sports elevated Villanova to the US News Top 50. Sports elevated TCU to a $2.5 billion endowment and a 30% increase in students. But it's been 25 or more years since men's basketball has had a material impact on Georgetown. There are simply bigger fish to fry right now. If there are bigger fish to fry, why did DeGioia, until recently have a significant role on the NCAA Board? And if there are so many other important things, why did DeGioia go out of his way to give Ewing an extension when it was completely and entirely unnecessary to spend time on that? It was 2021, COVID was still a major issue, and Ewing had two years left on his contract (with nobody knocking the door down to take him away from us), but DeGioia spent at least a token amount of time on it then. I agree with your points above, and they are valid ones. Georgetown basketball is a small part of a much bigger institution that is mostly academic-based and not sports-based. But, having "bigger fish to fry" is simply not an excuse for this level of failure. If there was an institutional decision made to deprioritize basketball as a high level sport and run it more like an Ivy (i.e., focus more on academics, graduating kids, etc.), I could easily live with that. But, pretending we are a big-time program, having a budget like a big-time program, and having a coaching salary that is likely top 25 if not higher, does not connote "bigger fish to fry." Plus, if the goal was to simply run a reputable program, focus on player retention, academics, etc., there would have never been a reason to fire JT3 (or even Esherick, for that matter). The university cares when it wants to care. I understand that the program has fallen under the President of the University for several years, and I am fine with that. But, if Jack DeGioia has too many other priorities to concern himself with, he can delegate it to someone who does and then take less of a first-hand role. That's how good management works. All this talk is making me wonder how Georgetown ever managed to build any new dorms or buildings since I graduated in 2003, as I doubt Jack had enough time to lay the bricks, since he had other, higher priorities.
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TC
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 9,459
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Post by TC on Dec 7, 2022 13:56:40 GMT -5
Five tough questions: 1. Does men's basketball raise the national prestige of the school? At this point, no. 2. Does it increase admissions competitiveness? No. 3. Does it bring in significant philanthropy? No. 4. Does it attract students that want to study there? No. 5. Does it elevate Georgetown's core principles? Not recently. I think at this point Men's Basketball is a broken window, and everyone is noticing it's not being fixed, and there's significant downside risk on every one of those questions to not attending to the problem at hand. On number 5 for example, I think a lot less about Georgetown's actual commitment to whatever its core principles are because of what I've watched the last 5 years, specifically 2019 and 2022. It also begs the question of why you commit $12M to an extension if men's basketball doesn't move the needle on any of 1-5.
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