RusskyHoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
In Soviet Russia, Hoya Blue Bleeds You!
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Post by RusskyHoya on Oct 12, 2020 13:56:25 GMT -5
Seems relevant:
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RusskyHoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
In Soviet Russia, Hoya Blue Bleeds You!
Posts: 4,572
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Post by RusskyHoya on Oct 18, 2020 20:38:15 GMT -5
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RusskyHoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
In Soviet Russia, Hoya Blue Bleeds You!
Posts: 4,572
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Post by RusskyHoya on Oct 19, 2020 10:29:52 GMT -5
One interesting line of questioning: how much of Georgetown's philosophy toward intercollegiate athletics is Cura Personalis/endogenous and how much is "Well, this is what our aspirational peers do"/exogenous. Because the landscape of the latter appears to be shifting...
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DFW HOYA
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by DFW HOYA on Oct 19, 2020 11:05:22 GMT -5
One interesting line of questioning: how much of Georgetown's philosophy toward intercollegiate athletics is Cura Personalis/endogenous and how much is "Well, this is what our aspirational peers do"/exogenous. Because the landscape of the latter appears to be shifting... You raise a provocative question; who are Georgetown's aspirational peers? It certainly varies by sport: Basketball? Villanova, Duke, Carolina, and the ACC expats. Lacrosse? Hopkins, Duke, Notre Dame, Virginia, Navy, probably Maryland. Soccer? Stanford, Virginia, UCLA, Indiana, Maryland Football? Lower level Ivy League schools, if only that Georgetown had the institutional imagination to think a little differently. Tennis, Golf, Swimming, Baseball? Nobody, really. While Georgetown is in admissions circles with a lot of major universities, not all would consider Georgetown a peer academically (for example, Northwestern) or athletically (e.g., Johns Hopkins). Athletically and academically, I would only have four schools in that combined cohort: Duke Pennsylvania Virginia Boston College (even as both schools ignore the other)
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Post by LizziebethHoya on Oct 19, 2020 12:23:36 GMT -5
www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2020/11/squash-lacrosse-niche-sports-ivy-league-admissions/616474/I thought this piece was interesting, and mentions Georgetown a few times. An initial reaction was naturally, "this is absolutely insane," but it's something we've all seen or read about throughout the years. But a point I had previously not appreciated as much as I should was that these "country club sports" are (or can be) self-sufficient and drive full tuition paying students to the schools. So these sports probably won't be on the chopping block as much as I previously thought and maybe many schools will be looking to add these programs to attract more of these full tuition student-athletes. FWIW, I just learned via google that Georgetown added Women's Squash as a varsity sport this year.
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Post by flyoverhoya on Oct 22, 2020 20:43:59 GMT -5
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SSHoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
"Forget it Jake, it's Chinatown."
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Post by SSHoya on Oct 30, 2020 16:48:37 GMT -5
www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2020/11/squash-lacrosse-niche-sports-ivy-league-admissions/616474/I thought this piece was interesting, and mentions Georgetown a few times. An initial reaction was naturally, "this is absolutely insane," but it's something we've all seen or read about throughout the years. But a point I had previously not appreciated as much as I should was that these "country club sports" are (or can be) self-sufficient and drive full tuition paying students to the schools. So these sports probably won't be on the chopping block as much as I previously thought and maybe many schools will be looking to add these programs to attract more of these full tuition student-athletes. FWIW, I just learned via google that Georgetown added Women's Squash as a varsity sport this year. Some fact checking issues with the Atlantic article. www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/10/30/atlantics-troubled-niche-sports-story/
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DFW HOYA
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 5,702
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Post by DFW HOYA on Oct 30, 2020 18:21:24 GMT -5
Were it not for the vortex of Trump and American politics this story would be getting its share of journalistic attention and scorn. Erik Wempel basically exposed Ruth Shalit's latest article as a form of journalistic fraud and referenced a story from the Daily Princetonian which could be seen as evidence of alleged plagiarism. The Atlantic's comment that "this is an excellent story, which is why we published it" is telling. It's a story, all right, not necessarily a factual one. It's a soft target because it does not maintain the fact checkers a Washington Post or New York Times does because, well, they may ask, "why would any established columnist or working journalist do this?"
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Post by Problem of Dog on Oct 30, 2020 23:43:22 GMT -5
One interesting line of questioning: how much of Georgetown's philosophy toward intercollegiate athletics is Cura Personalis/endogenous and how much is "Well, this is what our aspirational peers do"/exogenous. Because the landscape of the latter appears to be shifting... You raise a provocative question; who are Georgetown's aspirational peers? It certainly varies by sport: Basketball? Villanova, Duke, Carolina, and the ACC expats. Lacrosse? Hopkins, Duke, Notre Dame, Virginia, Navy, probably Maryland. Soccer? Stanford, Virginia, UCLA, Indiana, Maryland Football? Lower level Ivy League schools, if only that Georgetown had the institutional imagination to think a little differently. Tennis, Golf, Swimming, Baseball? Nobody, really. While Georgetown is in admissions circles with a lot of major universities, not all would consider Georgetown a peer academically (for example, Northwestern) or athletically (e.g., Johns Hopkins). Athletically and academically, I would only have four schools in that combined cohort: Duke Pennsylvania Virginia Boston College (even as both schools ignore the other) I'm probably missing your point, but how are Duke and Penn peers but Northwestern is not, by virtue of its academics?
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SSHoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
"Forget it Jake, it's Chinatown."
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Post by SSHoya on Oct 31, 2020 6:31:54 GMT -5
Were it not for the vortex of Trump and American politics this story would be getting its share of journalistic attention and scorn. Erik Wempel basically exposed Ruth Shalit's latest article as a form of journalistic fraud and referenced a story from the Daily Princetonian which could be seen as evidence of alleged plagiarism. The Atlantic's comment that "this is an excellent story, which is why we published it" is telling. It's a story, all right, not necessarily a factual one. It's a soft target because it does not maintain the fact checkers a Washington Post or New York Times does because, well, they may ask, "why would any established columnist or working journalist do this?" Maybe Jeffrey Goldberg can get Stephen Glass to write a profile of Ruth Shalit? 😁
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RusskyHoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
In Soviet Russia, Hoya Blue Bleeds You!
Posts: 4,572
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Post by RusskyHoya on Oct 31, 2020 9:15:12 GMT -5
Were it not for the vortex of Trump and American politics this story would be getting its share of journalistic attention and scorn. Erik Wempel basically exposed Ruth Shalit's latest article as a form of journalistic fraud and referenced a story from the Daily Princetonian which could be seen as evidence of alleged plagiarism. The Atlantic's comment that "this is an excellent story, which is why we published it" is telling. It's a story, all right, not necessarily a factual one. It's a soft target because it does not maintain the fact checkers a Washington Post or New York Times does because, well, they may ask, "why would any established columnist or working journalist do this?" As Wemple alludes to, The Atlantic is famous for having some of the absolute best fact-checkers in the business. I have no idea what happened here on their end. That fact that this author is actually Ruth *Shalit* makes the other side of the equation pretty obvious, though. Big yikes.
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RusskyHoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
In Soviet Russia, Hoya Blue Bleeds You!
Posts: 4,572
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Post by RusskyHoya on Nov 1, 2020 19:59:46 GMT -5
Maximum yikes:
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Post by reformation on Nov 2, 2020 15:13:46 GMT -5
www.dailyprincetonian.com/article/2019/10/ivy-league-athletics-are-the-new-money-ballDespite the issues with the article the issues raised are real and deserve a wider discussion. As an aside, the article in the Princeton newspaper which the article is supposedly based on (see above link) is pretty interesting. As a side note I've always wondered a bit why the Hoya can't ever seem to produce any real interesting and analytical journalism like in the Princeton piece, especially given Gtwn's focus on critical reading/writing. I know the Voice sometimes does good in depth pieces, though rarely any with any useful analytical content. The professionalization of the niche sports at a youth level is certainly real and I guess should cause some reflection on Gtwn's part re how it approaches these sports from a funding and admissions perspective as you could look at the value of admitting a good but not nationally elite athlete who practices 3 hrs day 6 days a week and is a good but not exceptional student. I could see really see arguments for both putting more efforts into some sports to stay competitive or improve to a nationally competitive level or also going in the other direction. It seems the Ivies have gone in both directions, but at least they are thinking about the issues in a practical way.
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DFW HOYA
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by DFW HOYA on Nov 2, 2020 16:04:00 GMT -5
And then there's this story, which reminds us why Jack DeGioia speaks in such measured tones. Because if you don't, you're liable to send your alumni base into panic. "St. Joseph’s University in Philadelphia, like many private schools of its size and stature, is fast-approaching a crossroads: Applications are off 15% since the 2016 fall semester. Enrollment has fallen nearly 20%, and so too has faculty headcount. Covid-19 is only compounding those challenges as the current academic year unfolds. But St. Joe’s President Mark Reed is not waiting on a miracle to turn his campus around. Rather, he is aggressively pursuing a strategy that is taking the 149-year-old Jesuit university in a new academic direction while keeping all options on the table when it comes to remaining an independent going concern. During a recent interview with The Business Journals, Reed outlined myriad financial and demographic factors pushing the university to pour its limited resources into a new undergraduate health care school, which currently supports about 420 students. He also made clear St. Joe's is open to potentially merging with another college in the Philadelphia region — a move, he said, that would potentially enable the school to address its worsening academic and financial challenges in one fell swoop. “From my vantage point, you can take two entities, and if you put them together, you get a whole that's greater than the individual parts,” Reed said. “You have to be willing to be proactive rather than reactive to the situation.” www.bizjournals.com/philadelphia/news/2020/10/29/st-josephs-university-merger-health-care-challenge.htmlContrast this with a well-scrubbed message to parents: "As you know, over the past several years we have embarked on a strategy to become more selective and affordable by keeping tuition increases as low as possible — the lowest among our peers and competitors. Our goal of achieving greater academic quality, combined with shrinking demographics among Generation Z, prompted us to proactively plan for smaller class sizes a while ago. And we have deliberately and preemptively reduced our operating budget and managed expenses tightly to accommodate these anticipated shifts. While doing this important work, we have continued to invest in our educational mission, including faculty recruitment and development. Any college or university has an obligation to be a good financial steward, which is in the best interest of students and families and the institution as a whole."
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SSHoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
"Forget it Jake, it's Chinatown."
Posts: 18,075
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Post by SSHoya on Nov 2, 2020 16:12:55 GMT -5
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Post by reformation on Nov 2, 2020 19:49:40 GMT -5
Interesting post re: St Joe's and potential merger with another Univ. I always thought it would make sense for Gtwn to merge its grad school with Hopkins in some way-try to create a center of academic excellence/research in DC-Balt more competitive with the bigger research Univ's. Not sure Hopkins would be interested as they have a much stronger grad school than Gtwn, but its still not at the very top ranks and maybe some increased access to DC and additional faculty/resources in some areas would help make it more competitive with places like maybe a Columbia. The Univ's could probably also share some costs and realize efficiencies.
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RusskyHoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
In Soviet Russia, Hoya Blue Bleeds You!
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Post by RusskyHoya on Nov 5, 2020 16:06:49 GMT -5
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Nevada Hoya
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Post by Nevada Hoya on Nov 9, 2020 18:56:13 GMT -5
Financial challenges indeed!!!
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RusskyHoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
In Soviet Russia, Hoya Blue Bleeds You!
Posts: 4,572
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Post by RusskyHoya on Nov 25, 2020 21:36:10 GMT -5
Ms. Shalit Barnes has posted a defense: rlsbarrett.medium.com/a-mad-mad-world-redux-62256c445683While it convincingly makes the case that she didn't make *everything* up, it does nothing to dispell the larger problem, which is that she clearly started with a premise and tried to cherry-pick evidence around it as substantiation. When she couldn't find enough good evidence, she made some of it up. And then told some of her sources to lie to the fact-checkers. Here's the part that I know LizziebethHoya will enjoy the most: Sorry, Cuse - you are not a top academic school! It's on the internet, so it has to be true.
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tgo
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
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Post by tgo on Dec 13, 2020 18:47:01 GMT -5
Speaking of aspirations, do you think that people at Cuse have a long term goal of becoming academic peers to Towson, U Mass, University of Denver, or University of Richmond so that they are no longer the last school on that list?
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