TC
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Post by TC on Feb 24, 2020 8:57:29 GMT -5
Four years ago at this time, Georgetown was 5-9 in the BE, with a top 25 recruit signed and two eventual all-BE frontcourt members on the roster. A couple of key players transferred midseason, Tre Campbell got injured in the bus crash . They lost out, the fanbase revolted, the recruit got cold feet, and the coach got fired.
Georgetown at this point is 5-9. There are no top 25 recruits signed, I'm not sure there are any future all-BE type players on the roster. Losing out the remainder of the schedule is possible.
Is this program any better off than it was in 2017?
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HoyaSC
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Post by HoyaSC on Feb 24, 2020 9:04:26 GMT -5
Nope.
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Post by professorhoya on Feb 24, 2020 9:04:46 GMT -5
Four years ago at this time, Georgetown was 5-9 in the BE, with a top 25 recruit signed and two eventual all-BE frontcourt members on the roster. A couple of key players transferred midseason, Tre Campbell got injured in the bus crash . They lost out, the fanbase revolted, the recruit got cold feet, and the coach got fired. Georgetown at this point is 5-9. There are no top 25 recruits signed, I'm not sure there are any future all-BE type players on the roster. Losing out the remainder of the schedule is possible. Is this program any better off than it was in 2017? Yes. We are playing a more exciting style of play than RDF’s dungeon ball with a bunch of guys who were petrified to shoot or score. The players have bought into what Coach is trying to do here and the bad eggs have been weeded out instead of lingering and being cancerous.
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dchoya72
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Post by dchoya72 on Feb 24, 2020 9:10:06 GMT -5
We will have to earn the right to have to 25 recruits. We are on the way, buy not there yet. Winning makes the difference. We've been snake-bitten this year. But the team play is good. We don't quit and we play to win. There is no shame in Hoyas game!
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wolveribe
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Post by wolveribe on Feb 24, 2020 9:26:40 GMT -5
They were 69 in KenPom that year and 54 right now. Right now they have 3 very good recruits coming in along with a question mark (Harris). That years team was led by a transfer in Pryor and Peak, who ended up leaving after the year. I would say this team is not only better on the court, but set up better for the future.
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blueandgray
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Post by blueandgray on Feb 24, 2020 9:26:54 GMT -5
Yes! We have a passionate coach that the players play hard for. We play a more relevant style of ball and have a coach who hits the recruiting trail. We have hit some bumps in the road (especially this year) with player turnover and injuries....but this year was lining up to be a year we would have made the tourney. We may be a couple years off again....but yes, I’d take Patrick and give him a few more years.
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rhw485
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Post by rhw485 on Feb 24, 2020 9:31:19 GMT -5
I was going to pose this question at the end of the season, but since you asked...
You can actually draw a ton of parallels to the 2016-2017 season. I had written this out in my drafts before the Cuse game and chose not to post it but it still holds
Preseason Expectations
• Expectations of making the tournament after missing the prior season and losing in BE quarters prior year. Preseason pick to finish 4th in Big East in 16, close enough to 19-20 season (I saw us 5/6 but a point out of 4)
• Replacing a leading scorer who was a 4 year player who put up impressive offensive stats but had issues with defense (DSR vs. Govan)
• Expectations built upon a core recruiting class that had multiple players on BE All freshman team maturing (Copeland, White, Peak vs. Akinjo, Mac, LeBlanc) 16-17 were juniors but given the amount of playing time we gave this crop, the expectations ultimately were for them to perform like upper classmen
• Team bolstered by a transfer who’s only going to be here one year and expected to carry a huge scoring burden (Pryor vs. Yurt7)
• Sure lets throw in a JuCo transfer on each squad for good measure (Mulmore vs. Alexander)
• And an extra transfer w experience (Agau vs. Allen)
Results
• Two transfers: White (yes I know it happened in August), Copeland vs. Akinjo, LeBlanc **can now add Gardner / Alexander** • Jekyll/Hyde early season results. 16-17 loses to Arkansas St, gets waxed by Oklahoma St. and beats #11 Oregon, while current team barely survives Mt. St Mary’s, loses to UNC-Greensboro, gets waxed by Penn St. and beats Texas / Ok State **ok Texas and Ok St didn't end up being as relevant as beating a team like Oregon** • Key recruit who is meant to represent a significant tipping point subsequently decommits (Tremont the point god vs. Williams the local recruit that would help Gtown make inroads in DC)
• One remaining impact top 100 power forward recruit (Sibley vs. Walker) for the upcoming season
Looking back, it was hard to remember that the 16-17 team then went on and picked up two more top 25 wins in conference play, but everything cratered down the stretch, finished 5-13 in Big East and lost in 8-9 game at the garden. **I can't believe I actually drafted that sentence in mid-December, it looks like it's very real right now**
Jr Derrickson / Govan / Kaleb, sophomore Mosely, Sr Mulmore, Freshman Walker vs.
Sr Pickett / Blair, Junior Mac, sophomore Wahab / Tim I. / Malcolm, Freshman Sibley
If you're arguing Beard, Clark, Harris demonstrably change our outlook, I think JT3 would've filled roster with similar players. Ewing chose to go Dickerson, Malinowski path in the moment.
Either way it's really close and forces some difficult questions.
Edit: obviously Ewing added Pickett / Blair / Sodom in late recruiting season, not sure what JT3 would've pulled off but he would've hit decomit trail w spots open after transfers
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guru
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Post by guru on Feb 24, 2020 9:40:42 GMT -5
Four years ago at this time, Georgetown was 5-9 in the BE, with a top 25 recruit signed and two eventual all-BE frontcourt members on the roster. A couple of key players transferred midseason, Tre Campbell got injured in the bus crash . They lost out, the fanbase revolted, the recruit got cold feet, and the coach got fired. Georgetown at this point is 5-9. There are no top 25 recruits signed, I'm not sure there are any future all-BE type players on the roster. Losing out the remainder of the schedule is possible. Is this program any better off than it was in 2017? I think the atmosphere around the program is better, but it's impossible to argue that the on-court results are. What this mostly shows is just how far into the depths the program truly was at the end of the JT3 era. Our slide to irrelevance conincided directly with the birth of the new conference. Whereas we were one of the foundational programs of the old Big East, we have become merely irrelevant hangers-on in the new one. The damage was catastrophic by the end of the 2016-17 season, and any expectations of a quick turnaround on here were completely unrealistic. I'm certainly not sure Ewing is the guy to bring us back - I'm definitely not sure we ever get back near what we once were - but he's Big John's Hail Mary pass. He'll get at least two more years unless he decides he has had enough.
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Post by ColumbiaHeightsHoya on Feb 24, 2020 9:44:06 GMT -5
Good point and I am not sure. Therein lies the problem. I am still on board but need to see some significant improvement. This was supposed to be that year.
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HoyaDr
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Post by HoyaDr on Feb 24, 2020 9:46:46 GMT -5
No but there's still a glimmer of hope. I'll still be watching for better or worse
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drquigley
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Post by drquigley on Feb 24, 2020 10:09:48 GMT -5
The whole question is moot because this year was predicated on an Akinjo, Mac, Yurt, LeBlanc, Pickett lineup with Mosley, Allen, Blair, Gardner, Alexander and Wahab off the bench. With that much talent we would be playing a much different, and I believe more successful, style of ball and would be on our way to an NCAA bid and a complete program turnaround. After the transfer and injury debacle you basically have a lineup for our last 5 games of Allen, Mosley, Blair, Wahab, Pickett, and Ighoefe and Muresan off the bench. No way you can judge Ewings coaching ability or his record with that lineup although you have to give him some credit for the Butler win and the fact that these guys are still competing in each game. The real question going forward is: was the transfer debacle in any way caused by or related to Ewing's recruiting or program management ability? And sadly for those of us on this Board who clearly are tired of waiting for the program to turn around the answer to this question will be 2-3 years down the road.
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95hoya
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Post by 95hoya on Feb 24, 2020 10:13:05 GMT -5
We were playing terribly with those guys. Wishful thinking.
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95hoya
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Post by 95hoya on Feb 24, 2020 10:16:02 GMT -5
3 years in a row with no NCAAs and we have the 34th ranked recruiting class. That's not good for a 4 man class. Our guys are ranked 94th, 160, 381, and unranked. The talent has to get better.
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TC
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Post by TC on Feb 24, 2020 10:17:30 GMT -5
They were 69 in KenPom that year and 54 right now. Right now they have 3 very good recruits coming in along with a question mark (Harris). That years team was led by a transfer in Pryor and Peak, who ended up leaving after the year. I would say this team is not only better on the court, but set up better for the future. This year's team is led by Allen and Yurtseven and you lose Mosely too. Agree that this team could finish better in KenPom rankings, but I'm not sure how the efficiency has been the last couple of games.
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hoya9797
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Post by hoya9797 on Feb 24, 2020 10:19:28 GMT -5
The only thing that is better is that there seems to be more enthusiasm for the head coach. Not sure what he has done to deserve it other than being really good 35 years ago but it’s there. Everything else seems to be just as bad.
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SSHoya
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Post by SSHoya on Feb 24, 2020 10:21:40 GMT -5
The only thing that is better is that there seems to be more enthusiasm for the head coach. Not sure what he has done to deserve it other than being really good 35 years ago but it’s there. Everything else seems to be just as bad. Style of play is certainly an improvement.
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drquigley
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Post by drquigley on Feb 24, 2020 10:22:35 GMT -5
We were playing terribly with those guys. Wishful thinking. Those guys, especially Akinjo and LeBlanc, were hurting the team. But give me last year's LeBlanc and healthy Mac and Yurt and Myron Gardner and this team would have at least 3 more BE wins and be a sure NCAA pick. We'd be happy with the program's trajectory and the JT3 era would be a shadow in the rear view mirror.
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rhw485
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Post by rhw485 on Feb 24, 2020 10:49:45 GMT -5
We were playing terribly with those guys. Wishful thinking. Those guys, especially Akinjo and LeBlanc, were hurting the team. But give me last year's LeBlanc and healthy Mac and Yurt and Myron Gardner and this team would have at least 3 more BE wins and be a sure NCAA pick. We'd be happy with the program's trajectory and the JT3 era would be a shadow in the rear view mirror. Could JT3 not have made the same argument based on White, Copeland transfers and Campbell injury?
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hoya9797
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Post by hoya9797 on Feb 24, 2020 10:52:43 GMT -5
The only thing that is better is that there seems to be more enthusiasm for the head coach. Not sure what he has done to deserve it other than being really good 35 years ago but it’s there. Everything else seems to be just as bad. Style of play is certainly an improvement. I guess seeing more points scored in a loss is better.
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Post by professorhoya on Feb 24, 2020 11:04:50 GMT -5
Those guys, especially Akinjo and LeBlanc, were hurting the team. But give me last year's LeBlanc and healthy Mac and Yurt and Myron Gardner and this team would have at least 3 more BE wins and be a sure NCAA pick. We'd be happy with the program's trajectory and the JT3 era would be a shadow in the rear view mirror. Could JT3 not have made the same argument based on White, Copeland transfers and Campbell injury? Copeland's 3pt shot and confidence was already broken the season before and Paul White's hip problem made him ineffective the season before. Campbell was not good at all except for the one game against Xavier. So no you couldn't have made the same arguemnt.
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