RBHoya
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Post by RBHoya on Nov 30, 2020 18:20:51 GMT -5
What am I (we) missing? Top recruit on a young, pretty inexperienced team in a rebuilding year. Yet before the season begins he is not just benched but not even suiting up? Coach admits he's not hurt or sick. After last year I thought Coach would be sure to recruit guys who would be on board from day one. I know, I know, this happens on many teams so don't get worked up. But like I've said in earlier posts I just don't want anymore drama this year. First, I'm 99% sure he was in fact dressed for the game, just didn't play. I posted the following about Sibley in the summer, and though it's too early to confirm if even this very cautious prediction is accurate, my gut is that we're seeing it now: I agree with the sentiment that Sibley may need a little more time to acclimate. Missed a lot of time last year and while he's very much a Big East caliber athlete he's not a shooter (yet) and doesn't necessarily have a go-to skill yet. His ceiling is high for sure, but I don't think people should assume that just because he was the highest ranked that he will make an immediate impact. Usually the assumption is that higher ranked guys are ready to play immediately and lower ranked guys get a label of "maybe he'll be something with a few more years of practice." But I think there's an argument to be made that the reverse may be true in this case. I think Sibley has the highest ceiling, but I don't think it's crazy at all to think that both Kobe Clark and Colin Holloway are more skilled as of right now, and thus may be ready to contribute sooner. Neither have the length and athleticism that Sibley does, so I'm long on his potential, but I don't see him as a starter during his freshman campaign. If he's back to full health and working hard this summer, I'll be happy to be wrong on that.As hoopsmccan pointed out, Nationwide Nolan (+ alleninxis ) was saying something similar in the off-season which I agreed with. I think some people assumed purely based on the ranking and the number of stars next to his name that Sibley was going to have an instant impact. But if you really followed, he missed a lot of time last season and his ranking is probably based more on his length and athleticism than it is on actual basketball ability. He's got great potential, but he's definitely behind the two seniors and very possibly behind the other two freshman forwards in terms of actual basketball skill right now. He just needs some time, and hopefully as the season goes on he'll get his shot. I know we are all conditioned to speculate and assume the worst when a highly regarded recruit doesn't play, but I think there may be a legitimate basketball reason for it. It was always going to be difficult to find time for all 3 freshman forwards and we may see the PT distribution shift over the course of the year.
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Nov 30, 2020 18:26:24 GMT -5
You aren't really missing anything. When the time is right, he'll play. No drama at all. Or he’ll pick somewhere else to play. Normally, I would say give everybody the benefit of the doubt, but given the roster turnover situation, I think this is a fair comment. Ewing specifically said Sibley was "athletic," "talented," and could shoot. I am not going to try to sugar coat it--right now, it appears this team will be pretty bad. In that context, it's hard to see why Sibley won't play unless it is an off-the-court type situation. And, if that's the case, that's troubling. This is 2020. Top 100 guys don't go to colleges to sit on the bench, not to mention it sends a bad message to recruits. This could all be premature, and we may very well see Sibley tomorrow, or soon. So, I don't want to jump the gun, but I think it's a fair concern given the Ewing roster turnover.
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the_way
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The Illest
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Post by the_way on Nov 30, 2020 18:44:10 GMT -5
You aren't really missing anything. When the time is right, he'll play. No drama at all. Or he’ll pick somewhere else to play. Make what you want about Ewing's coaching ability, but minutes have never been hard to come by for players who've earned it during his era.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Nov 30, 2020 18:55:53 GMT -5
Or he’ll pick somewhere else to play. Make what you want about Ewing's coaching ability, but minutes have never been hard to come by for players who've earned it during his era. We’ll have to wait and see.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2020 20:17:07 GMT -5
Stop thinking everything that happens with a player, it's Ewing's fault. Stop thinking there's going to be a roster turnover and if it does happen somehow, it's Ewing's fault. The fact of the matter is roster turnover happens all the time and it isn't because it is somehow the coach who is the problem.
Sometimes, guys can't handle the pressure of academics and athletics. Sometimes rosters change or turnover because the kid had a change of heart. Sometimes maybe the coach might feel this isn't the right situation for the kid and for the team. There are a number of reasons why there may be a roster turnover and it ain't the one go to single reason "the coach is the fault".
Ewing feels that the kid ain't ready that's what I got based on the video interview Ewing did with Aidan. I don't think this kid is leaving the team and he will play when Ewing sees that he is ready. When he plays, I'm pretty sure he will contribute.
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DFW HOYA
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Post by DFW HOYA on Nov 30, 2020 20:35:21 GMT -5
Stop thinking everything that happens with a player, it's Ewing's fault. Stop thinking there's going to be a roster turnover and if it does happen somehow, it's Ewing's fault. The fact of the matter is roster turnover happens all the time and it isn't because it is somehow the coach who is the problem. It's not Ewing's fault if Chris Sodom or Antwan Walker got into trouble. It's not his fault if LeBlanc, Alexander, and Gardner went the wrong way. It's not his fault if Akinjo and McClung decided they could do better elsewhere. A coach is not responsible for decisions of 19 and 20 year old students, but he is accountable. Recruiting and roster management is part of the job, and poor choices and missed opportunities to straighten people out have led to where the roster is now. The staff cannot afford a revolving door of recruits--both competitively and within those in the University he must answer to. Roster turnover is absolutely corrosive to a team. It's what did in Craig Esherick and played a big role for JT III's downfall as well. Ewing needs to recruit and keep his team together, Otherwise, it's perpetual rebuilding and Wednesday nights in March at the Garden TFN. Or consider this: here's a picture of the roster from just two years ago with those that are still here as highlighted. And that's a problem. ON EDIT: Someone asked about #30 and if that was Jaden Robinson. Robinson didn't wear #30 that year, so I wasn't sure and didn't include it.
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guru
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Post by guru on Nov 30, 2020 21:24:32 GMT -5
Stop thinking everything that happens with a player, it's Ewing's fault. Stop thinking there's going to be a roster turnover and if it does happen somehow, it's Ewing's fault. The fact of the matter is roster turnover happens all the time and it isn't because it is somehow the coach who is the problem. It's not Ewing's fault if Chris Sodom or Antwan Walker got into trouble. It's not his fault if LeBlanc, Alexander, and Gardner went the wrong way. It's not his fault if Akinjo and McClung decided they could do better elsewhere. A coach is not responsible for decisions of 19 and 20 year old students, but he is accountable. Recruiting and roster management is part of the job, and poor choices and missed opportunities to straighten people out have led to where the roster is now. The staff cannot afford a revolving door of recruits--both competitively and within those in the University he must answer to. Roster turnover is absolutely corrosive to a team. It's what did in Craig Esherick and played a big role for JT III's downfall as well. Ewing needs to recruit and keep his team together, Otherwise, it's perpetual rebuilding and Wednesday nights in March at the Garden TFN. Or consider this: here's a picture of the roster from just two years ago with those that are still here as highlighted. And that's a problem. That is a pretty damning photo. An indictment of the current state of the program. I wish it weren’t so, but it is.
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emkmd
Century (over 100 posts)
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Post by emkmd on Nov 30, 2020 21:43:50 GMT -5
Stop thinking everything that happens with a player, it's Ewing's fault. Stop thinking there's going to be a roster turnover and if it does happen somehow, it's Ewing's fault. The fact of the matter is roster turnover happens all the time and it isn't because it is somehow the coach who is the problem. It's not Ewing's fault if Chris Sodom or Antwan Walker got into trouble. It's not his fault if LeBlanc, Alexander, and Gardner went the wrong way. It's not his fault if Akinjo and McClung decided they could do better elsewhere. A coach is not responsible for decisions of 19 and 20 year old students, but he is accountable. Recruiting and roster management is part of the job, and poor choices and missed opportunities to straighten people out have led to where the roster is now. The staff cannot afford a revolving door of recruits--both competitively and within those in the University he must answer to. Roster turnover is absolutely corrosive to a team. It's what did in Craig Esherick and played a big role for JT III's downfall as well. Ewing needs to recruit and keep his team together, Otherwise, it's perpetual rebuilding and Wednesday nights in March at the Garden TFN. Or consider this: here's a picture of the roster from just two years ago with those that are still here as highlighted. And that's a problem. In fairness didn’t 8 of those players graduate.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2020 21:49:54 GMT -5
I'm not disputing the relevance of the photo, but isn't that Jaden next to Mac in the 1st row? If it is, he must not have settled - or received - #22 yet. Back to Sibley... I'm definitely confused about the DNP. He may not be "ready", but I think he'll soon prove to be above Collin in the pecking order... if he wasn't already (obviously minus some kind of message from Coach). Hopefully that makes sense -- I'm trying to write it w/o explicit speculation. More worrisome for his long-term outlook, though, might be the starting lineup situation. If Carey continues to start, there will be less minutes played with bigger lineups. Clark came out of the gates like a rocket. D Harris will have to get minutes -- being the only guard off the bench. And it sounds like Bile (if he doesn't start) will be ahead of him in the rotation on his return. So considering Tim's minutes are locked in, Sibley's probably starting his year as the 10th man - at best. This staggered start isn't gonna do him any favors.
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Post by centercourt400s on Nov 30, 2020 22:09:43 GMT -5
It's not Ewing's fault if Chris Sodom or Antwan Walker got into trouble. It's not his fault if LeBlanc, Alexander, and Gardner went the wrong way. It's not his fault if Akinjo and McClung decided they could do better elsewhere. A coach is not responsible for decisions of 19 and 20 year old students, but he is accountable. Recruiting and roster management is part of the job, and poor choices and missed opportunities to straighten people out have led to where the roster is now. The staff cannot afford a revolving door of recruits--both competitively and within those in the University he must answer to. Roster turnover is absolutely corrosive to a team. It's what did in Craig Esherick and played a big role for JT III's downfall as well. Ewing needs to recruit and keep his team together, Otherwise, it's perpetual rebuilding and Wednesday nights in March at the Garden TFN. Or consider this: here's a picture of the roster from just two years ago with those that are still here as highlighted. And that's a problem. In fairness didn’t 8 of those players graduate. I get at least 7 of them being seniors who graduated: Mourning, Yurtseven, Johnson, Muresan, Govan, Malinowski, Mosley. How does any one of them leaving represent a problem? Assuming 7 is correct, that makes the posting of that picture one of the most misleading things I've seen on here recently. Pretty shameful to use it as a point maker. I thought that level of communication was restricted to the realm of recent partisan politics.
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DFW HOYA
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Post by DFW HOYA on Nov 30, 2020 22:25:14 GMT -5
et at least 7 of them being seniors who graduated: Mourning, Yurtseven, Johnson, Muresan, Govan, Malinowski, Mosley. How does any one of them leaving represent a problem? Assuming 7 is correct, that makes the posting of that picture one of the most misleading things I've seen on here recently. Pretty shameful to use it as a point maker. I thought that level of communication was restricted to the realm of recent partisan politics. The point is not who graduated but who would still be on this team, namely: Walker, Carter, Akinjo, Leblanc, and McClung and, depending on how you slice it, a fifth year for Yurtseven. This is a much deeper team with a starting lineup of Akinjo, McClung, Walker, LeBlanc, and Yurtseven, with Pickett, Blair, Terrence Williams, and Wahab off the bench. Of course, it didn't happen. But if everyone returns in 21-22 that is supposed to, plus Beard, Riley, Mutombo and Billingsley, there's a lot of promise, but not if Ewing is refilling half the roster every summer. Ewing has signed 32 players in just four years.
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TC
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Post by TC on Nov 30, 2020 22:32:32 GMT -5
As hoopsmccan pointed out, Nationwide Nolan (+ alleninxis ) was saying something similar in the off-season which I agreed with. I think some people assumed purely based on the ranking and the number of stars next to his name that Sibley was going to have an instant impact. But if you really followed, he missed a lot of time last season and his ranking is probably based more on his length and athleticism than it is on actual basketball ability. He's got great potential, but he's definitely behind the two seniors and very possibly behind the other two freshman forwards in terms of actual basketball skill right now. From what Ewing said, I doubt this is about skill.
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tashoya
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Post by tashoya on Nov 30, 2020 23:01:29 GMT -5
Or he’ll pick somewhere else to play. Make what you want about Ewing's coaching ability, but minutes have never been hard to come by for players who've earned it during his era. I'm in this camp as well. Regardless of ranking coming out of HS, if Jamari isn't yet ready to contribute in Patrick's estimation, I tend to trust Patrick's assessment. For those up in arms about top 100 kids not wanting to sit, I get your point. That said, other kids that got plenty of minutes and just didn't do quite as well as they'd like to have done for whatever reason, have also transferred. Such is life in 2020 CBB. If Jamari played and got roasted or put up horrible numbers, is that worse than sitting? Maybe. Either way, when he earns the minutes, I'm sure he'll play. What he does with those minutes have a lot to do with him.
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tashoya
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Post by tashoya on Nov 30, 2020 23:11:47 GMT -5
et at least 7 of them being seniors who graduated: Mourning, Yurtseven, Johnson, Muresan, Govan, Malinowski, Mosley. How does any one of them leaving represent a problem? Assuming 7 is correct, that makes the posting of that picture one of the most misleading things I've seen on here recently. Pretty shameful to use it as a point maker. I thought that level of communication was restricted to the realm of recent partisan politics. The point is not who graduated but who would still be on this team, namely: Walker, Carter, Akinjo, Leblanc, and McClung and, depending on how you slice it, a fifth year for Yurtseven. This is a much deeper team with a starting lineup of Akinjo, McClung, Walker, LeBlanc, and Yurtseven, with Pickett, Blair, Terrence Williams, and Wahab off the bench. Of course, it didn't happen. But if everyone returns in 21-22 that is supposed to, plus Beard, Riley, Mutombo and Billingsley, there's a lot of promise, but not if Ewing is refilling half the roster every summer. Ewing has signed 32 players in just four years. I will miss LeBlanc. I'll do my best to wish Mac and Akinjo well as, sometimes, the fit just isn't good. That said, I didn't like how either of them left taking very little in the way of personal responsibility. Akinjo, apparently, thought he was better than he was. Being from the same area as and friendly with Dame doesn't make one Dame. In Akinjo's case, not remotely close. Sure, he's got time to improve. But, he'll never be the athlete Dame is and that's not going to improve. Seems to me that James bought a little too much of his own hype. I do think he can become an excellent facilitator. And, maybe he will. But, he seemed to want to be more than that. He wanted to be option 1. He's not that guy. At least not yet. He had all of the latitude and leeway to do what he wanted but still wasn't happy nor was his family. Fine. Happy trails, James. With regard to Mac, if you're not fitting in with, basically, your entire team, maybe the problem isn't the team. I don't know that to be the case but I've never been on a team on which I wasn't close with most of the guys as a result of being a part of that team. If Mac wasn't feeling the "family" part so much, maybe he should point/click/ship a mirror and have a look. Regardless, he wasn't happy with playing the whole game, being allowed to take horrible shots, and playing sub-par defense. Of course he made some big shots and some great plays. He's very athletic. That said, he's not yet all that impressive a basketball player. Maybe finding out that, at his size, athleticism is only going to get him so far made him sour on his experience. I haven't a clue but I certainly didn't see any major jump in his fundamentals or his skills sophomore year. Oh, well. Loss of depth? Yes. Loss of an offensive option? Yes. Loss in the scheme of things? I tend to think maybe somewhat less than is being portrayed here.
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zxhoya
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Post by zxhoya on Dec 1, 2020 1:02:12 GMT -5
When watching video of Sibley in high school, his athleticism and skill-set excite me but there was one aspect of his game that really concerned me and that was his Defense. With his length and jumping ability he was often flat-footed as players, no matter their size, would easily get shots off against him especially at the rim.
Most high school players don't exert maximum effort on the defensive end but you assume that once they arrive at the next level it's not really an option and they give better effort with differing degrees of success.
Hopefully this is the type of issue for Sibley, a issue that can be corrected with the proper motivation and training, generally playing time is a good motivator.
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MCIGuy
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Anyone here? What am I supposed to update?
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Post by MCIGuy on Dec 1, 2020 3:42:26 GMT -5
If we are blowing out an opposing team and he still isn't getting minutes then we should start worrying.
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Post by centercourt400s on Dec 1, 2020 9:04:56 GMT -5
et at least 7 of them being seniors who graduated: Mourning, Yurtseven, Johnson, Muresan, Govan, Malinowski, Mosley. How does any one of them leaving represent a problem? Assuming 7 is correct, that makes the posting of that picture one of the most misleading things I've seen on here recently. Pretty shameful to use it as a point maker. I thought that level of communication was restricted to the realm of recent partisan politics. The point is not who graduated but who would still be on this team, namely: Walker, Carter, Akinjo, Leblanc, and McClung and, depending on how you slice it, a fifth year for Yurtseven. This is a much deeper team with a starting lineup of Akinjo, McClung, Walker, LeBlanc, and Yurtseven, with Pickett, Blair, Terrence Williams, and Wahab off the bench. Of course, it didn't happen. But if everyone returns in 21-22 that is supposed to, plus Beard, Riley, Mutombo and Billingsley, there's a lot of promise, but not if Ewing is refilling half the roster every summer. Ewing has signed 32 players in just four years. If you want to make that point then repost the picture with highlighting showing those who you feel should still be on the team. It probably won't happen because that isn't a picture that jumps out at you. The truth can comparatively mundane, unfortunately. The picture, as you posted it, is very misleading.
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TC
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Post by TC on Dec 1, 2020 10:33:47 GMT -5
If we are blowing out an opposing team and he still isn't getting minutes then we should start worrying. This is going to sound snarky, but it's not intended as such - this really should be "if we are getting blown out by an opposing team and he still isn't getting minutes we should start worrying." This team isn't going to blow anyone out. I don't think it's a great sign that he's sitting after his summer camp coach bragged about benching him on Twitter this summer for not playing hard, but who knows, maybe this is just a bump in the road.
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Dec 1, 2020 11:38:19 GMT -5
Half of those we lost to graduation....pretty standard if you’re not intentionally trying to be a Debbie downer. You can pick a two year recent stretch from many programs where this is true. But Ewing is rebuilding a program. From what I have heard he was happy to let a few of those guys go. So the turnover has been in part strategic too. The most talented players (mackinjo) left for reasons out of Ewing’s control and quite frankly the backcourt wasn’t doing what Ewing wanted them to do so it wasn’t a perfect fit and he’s still looking for his players. You act like we’re losing great players, when in reality Ewing is rotating through bodies to find his guys. Sure it’s not a great environment for every amateur athlete, but it sure seems competitive. Which aims at winning. So what you’re complaining about is cosmetic, the staff has shown they’ll look under any stone if they think it’ll improve our chances to win. Lost in the focus on who graduated from the photo is the fact that it's incredibly abnormal to lose 5 players to transfer in one season (whether those are fully voluntary or otherwise because of outside circumstances). Yes, transfers are normal in this day and age, but the type of turnover we have seen under Ewing thus far is anything but normal. And, frankly, if this was happening at Syracuse or Maryland, Georgetown fans would be mocking them and their coach. The idea that "the turnover has been in part strategic" is laughable. EWING brought in all these guys who transferred. He recruited them. This is his team. Was part of his strategy to recruit 5 players who would then transfer? Saying the most talented players left "left for reasons out of Ewing’s control" is nothing but making excuses. Ewing is the head coach and CEO of the program. It's his responsibility to recruit and put together a roster that is going to play hard, and you know...stay enrolled at our university. And, thus far, his record on this has not been stellar. Ewing is not "rotating through bodies." Say what you will, but the "bodies" we have this year simply aren't as talented as the ones he had 2 years ago, or even starting last season before all the transfers happened. And the staff is looking under "stones" because we had 5 guys returning after all the transfers, and Ewing and the staff needed to scramble to put a team together. So no, this is not just a set of "cosmetic" complaints. It's early and who knows what will happen this year, but I am sick of the water carrying for the program and its leadership, when there have been real problems in the past, which need to be addressed if they continue. Frankly, if this was any other program, with a coach who wasn't a Georgetown legend, the hot seat would be extremely warm.
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Post by professorhoya on Dec 1, 2020 11:42:55 GMT -5
Half of those we lost to graduation....pretty standard if you’re not intentionally trying to be a Debbie downer. You can pick a two year recent stretch from many programs where this is true. But Ewing is rebuilding a program. From what I have heard he was happy to let a few of those guys go. So the turnover has been in part strategic too. The most talented players (mackinjo) left for reasons out of Ewing’s control and quite frankly the backcourt wasn’t doing what Ewing wanted them to do so it wasn’t a perfect fit and he’s still looking for his players. You act like we’re losing great players, when in reality Ewing is rotating through bodies to find his guys. Sure it’s not a great environment for every amateur athlete, but it sure seems competitive. Which aims at winning. So what you’re complaining about is cosmetic, the staff has shown they’ll look under any stone if they think it’ll improve our chances to win. Lost in the focus on who graduated from the photo is the fact that it's incredibly abnormal to lose 5 players to transfer in one season (whether those are fully voluntary or otherwise because of outside circumstances). Yes, transfers are normal in this day and age, but the type of turnover we have seen under Ewing thus far is anything but normal. And, frankly, if this was happening at Syracuse or Maryland, Georgetown fans would be mocking them and their coach. The idea that "the turnover has been in part strategic" is laughable. EWING brought in all these guys who transferred. He recruited them. This is his team. Was part of his strategy to recruit 5 players who would then transfer? Saying the most talented players left "left for reasons out of Ewing’s control" is nothing but making excuses. Ewing is the head coach and CEO of the program. It's his responsibility to recruit and put together a roster that is going to play hard, and you know...stay enrolled at our university. And, thus far, his record on this has not been stellar. Ewing is not "rotating through bodies." Say what you will, but the "bodies" we have this year simply aren't as talented as the ones he had 2 years ago, or even starting last season before all the transfers happened. And the staff is looking under "stones" because we had 5 guys returning after all the transfers, and Ewing and the staff needed to scramble to put a team together. So no, this is not just a set of "cosmetic" complaints. It's early and who knows what will happen this year, but I am sick of the water carrying for the program and its leadership, when there have been real problems in the past, which need to be addressed if they continue. Frankly, if this was any other program, with a coach who wasn't a Georgetown legend, the hot seat would be extremely warm. Let's be real though. The transfers happened because of an incident that involved 3 of the players and 4 of those players hung out together. That's basically why they all left, let's not pretend otherwise. And instead of letting the legal process work itself out, some bozos leaked the info and made those kids lives miserable on campus.
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