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Post by nyhoya2 on Mar 5, 2017 10:54:21 GMT -5
An embarrassing day on and off the court. The in stands confrontation will absolutely sting this program at the ticket booth and only reinforce the need for change.
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Post by strummer8526 on Mar 5, 2017 11:06:36 GMT -5
Is anyone over the age of 30 really, genuinely, seriously troubled by Mr. Hadar's story? Let's please keep in mind that Mr. Hadar is of the #StopBullying generation, so I'm sure this obviously hyperbolic, schoolyard-type "threat" from Tyler Crawford came as a real blow to Mr. Hadar's and his friends' self-esteem. But at the end of the day, if you are big and tough enough to scream insults about someone in an open basketball arena,* while sitting directly behind your target's father, you should be big and tough enough to handle the resulting (borderline inevitable) altercation with your target's supporters. You should be big and tough enough to defend yourself and your position without resorting to a security escort from the building—a response that ranks among the wimpiest I can imagine under these circumstances. You should also have the common sense to know that: (a) your words and actions were going to provoke contrary words and reactions, and (b) the oh-so-dangerous guy who made this threat is not going to really cause you some grave physical harm in the middle of an arena with 10,000+ people or on the jam-packed DC sidewalks as you leave the game. Bottom line: if you're going to pretend you have a spine one minute, I have little sympathy when you turn into a puddle of fear the next.
* To be clear, calling for III to be fired is insulting. I may agree with that insult. If I were at the game, I would have been grumbling loudly about the ways in which the program is a mess. But I would not have seated myself in the front row—directly behind III's well-known and highly-visible father—then "reared back, turned my head to the rafters and shouted. 'Fi-re Thomp-son! {clap clap clap clap clap} Fi-re Thomp-son! {clap clap clap clap clap},'” as Mr. Hadar says he did. Had I done such a thing, it would have come as no surprise whatsoever to hear someone say, "Shut up, or I'll kick your ass." Frankly, I would be surprised NOT to hear such a response.
Also, I can say from experience that a real Georgetown fan would probably have thought it was kinda cool (or at least funny) to get threatened by a former player. He also could have just taken the opportunity to strike up a conversation. A simple, "Sorry man. I just really care about this team. I've been to every game for four years, and it's been so frustrating. I just want to see things get better. ::extend hand::" would probably have landed him a selfie with Tyler Crawford. Not that he'd care, given that he didn't even recognize a former player, despite being self-proclaimed superfan #1, petition-writer, at every game, sitting front row, buddy-buddy with Verizon staff, and all the other things that apparently entitle him to insult someone without repercussion.
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FLHoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Proud Member of Generation Burton
Posts: 4,544
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Post by FLHoya on Mar 5, 2017 11:14:15 GMT -5
I keep coming back to this. At what point does the President, the AD, the Coach, the SID's office, anybody take a look around and ask "Is this what we want our program to be?"
Yesterday was about as complete a failure as you could imagine in every aspect of Georgetown's basketball program: on the court, in the stands, and in the media.
Whichever way the decision about the Coaching position goes, one would hope there is some serious soul-searching to be done across the board after what happened this weekend.
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Bigs"R"Us
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,642
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Post by Bigs"R"Us on Mar 5, 2017 11:20:13 GMT -5
I completely disagree. There is a difference between voicing your opinion and threatening physical harm. There is a difference between being a GU student and being an adult/former player. Espcially, when the player was sitting with former coach and father of current coach. This is the same us against the world mentality, but now the students are the enemy. The basketball program is not bigger than the school.
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Bigs"R"Us
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,642
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Post by Bigs"R"Us on Mar 5, 2017 11:23:18 GMT -5
My guess is that the President and AD are afraid of JT2 themselves. It certainly appears that way. The tail wags the dog.
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Mar 5, 2017 11:38:35 GMT -5
I completely disagree. There is a difference between voicing your opinion and threatening physical harm. There is a difference between being a GU student and being an adult/former player. Espcially, when the player was sitting with former coach and father of current coach. This is the same us against the world mentality, but now the students are the enemy. The basketball program is not bigger than the school. Classless move to sit right behind someone's father and scream for the son to be fired. The fact that the kid tries to suggest, with nothing but total speculation, that dad told someone to threaten him, tells me the student had an agenda. But yeah, maybe tell him to have enough respect to go elsewhere to do his screaming. Threatening him, even if it was just an empty street threat, is wrong x 10.
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Post by strummer8526 on Mar 5, 2017 11:40:50 GMT -5
I completely disagree. There is a difference between voicing your opinion and threatening physical harm. There is a difference between being a GU student and being an adult/former player. Espcially, when the player was sitting with former coach and father of current coach. This is the same us against the world mentality, but now the students are the enemy. The basketball program is not bigger than the school. Classless move to sit right behind someone's father and scream for the son to be fired. The fact that the kid tries to suggest, with nothing but total spevulation, that dad told someone to threaten him, tells me the student had an agenda. But yeah, tmaybe tell him to have enough respect to go elsewhere to do his screaming. Threatening him, even if it was just an empty street threat, is wrong x 10. Just to be clear, I agree it's wrong. But it's the kind of wrong that you shrug off and laugh about with your buddies. It's not a wrong you report to venue security and then write a hand-wringing blog post about.
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Bigs"R"Us
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,642
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Post by Bigs"R"Us on Mar 5, 2017 13:44:31 GMT -5
Students should not be threatened in the student section of a game. Crawford is not a student, but a 30 year old man. He should think about the consequences of his actions. Perhaps, he felt emboldened.
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Post by professorhoya on Mar 5, 2017 13:56:03 GMT -5
Basically we waved the white flag when we put Reggie Cameron in the game. He was a turnover machine.
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njhoya78
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 7,780
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Post by njhoya78 on Mar 5, 2017 14:17:46 GMT -5
Plus/minus for Saturday's game, as calculated from the play-by-play at guhoyas.com:
Johnson -3, Peak -3, Campbell -6, Agau -7, Mulmore -8, Hayes -10, Derrickson -15, Cameron -16, Govan -18, Mosely -20, Pryor -24, Hines DNP/coach's decision, Mourning DNP/coach's decision, Muresan DNP/coach's decision.
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Mar 5, 2017 14:37:27 GMT -5
Basically we waved the white flag when we put Reggie Cameron in the game. He was a turnover machine. "Waved the white flag" is a little exaggerated. He did have some terrible turnovers yesterday, but he is usually more careful with the ball. LJ had fouled himself onto the bench, and Marcus was unproductive on both ends. Reggie's gave us something on offense, although he then gave it right back.
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Buckets
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,656
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Post by Buckets on Mar 5, 2017 17:35:15 GMT -5
Is anyone over the age of 30 really, genuinely, seriously troubled by Mr. Hadar's story? Let's please keep in mind that Mr. Hadar is of the #StopBullying generation, so I'm sure this obviously hyperbolic, schoolyard-type "threat" from Tyler Crawford came as a real blow to Mr. Hadar's and his friends' self-esteem. But at the end of the day, if you are big and tough enough to scream insults about someone in an open basketball arena,* while sitting directly behind your target's father, you should be big and tough enough to handle the resulting (borderline inevitable) altercation with your target's supporters. You should be big and tough enough to defend yourself and your position without resorting to a security escort from the building—a response that ranks among the wimpiest I can imagine under these circumstances. You should also have the common sense to know that: (a) your words and actions were going to provoke contrary words and reactions, and (b) the oh-so-dangerous guy who made this threat is not going to really cause you some grave physical harm in the middle of an arena with 10,000+ people or on the jam-packed DC sidewalks as you leave the game. Bottom line: if you're going to pretend you have a spine one minute, I have little sympathy when you turn into a puddle of fear the next. * To be clear, calling for III to be fired is insulting. I may agree with that insult. If I were at the game, I would have been grumbling loudly about the ways in which the program is a mess. But I would not have seated myself in the front row—directly behind III's well-known and highly-visible father—then "reared back, turned my head to the rafters and shouted. 'Fi-re Thomp-son! {clap clap clap clap clap} Fi-re Thomp-son! {clap clap clap clap clap},'” as Mr. Hadar says he did. Had I done such a thing, it would have come as no surprise whatsoever to hear someone say, "Shut up, or I'll kick your ass." Frankly, I would be surprised NOT to hear such a response. Also, I can say from experience that a real Georgetown fan would probably have thought it was kinda cool (or at least funny) to get threatened by a former player. He also could have just taken the opportunity to strike up a conversation. A simple, "Sorry man. I just really care about this team. I've been to every game for four years, and it's been so frustrating. I just want to see things get better. ::extend hand::" would probably have landed him a selfie with Tyler Crawford. Not that he'd care, given that he didn't even recognize a former player, despite being self-proclaimed superfan #1, petition-writer, at every game, sitting front row, buddy-buddy with Verizon staff, and all the other things that apparently entitle him to insult someone without repercussion. It's funny that this got turned into "lol Millenials" about Hadar, when the reason this is a story is that there's a 75-year-old helicopter parent making sure nobody says mean stuff about his 50-year-old grown-ass son.
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Mar 5, 2017 19:37:16 GMT -5
You could have made a better point if you did not rely on rank speculation.
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joey0403p
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,586
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Post by joey0403p on Mar 5, 2017 20:00:54 GMT -5
Is anyone over the age of 30 really, genuinely, seriously troubled by Mr. Hadar's story? Let's please keep in mind that Mr. Hadar is of the #StopBullying generation, so I'm sure this obviously hyperbolic, schoolyard-type "threat" from Tyler Crawford came as a real blow to Mr. Hadar's and his friends' self-esteem. But at the end of the day, if you are big and tough enough to scream insults about someone in an open basketball arena,* while sitting directly behind your target's father, you should be big and tough enough to handle the resulting (borderline inevitable) altercation with your target's supporters. You should be big and tough enough to defend yourself and your position without resorting to a security escort from the building—a response that ranks among the wimpiest I can imagine under these circumstances. You should also have the common sense to know that: (a) your words and actions were going to provoke contrary words and reactions, and (b) the oh-so-dangerous guy who made this threat is not going to really cause you some grave physical harm in the middle of an arena with 10,000+ people or on the jam-packed DC sidewalks as you leave the game. Bottom line: if you're going to pretend you have a spine one minute, I have little sympathy when you turn into a puddle of fear the next. * To be clear, calling for III to be fired is insulting. I may agree with that insult. If I were at the game, I would have been grumbling loudly about the ways in which the program is a mess. But I would not have seated myself in the front row—directly behind III's well-known and highly-visible father—then "reared back, turned my head to the rafters and shouted. 'Fi-re Thomp-son! {clap clap clap clap clap} Fi-re Thomp-son! {clap clap clap clap clap},'” as Mr. Hadar says he did. Had I done such a thing, it would have come as no surprise whatsoever to hear someone say, "Shut up, or I'll kick your ass." Frankly, I would be surprised NOT to hear such a response. Also, I can say from experience that a real Georgetown fan would probably have thought it was kinda cool (or at least funny) to get threatened by a former player. He also could have just taken the opportunity to strike up a conversation. A simple, "Sorry man. I just really care about this team. I've been to every game for four years, and it's been so frustrating. I just want to see things get better. ::extend hand::" would probably have landed him a selfie with Tyler Crawford. Not that he'd care, given that he didn't even recognize a former player, despite being self-proclaimed superfan #1, petition-writer, at every game, sitting front row, buddy-buddy with Verizon staff, and all the other things that apparently entitle him to insult someone without repercussion. It's funny that this got turned into "lol Millenials" about Hadar, when the reason this is a story is that there's a 75-year-old helicopter parent making sure nobody says mean stuff about his 50-year-old grown-ass son. I think it is really disgusting to attack Roey (21 year old). You can think this is a big deal or not a big deal. That is completely everyone's right. I consider myself a "real" fan, and I would not have thought it "cool" had that happened to me. I'm on the something needs to change bandwagon - but I don't know I would have chanted it at the game. But I also wouldn't begrudge someone for doing so.
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Mar 5, 2017 20:06:27 GMT -5
Wait, he was attacked? I didn't see that.
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joey0403p
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,586
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Post by joey0403p on Mar 5, 2017 20:12:08 GMT -5
Strummers post
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hoyajinx
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,377
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Post by hoyajinx on Mar 5, 2017 20:26:22 GMT -5
In the 1999-2000 season, I was in the lower right hand corner of the student section where the visitors and refs came out. I was just talking crap to Jim Burr the entire game cause I really didn't and still don't like him (and because Connecticut was blowing us out). At the end of the game, as he was running into the locker room he paused, pointed a finger in my face and said "Go Edited yourself" and then continued on his way. I could not have been happier. I know it's not even close to the same situation as this, but, as a fan, I thoroughly enjoyed it.
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Post by strummer8526 on Mar 5, 2017 21:28:32 GMT -5
It's funny that this got turned into "lol Millenials" about Hadar, when the reason this is a story is that there's a 75-year-old helicopter parent making sure nobody says mean stuff about his 50-year-old grown-ass son. I think it is really disgusting to attack Roey (21 year old). You can think this is a big deal or not a big deal. That is completely everyone's right. I consider myself a "real" fan, and I would not have thought it "cool" had that happened to me. I'm on the something needs to change bandwagon - but I don't know I would have chanted it at the game. But I also wouldn't begrudge someone for doing so. You're obviously not alone. The prevailing view in HoyaLand appears to be that saying "I'll kick your ass" to Mr. Hadar is a reprehensible offense that needs to be addressed with the utmost seriousness. Mr. Hadar is a 21-year-old man who has chosen to make himself very visible to Hoya fans, alums, players, bloggers, and now the national media. That's his right, and I appreciate his engagement with the team through his college career. But once again, actions have consequences. If you yell "Fire Thompson" while sitting in the front row of the student section, right behind former Thompson players and Thompson's dad, odds are decent that someone will have unkind words for you. If you then decide to respond to a stupid "threat" from a former player like it was actually serious or important news, then odds are decent that someone will respond by suggesting you have erred in your handling of the situation. I think he handled this wrong, plain and simple. And I think that at 21 years old and as a graduating senior, not to mention someone who has drawn significant attention to himself this entire season, he should be able to handle the fact that not everyone agrees with what he has done here. Also, I'm not one who believes in forcing people to be silent or to keep issues "in house" to avoid PR problems. But the fact that this "#1 fan" jumped on Twitter as soon as this happened sort of suggests to me that he cares more about telling his story than about the program or the University as a whole. If this incident really had to be reported to anyone (and I don't think it did), why not take it up with the Athletic Department first? Then higher in the University administration. And if still no response, then maybe you run off on social media or go to CasualHoya. Did this have to become an instant ESPN story? If Mr. Hadar is our student superfan, we obviously don't need opposing teams' fans to drag us through the mud; we'll just do it to ourselves.
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madgesiq92
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,400
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Post by madgesiq92 on Mar 5, 2017 21:48:58 GMT -5
I think it is really disgusting to attack Roey (21 year old). You can think this is a big deal or not a big deal. That is completely everyone's right. I consider myself a "real" fan, and I would not have thought it "cool" had that happened to me. I'm on the something needs to change bandwagon - but I don't know I would have chanted it at the game. But I also wouldn't begrudge someone for doing so. You're obviously not alone. The prevailing view in HoyaLand appears to be that saying "I'll kick your ass" to Mr. Hadar is a reprehensible offense that needs to be addressed with the utmost seriousness. Mr. Hadar is a 21-year-old man who has chosen to make himself very visible to Hoya fans, alums, players, bloggers, and now the national media. That's his right, and I appreciate his engagement with the team through his college career. But once again, actions have consequences. If you yell "Fire Thompson" while sitting in the front row of the student section, right behind former Thompson players and Thompson's dad, odds are decent that someone will have unkind words for you. If you then decide to respond to a stupid "threat" from a former player like it was actually serious or important news, then odds are decent that someone will respond by suggesting you have erred in your handling of the situation. I think he handled this wrong, plain and simple. And I think that at 21 years old and as a graduating senior, not to mention someone who has drawn significant attention to himself this entire season, he should be able to handle the fact that not everyone agrees with what he has done here. Also, I'm not one who believes in forcing people to be silent or to keep issues "in house" to avoid PR problems. But the fact that this "#1 fan" jumped on Twitter as soon as this happened sort of suggests to me that he cares more about telling his story than about the program or the University as a whole. If this incident really had to be reported to anyone (and I don't think it did), why not take it up with the Athletic Department first? Then higher in the University administration. And if still no response, then maybe you run off on social media or go to CasualHoya. Did this have to become an instant ESPN story? If Mr. Hadar is our student superfan, we obviously don't need opposing teams' fans to drag us through the mud; we'll just do it to ourselves. I completely agree with your take on this.
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eagle54
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,471
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Post by eagle54 on Mar 5, 2017 21:51:27 GMT -5
I think it is really disgusting to attack Roey (21 year old). You can think this is a big deal or not a big deal. That is completely everyone's right. I consider myself a "real" fan, and I would not have thought it "cool" had that happened to me. I'm on the something needs to change bandwagon - but I don't know I would have chanted it at the game. But I also wouldn't begrudge someone for doing so. You're obviously not alone. The prevailing view in HoyaLand appears to be that saying "I'll kick your ass" to Mr. Hadar is a reprehensible offense that needs to be addressed with the utmost seriousness. Mr. Hadar is a 21-year-old man who has chosen to make himself very visible to Hoya fans, alums, players, bloggers, and now the national media. That's his right, and I appreciate his engagement with the team through his college career. But once again, actions have consequences. If you yell "Fire Thompson" while sitting in the front row of the student section, right behind former Thompson players and Thompson's dad, odds are decent that someone will have unkind words for you. If you then decide to respond to a stupid "threat" from a former player like it was actually serious or important news, then odds are decent that someone will respond by suggesting you have erred in your handling of the situation. I think he handled this wrong, plain and simple. And I think that at 21 years old and as a graduating senior, not to mention someone who has drawn significant attention to himself this entire season, he should be able to handle the fact that not everyone agrees with what he has done here. Also, I'm not one who believes in forcing people to be silent or to keep issues "in house" to avoid PR problems. But the fact that this "#1 fan" jumped on Twitter as soon as this happened sort of suggests to me that he cares more about telling his story than about the program or the University as a whole. If this incident really had to be reported to anyone (and I don't think it did), why not take it up with the Athletic Department first? Then higher in the University administration. And if still no response, then maybe you run off on social media or go to CasualHoya. Did this have to become an instant ESPN story? If Mr. Hadar is our student superfan, we obviously don't need opposing teams' fans to drag us through the mud; we'll just do it to ourselves. I'm not a fan of the current coach staying on with his performance over many years but have largely stayed quiet on that and let the board sort it out. However, if you are going to put yourself out there as this student did you should expect some consequences especially if you want to be that visible in doing so (i.e., starting a petition, sitting front row by JT2, etc.). This kid looks to be more about his own promotion then anything else and to run to social media to put this out there just shows that. I think he got the reaction he wanted and was able to turn that into his 15 minutes. However, let's not forget Crawford's baggage as quoted on this board - hoyatalk2.proboards.com/post/404304.
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