jwp91
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Post by jwp91 on May 7, 2017 20:30:03 GMT -5
I've got 3 theories: Theory #1- "The Duke Theory" is he is waiting to see the smoke clear with Frank Jackson and Trevon Duval's eligibility figuring he's the next PG for them if Dukes initial plans fall through. I see Waters as alpha dog and not someone being cool with being a backup option but who knows these days. Theory #2- "The Ewing Theory" is he is giving Ewing ample time to fill the roster and staff. When Ewing visited the Waters family in early April, the Hoyas had 7 scholarship players signed and confirmed. If you're a top level prospect who's not being shy about his NBA ambitions, it would be very difficult to just commit to a roster of 7 scholarship players with a first time head coach (even though Ewing is not your typical 1st time Head Coach) and no idea who the assistants are going to be. Since that time, Hoyas have added Blair, Walker (reaffirmed), Tre Campbell is possibly/supposedly injured and possibly lost for an extended period, Agau officially transferred and now we have added Dickerson. The Dickerson addition only makes sense to me if Campbell's supposed injury keeps him off the court next season. Waters has been extremely quiet and hasn't taken any kind of visits to any of the schools where hi name keeps popping up. Outside of the Jordan game, there hasn't been any sound or action. I'm hoping Ewing and Waters have remained in contact and Waters will join the fold as Ewing rounds out the roster. Theory #3- "The Ship Has Sailed Theory". Ewing gave Waters ample time to makeup his mind but the Waters clan has other ideas. If that's the case it looks like the Waters clan overplayed their hand a bit as the Kansas, Dukes and to a lesser extent Syracuse haven't made him a priority. To me Western Kentucky makes 0 sense. Robinson is possibly a 1 & done because he's a Big in what is expected to be a weaker draft next season but that is also contingent on how much he dominates the FIU, FAU's, Rice, Marshall, Old Dominion and other Conference USA opponents. Waters needs the opposite. He is more than likely a multiple year college player Who needs to prove he can play at high level against very good competition night in night out. He won't get that in Conference USA, a 1 bid league. What happens if they get upset in their conference tournament? Let's say Waters did go to Western Kentucky and they make the NCAA tournament round of 32. Robinson is gone and along with him will be Stansbury to the first High Major that shows him the love and the money. That leaves Waters either staying at Western Kentucky by himself or transferring and having to sit out. Makes ZERO sense! Please, Theory 2.....................I don't know about what Mr. Dickerson brings to the table but with Tremont I believe the Hoyas are a tourney team Theory #2 scares me a bit. This is the move of a follower and not a leader. If Tremont had committed when Ewing visited, other recruits would have fallen in line.
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s4hoyas
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Post by s4hoyas on May 7, 2017 21:51:32 GMT -5
I disagree...I think it only makes sense under #2 that he would want to see what kind of parts Coach Ewing could assemble that would insure he's being asked to lead a competitive team...in other words, give it a little time to see who's coming and who's going...
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Hoyas4Ever
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Post by Hoyas4Ever on May 7, 2017 23:05:57 GMT -5
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Hoyas4Ever
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Post by Hoyas4Ever on May 7, 2017 23:32:33 GMT -5
Please, Theory 2.....................I don't know about what Mr. Dickerson brings to the table but with Tremont I believe the Hoyas are a tourney team Theory #2 scares me a bit. This is the move of a follower and not a leader. If Tremont had committed when Ewing visited, other recruits would have fallen in line. It's a different world now. Lebron James gave these kids permission to be followers. Very few True Alpha Dogs left. No disrespect to these kids its just the way things are now. Here's where the player Ewing who would have never joined a super team and the coach Ewing that is dealing with high level prospects who think that the mentality of jumping on board what they think is a ready made champion is the norm.
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justsaying
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Post by justsaying on May 8, 2017 10:22:18 GMT -5
Theory #2 scares me a bit. This is the move of a follower and not a leader. If Tremont had committed when Ewing visited, other recruits would have fallen in line. It's a different world now. Lebron James gave these kids permission to be followers. Very few True Alpha Dogs left. No disrespect to these kids its just the way things are now. Here's where the player Ewing who would have never joined a super team and the coach Ewing that is dealing with high level prospects who think that the mentality of jumping on board what they think is a ready made champion is the norm. And while that may be a good formula for the pros many times it is not a good formula for the still developing players at the college level. Having to split a fair amount of developing time among the many because of having the deep college roster (mind you many still need development) mean that someone of the fair talent will have to take a back seat. But when you are highly needed and highly dependent upon this will only help your development because of the varying situations, varying conditions and responsibilities you will have to face earlier and often. Guys who were not considered first rounders while in high school such as Stephen Curry, Damion Lillard, CJ McCollum, Kemba Walker, Tony Parker (early years), ... etc aided their development in an environment of high need not loaded team environments. Players like the Harrison twins where considered in high school as first round prospects slowed their development by having to share a lot of development time with others and are still at this time to a fair degree trying to catch up on that development in the pros. And watching thee NBA playoffs there are some young not well know players on some of these teams (from high need situations) that are becoming known and improving their lot. If you want that next level then college is about as much development time as possible and the more the better.
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seaweed
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Post by seaweed on May 8, 2017 11:36:53 GMT -5
Theory #4 - Patrick didn't like what he saw at their meeting and the kid no longer has a commitable offer.
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TC
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Post by TC on May 8, 2017 11:39:38 GMT -5
Theory #4 - Patrick didn't like what he saw at their meeting and the kid no longer has a commitable offer. That's the most insane theory I've heard yet. He's including us in his list of schools that he's still considering, and you think he's doing that without a committable offer? Also, he's by far the #1 target for us and easily the most talented player we're recruiting at any position. If he doesn't have a committable offer, Ewing's the wrong coach for the program.
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seaweed
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Post by seaweed on May 8, 2017 11:52:49 GMT -5
Theory #4 - Patrick didn't like what he saw at their meeting and the kid no longer has a commitable offer. That's the most insane theory I've heard yet. He's including us in his list of schools that he's still considering, and you think he's doing that without a committable offer? Also, he's by far the #1 target for us and easily the most talented player we're recruiting at any position. If he doesn't have a committable offer, Ewing's the wrong coach for the program. If you mean recruiting for 2017, maybe I agree he is the most talented prospect. But we have our eyes on better 18 and 19 prospects.
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bostonfan
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Post by bostonfan on May 8, 2017 11:59:57 GMT -5
Theory #4 - Patrick didn't like what he saw at their meeting and the kid no longer has a commitable offer. That's the most insane theory I've heard yet. He's including us in his list of schools that he's still considering, and you think he's doing that without a committable offer? Also, he's by far the #1 target for us and easily the most talented player we're recruiting at any position. If he doesn't have a committable offer, Ewing's the wrong coach for the program. I am sure he still has a commitable offer if he wants to come to Georgetown. The biggest question I have on him is what is his time table for a decision. I would think most freshman probably start training with their new college team some time in the summer, and start summer school, so you would think he needs to pick his school by the end of May so he knows where he is going to be this summer. I hope he becomes a Hoya, but it is hard to determine if the delay in making a decision is a good thing or not for the Hoyas.
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TC
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Post by TC on May 8, 2017 12:29:43 GMT -5
I must be the only one not bothered by the timeline. If he decides not to come, you have an extra scholarship at midyear to grab a high-potential transfer at midyear or have another to use for 2018. If we don't land Waters, we're probably not competing next year - keeping one scholarship back isn't going to kill us.
I doubt we have realistic chances at anyone in 2018 better than Waters at PG.
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hoyazeke
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Post by hoyazeke on May 8, 2017 12:44:48 GMT -5
Theory #4 - Patrick didn't like what he saw at their meeting and the kid no longer has a commitable offer. Blah......man you're funny.....y'all couldn't tell that seaweed was joking? Sarcasm meters need adjusting....smh
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OldHoyafan
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Post by OldHoyafan on May 8, 2017 12:58:18 GMT -5
I think the scenario that has him waiting to see if Duke takes Duval or not is probably the most viable one. The young man is very talented and when you listen to his initial interviews, where he talked about giving back to his dad and mom for all the prerequisite preparation and training to get him to this point, he is not simply talking about getting a degree. He is talking about making their lives better financially. He possibly sees himself as a "one and done" player like Irving from Duke. He probably does not see himself as a four year player that we all would like for him to be. Even with the talent that's at Georgetown from last year and the new commitments, next year will still be a rebuilding year. I hope I am wrong and he really does see himself as a four year player or at least a "two and done" player like Otto, where he leads the Hoyas back to the NCAA's.
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Post by centercourt400s on May 8, 2017 14:31:53 GMT -5
I'm really, really, really hoping that Tremont decided to re-commit. He looks like he would be a great player to build around and fits extremely well with what Ewing seems to want to do. And I doubt Tremont would find a better coach to guide him in a path to the NBA than Ewing.
That said, is there anyone who thinks that a 5'11, 165 lb guard has a serious chance to be a one and done? Unless his skills are absolutely transcendent, as a 19 or 20 year old at that size in the NBA, he would get eaten alive if he ever sees the court. If you want to look at a prominent undersized comp player, Isaiah Thomas comes to mind. He's been tearing up the league and even he needed three years at Washington until he was ready. Realistically I've got to think that Tremont is in school for two years minimum.
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OldHoyafan
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Post by OldHoyafan on May 8, 2017 15:28:43 GMT -5
I'm really, really, really hoping that Tremont decided to re-commit. He looks like he would be a great player to build around and fits extremely well with what Ewing seems to want to do. And I doubt Tremont would find a better coach to guide him in a path to the NBA than Ewing. That said, is there anyone who thinks that a 5'11, 165 lb guard has a serious chance to be a one and done? Unless his skills are absolutely transcendent, as a 19 or 20 year old at that size in the NBA, he would get eaten alive if he ever sees the court. If you want to look at a prominent undersized comp player, Isaiah Thomas comes to mind. He's been tearing up the league and even he needed three years at Washington until he was ready. Realistically I've got to think that Tremont is in school for two years minimum. It's not whether any of us believes that he can be a one and done. It's whether he believes that he can.
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Post by centercourt400s on May 8, 2017 16:30:04 GMT -5
You watch a couple of playoff games and it just reinforces the idea that the NBA is a rough and extremely highly skilled league. A 5'11 high school player watching the Celtics-Wizards series and thinking he can compete in that environment has got to be amazingly and crazily confident. I suppose that can be a good attribute for an athlete but it certainly doesn't seem terribly realistic.
I'll just leave it at: Treymont is an excellent player and he's going to be a great Hoya.
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hoyasaxa2003
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on May 8, 2017 16:31:38 GMT -5
You watch a couple of playoff games and it just reinforces the idea that the NBA is a rough and extremely highly skilled league. A 5'11 high school player watching the Celtics-Wizards series and thinking he can compete in that environment has got to be amazingly and crazily confident. I suppose that can be a good attribute for an athlete but it certainly doesn't seem terribly realistic. I'll just leave it at: Treymont is an excellent player and he's going to be a great Hoya. I agree but teenagers make dumb decisions based on dumb thoughts all the time. So Waters may very well think he's a one and done who is going to be playing in the NBA in 2 years.
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dense
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Post by dense on May 8, 2017 19:42:57 GMT -5
I'm really, really, really hoping that Tremont decided to re-commit. He looks like he would be a great player to build around and fits extremely well with what Ewing seems to want to do. And I doubt Tremont would find a better coach to guide him in a path to the NBA than Ewing. That said, is there anyone who thinks that a 5'11, 165 lb guard has a serious chance to be a one and done? Unless his skills are absolutely transcendent, as a 19 or 20 year old at that size in the NBA, he would get eaten alive if he ever sees the court. If you want to look at a prominent undersized comp player, Isaiah Thomas comes to mind. He's been tearing up the league and even he needed three years at Washington until he was ready. Realistically I've got to think that Tremont is in school for two years minimum. Isiah Thomas was not Isiah Thomas even then. that happened in the nba. he was a bench player his first 3 years.
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Post by hoya7581 on May 8, 2017 20:19:25 GMT -5
One of the greatest guards to come out of NYC, Sebastian Telfaiir, never made it big. He had all the skills coming out of high school but never devoloped anything more. He needed some college experience to step up his game. The same thing will happen to Waters if he doesn't spend some developing years in college
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Hoyas4Ever
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Post by Hoyas4Ever on May 8, 2017 21:14:22 GMT -5
It's a different world now. Lebron James gave these kids permission to be followers. Very few True Alpha Dogs left. No disrespect to these kids its just the way things are now. Here's where the player Ewing who would have never joined a super team and the coach Ewing that is dealing with high level prospects who think that the mentality of jumping on board what they think is a ready made champion is the norm. And while that may be a good formula for the pros many times it is not a good formula for the still developing players at the college level. Having to split a fair amount of developing time among the many because of having the deep college roster (mind you many still need development) mean that someone of the fair talent will have to take a back seat. But when you are highly needed and highly dependent upon this will only help your development because of the varying situations, varying conditions and responsibilities you will have to face earlier and often. Guys who were not considered first rounders while in high school such as Stephen Curry, Damion Lillard, CJ McCollum, Kemba Walker, Tony Parker (early years), ... etc aided their development in an environment of high need not loaded team environments. Players like the Harrison twins where considered in high school as first round prospects slowed their development by having to share a lot of development time with others and are still at this time to a fair degree trying to catch up on that development in the pros. And watching thee NBA playoffs there are some young not well know players on some of these teams (from high need situations) that are becoming known and improving their lot. If you want that next level then college is about as much development time as possible and the more the better. Agree with everything you stated but it still hasn't stopped these high school kids from trying to do it at the college level at a successful rate if getting to the league is the goal. What These kids, Coach Cal, Coack K and few others have figured out is that the idea is to trick these NBA GM's by showing them as little as possible about their skills and abilities to get drafted. That's why you see so many kids trying to play with each other. While I agree with your statement, these kids are just trying to get the NBA as soon as possible regardless if they are physically, mentally, or skill wise ready. They don't care about the 2nd contract and most GM's will just double down on their draft day mistakes by giving them a ridiculous 2nd contract after their rookie deals because you can't just give up on a 22-23 year old kid who hasn't even entered his prime. By the time the NBA realizes they can't play at that level or haven't developed, the players have pocketed between 30-100 million dollars. It really has become a Ponzi scheme for a lot of these top level prospects and college coaches. Especially Coach Cal who has no clue how to develop players. The longer they stay at Kentucky the more the their game flattens out. That's why he pushes them out the door after the 2nd year whether they are ready or not. Then Calipari will trick some GM usually with Phoenix or Sacramento to take his kids and that's why these teams are constantly in the lottery. Calipari is running the top Ponzi scheme in the country stealing 100's of millions of dollars from NBA organization in hopes of a Anthony Davis or Karl Anthony Towns but more times than not they end up with Michael Kidd-Giltrist. It will be a longtime if ever will you see a 1 & done rookie change a franchises outlook immediately or even their first 4 years. Look at the Timberwolves, they at 1 time had 3 overall number 1 picks along with multiple lottery picks in the last 4 years and can't get close to even sniffing the playoffs. If I owned an NBA team that was in purgatory, I would tell my GM trade all lottery picks for a proven veteran and a late 1st round pick and use that pick for a college grad who can at least physically contribute immediately.
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beenaround
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Post by beenaround on May 8, 2017 22:49:50 GMT -5
Not a big fan of Cal or his coaching. But cmon...some of the better players in the NBA played under him..Wall, Rose, Cousins, Davis, KAT, Cauley-Stein, Randle, Devin Booker, Bledsoe, Noel and more I am sureley forgetting.
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