EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Dec 15, 2014 0:42:46 GMT -5
As good as White has been, I can't buy an argument that he can deliver the same kind of defense and rebounding that Hop is currently providing. It's not about who is the better player, it's about how the pieces fit. I've been frustrated with Hopkins over the years, but this season he's really filling a need for us as a defensive and rebounding specialist. To me this isn't about White playing more in place of Hopkins, it's about Copeland getting more minutes.. When you total up the minutes played in the Bahamas + Kansas, Paul White is 2nd on the team to DSR @ 28.5 mpg.. This pretty much tells me that JT3 is going to play him 25+ mpg during the BE regular season which is a lot of minutes.. Copeland has avg'd 13.2 over those same 4 games, he's the one who needs to make the leap here imo, not Paul White.. The better Copeland plays the less we'll see Hop & Josh on the court together which I think will produce better overall results for the team.. Hopkins avg'd 26 mins per game over the same 4 games but when you look at his #'s they're very similar whether he plays 18 minutes or 25.. I'd like to see White start at the 4 and then have Cope improve enough to play 17+ per game playing the 4.. Have Hopkins back-up Josh at the 5 which will guarantee him at least 15 mpg there and then he can also get 4-5 minutes a night at the 4 when White slides to the 3 spot in certain line-ups.. Bottom line to me is the best line-ups do not include Josh and Hop in it together, the fastest way to get rid of those line-ups is for Cope to play better..
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2014 2:37:04 GMT -5
It's this sentiment I disagree with. Not something specific to Hopkins, but the idea that he's earned his minutes versus some standard of just being good. You earn your minutes by being better than the competition. I don't care how good a player is, if other players are better, they get the minutes. There seems to be this idea that Hopkins has put in his time, improved, and he's good on D, so he should play a ton regardless of the other options III has. If White or Copeland is playing better, they should play more. If Hayes suddenly outplays Hopkins and Smith, it doesn't matter how much Smith has worked to get back in shape, Hayes should get the majority of time. We'll just have to disagree. I'm not sure there's anything I can say to convince you, but I will note the number you introduced into the discussion says that Paul White is not too far off... and that Paul's offensive advantage over Hopkins is larger than his defensive disadvantage. Wait, what? Versus Wisconsin, Hopkins was 1-5, turned the ball over three times and committed five fouls. That was a one possession game late. You can argue that his defense overcomes his offensive issues, but can't deny that versus a league average player, Hopkins' offense (including his positives -- 2 assists and 2 o boards) cost us about 4 points versus a league average offensive player. League average -- not funnel the ball to a hot DSR or any one of our other players well above a 100 efficiency. That 4 points could be six. And even that's without accounting for the realization that so much of the bad shots and turnovers could have been avoided. He committed 5 fouls, too -- in a game where Whiskey shot 27 FTs. Versus Butler, Hopkins had a shockingly similar line: three turnovers, 1-5 shooting. And yes, he cost us about 4 points in that game, too. He also committed four fouls and Butler shot 21 FTs. And against Kansas, he had a much better statistical game: he had four assists and four offensive boards. Of course, he was also 1-5 on easy shots and I'm not sure how he only got credited with one TO. There's not much gap versus a league average there (and only maybe two points versus a hot hand). But his misses were still just terrible misses. Also, five fouls against a team that only stayed in the game in the first half by going to the line. So yeah, it's hard to pin the Kansas loss on Komrade's offense. But you're kidding yourself if you think Hopkins' offense wasn't a key contributor to the Wisconsin and Butler losses. I didn’t say he’s entitled to his minutes I said he’s earned his minutes. He’s done that by fulfilling his role. That role would be interior defense and rebounding. He leads the team in the areas he needs to be good in, those being Blocked Shots and Rebounds, and when it comes to the Freshman they’re not really close. Not too sure what metric your referring to but it’s definitely not rebounding or blocking shots.. Think losing Duje Dukan over and over had more to do with the Wisconsin loss than Hopkins going 1-5.. That being said, Would 2-5 be ok? And I’m pretty sure if we went over every players game with as much scrutiny as you have with Hopkins we could find 4 points they gave away. Bottom line for me is, we were in control of the game until the lapses defensively and the same thing could be said for Kansas. Hopkins wasn’t guarding either one of those guys. BTW in the Wisconsin game Ike and Paul combined for 31 minutes and 1 Rebound… The Butler game he didn’t play well but nobody else did either besides Ike and Paul. In that game he played 19 minutes. Ike played 26 and Paul played 31 so hard to say he cost us that game or stole minutes from the Freshman when they were 1-3 in minutes that game. BTW in that game in 51 minutes PW and Ike combined for 7 Boards.. Mike had 6 in 19 minutes. So in those 2 games combined Ike and Paul had 8 boards total in over 80 minutes of Gametime. That’s about 4 boards every 40 minutes. Hopkins gives u about 12 Boards per 40. Paul and Ike don’t have the physicality right now to rebound at a high clip and neither one is a rim protector. I really could care less about his offense he’s 12th on the team in Shots per 40. 9th out of the 10 players that see regular minutes, It’s not like he’s out there going for his. He’s doing exactly what 3 wants him to do, defend, rebound, and protect the rim. He’s been the best on the team in in 2 of those categories and up near the top in the other.. Team wise what do you think are our biggest weaknesses btw?
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rambis
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Post by rambis on Dec 15, 2014 7:50:45 GMT -5
I find it amazing that we're discussing Hopkins' defending and his role as a starter. Maybe it's the difference between watching on TV and seeing him live. In the Bahamas, the officials called it tight. Against Kansas, in the Fox Sports One marquee matchup of the year with Big East refs, we were allowed to foul unabated. Hopkins had two hands on Perry Ellis's back, with arms extended, pushing him out of the post on every play. That would be called a foul in almost any game. In Big East v. Big East play that would be a foul. In the entire JT3 era I can't remember a game where we got that kind of favorable officiating.
The Kansas game was not a sign of how good a defender Hopkins is. It was a sign of Hopkins' ceiling in a hardly officiated game. His aggressive shotblocking came from realization he was not being whistled for fouls. That accounts for his four blocks. But he was also over aggressive on help defense trying to block shots, often leaving his man unguarded for easy offensive rebounds and put backs. That's something the stats don't show.
Despite all that, we would have won the Kansas game were it not for the turnovers and bad shots. Not only did Hopkins turn the ball over three times in that game, he also got blocked in the post – on a hook shot no less.
I've seen a lot of discussion here about our freshman not being ready to defend. That's not what I see with Paul White. He moves his feet and stays in front of his man really well. He seldom reaches either. He's not getting blocks, but he's showing good fundamentals. Once he's more familiar with Big East refs, I suspect you'll see more aggressive post defense from him. It sucks that White doesn't rebound and I imagine that will come. But he is an elite talent putting points on the board, initiating the offense, and is one of our top ball handlers. White needs to start.
Hopkins' minutes should come from backing up Josh and Paul.
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Post by aleutianhoya on Dec 15, 2014 8:00:46 GMT -5
But you're kidding yourself if you think Hopkins' offense wasn't a key contributor to the Wisconsin and Butler losses. Team wise what do you think are our biggest weaknesses btw? Turnovers are a huge weakness. Hopkins has 75% more turnovers than White and Copeland combined even though White and Copeland have combined to play 50% more minutes. Look, I think he's been a very good rebounder this year. And I actually think his defense (to my eye) has been better overall than SF thinks it has been. But, to answer your question about Hopkins' offense against Wisconsin: yes, if the player playing in his spot had gone 2-5 instead of 1-5 and had turned it over 2 times instead of 3 times, we may well win that game. It was a one possession game late, so if you change the outcome of one negative possession, that may have had an impact. Rebounding is a big weakness too. And maybe taking Hopkins out against Wisconsin loses us points because the marginal rebounding and interior defense is worse, but I don't think it's a foolish discussion to have. The single best outcome here would be that we get competent defense and rebounding from someone with offensive ability at the four spot (in other words, a level of play in those areas maybe not as good as Hopkins' but at least not much worse), such that Hopkins' minutes at that position can be marginally reduced. He'd still get significant minutes at the five, as well as some minutes at the four. We're talking a 5 MPG reduction or so (from 24 to 20) with White and Copeland each getting another minute or two. Or, Hopkins (in the same minutes he gets now) takes fewer shots and turns it over less, so his offensive negatives aren't nearly as significant. Frankly, I'm fine with either. At the end of the day, all we're talking about here are ways this team can improve. And it's unquestionably true that one way it can improve is through increased offense at the 4 (or at least a decrease in negative offense). I don't think that's controversial.
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Post by aleutianhoya on Dec 15, 2014 8:05:55 GMT -5
I find it amazing that we're discussing Hopkins' defending and his role as a starter. Maybe it's the difference between watching on TV and seeing him live. In the Bahamas, the officials called it tight. Against Kansas, in the Fox Sports One marquee matchup of the year with Big East refs, we were allowed to foul unabated. Hopkins had two hands on Perry Ellis's back, with arms extended, pushing him out of the post on every play. That would be called a foul in almost any game. In Big East v. Big East play that would be a foul. In the entire JT3 era I can't remember a game where we got that kind of favorable officiating. The Kansas game was not a sign of how good a defender Hopkins is. It was a sign of Hopkins' ceiling in a hardly officiated game. His aggressive shotblocking came from realization he was not being whistled for fouls. That accounts for his four blocks. But he was also over aggressive on help defense trying to block shots, often leaving his man unguarded for easy offensive rebounds and put backs. That's something the stats don't show. Despite all that, we would have won the Kansas game were it not for the turnovers and bad shots. Not only did Hopkins turn the ball over three times in that game, he also got blocked in the post – on a hook shot no less. I've seen a lot of discussion here about our freshman not being ready to defend. That's not what I see with Paul White. He moves his feet and stays in front of his man really well. He seldom reaches either. He's not getting blocks, but he's showing good fundamentals. Once he's more familiar with Big East refs, I suspect you'll see more aggressive post defense from him. It sucks that White doesn't rebound and I imagine that will come. But he is an elite talent putting points on the board, initiating the offense, and is one of our top ball handlers. White needs to start. Hopkins' minutes should come from backing up Josh and Paul. For what it's worth, I completely agree that the officiating was wildly favorable to us in the Kansas game. For obvious reasons, people rarely comment about it when that's the case.
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hoyainspirit
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Post by hoyainspirit on Dec 15, 2014 9:20:47 GMT -5
To his credit, Hopkins turnover rate the last three games is down. He still shoots terribly, but hopefully he is settling into his role of rebounding and defense, both of which he continues to do with great success. No problem with seeing more Cope, though.
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NCHoya
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Post by NCHoya on Dec 15, 2014 9:29:02 GMT -5
I am completely in favor of Copeland getting more minutes, and fankly, I am surprised this has not been more of a priority. However, I do not think we need to belittle Hopkins in making this argument. To me, Hopkins is making his most consistent contribution this season, that being defense and rebounding. And not just straight up defense, but the blocks that lead to a chance at transition which this team desperately needs. It is clear White/Cope cannot provide this type of defense or rebounding.
However, this problem works itself out because in a game with normal officiating, Hopkins will not be able to stay on the floor, and I am completely OK with that. You know that saying "he gives us 5 fouls to use"? In a way, that is how I look at Hopkins, plus some added benefits obviously. But, in my mind, Hop should play aggressive, if he gets some early fouls - so what. That is the opportunity for the frosh to get in. Hop should make the most of his 20 minutes a game and play within his role. Clean up baskets will be there, and those should be his only offense.
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Post by FHillsNYHoya on Dec 15, 2014 9:30:41 GMT -5
For those who know more about hoops than I do - why does Hop get stuffed so often? Is his move/rise to the basket too deliberate? Does he fail to protect the ball with his body? Is he too mechanical - fails to adjust even slightly in the air when contact appears inevitable?
I apologize if this has been talked about elsewhere.
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Post by RockawayHoya on Dec 15, 2014 9:44:53 GMT -5
I am far from a Hop apologist (see last year especially), but if we're going to bring up Hop's offensive futility against Wisconsin, then to be fair shouldn't we be bringing up what he did to help limit pre-season All-American Frank Kaminsky to easily his worst output of the season (6 pts 4 rebs on 1/8 shooting)?
Agree completely with Etomic that Copeland has to be the guy that elevates his play to get more minutes. Judging from the growth we've seen in the first month already, I don't think it's unreasonable to think he could get there by the end of this year, but it's obviously still a work in progress with him.
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rockhoya
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Post by rockhoya on Dec 15, 2014 10:17:04 GMT -5
I find it amazing that we're discussing Hopkins' defending and his role as a starter. Maybe it's the difference between watching on TV and seeing him live. In the Bahamas, the officials called it tight. Against Kansas, in the Fox Sports One marquee matchup of the year with Big East refs, we were allowed to foul unabated. Hopkins had two hands on Perry Ellis's back, with arms extended, pushing him out of the post on every play. That would be called a foul in almost any game. In Big East v. Big East play that would be a foul. In the entire JT3 era I can't remember a game where we got that kind of favorable officiating. The Kansas game was not a sign of how good a defender Hopkins is. It was a sign of Hopkins' ceiling in a hardly officiated game. His aggressive shotblocking came from realization he was not being whistled for fouls. That accounts for his four blocks. But he was also over aggressive on help defense trying to block shots, often leaving his man unguarded for easy offensive rebounds and put backs. That's something the stats don't show. Despite all that, we would have won the Kansas game were it not for the turnovers and bad shots. Not only did Hopkins turn the ball over three times in that game, he also got blocked in the post – on a hook shot no less. I've seen a lot of discussion here about our freshman not being ready to defend. That's not what I see with Paul White. He moves his feet and stays in front of his man really well. He seldom reaches either. He's not getting blocks, but he's showing good fundamentals. Once he's more familiar with Big East refs, I suspect you'll see more aggressive post defense from him. It sucks that White doesn't rebound and I imagine that will come. But he is an elite talent putting points on the board, initiating the offense, and is one of our top ball handlers. White needs to start. Hopkins' minutes should come from backing up Josh and Paul. Yeah cause it's his fault that he did a good job adjusting to how the game was being called, he let up sooo many offensive rebounds and White is definitely nearly as strong as him and will be fine in the post....oh and not to mention if it wasn't for DSR we wouldn't have even been in that game.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2014 10:35:48 GMT -5
I find it amazing that we're discussing Hopkins' defending and his role as a starter. Maybe it's the difference between watching on TV and seeing him live. In the Bahamas, the officials called it tight. Against Kansas, in the Fox Sports One marquee matchup of the year with Big East refs, we were allowed to foul unabated. Hopkins had two hands on Perry Ellis's back, with arms extended, pushing him out of the post on every play. That would be called a foul in almost any game. In Big East v. Big East play that would be a foul. In the entire JT3 era I can't remember a game where we got that kind of favorable officiating. The Kansas game was not a sign of how good a defender Hopkins is. It was a sign of Hopkins' ceiling in a hardly officiated game. His aggressive shotblocking came from realization he was not being whistled for fouls. That accounts for his four blocks. But he was also over aggressive on help defense trying to block shots, often leaving his man unguarded for easy offensive rebounds and put backs. That's something the stats don't show. Despite all that, we would have won the Kansas game were it not for the turnovers and bad shots. Not only did Hopkins turn the ball over three times in that game, he also got blocked in the post – on a hook shot no less. I've seen a lot of discussion here about our freshman not being ready to defend. That's not what I see with Paul White. He moves his feet and stays in front of his man really well. He seldom reaches either. He's not getting blocks, but he's showing good fundamentals. Once he's more familiar with Big East refs, I suspect you'll see more aggressive post defense from him. It sucks that White doesn't rebound and I imagine that will come. But he is an elite talent putting points on the board, initiating the offense, and is one of our top ball handlers. White needs to start. Hopkins' minutes should come from backing up Josh and Paul. Yeah cause it's his fault that he did a good job adjusting to how the game was being called, he let up sooo many offensive rebounds and White is definitely nearly as strong as him and will be fine in the post....oh and not to mention if it wasn't for DSR we wouldn't have even been in that game. Mikael Hopkins in 3+ yrs at GU: 14 DQs (5 fouls) 5 double-digit rebound games Suggesting Mikael is going to adjust to the way the game is getting called is like betting on the sun not coming up tomorrow. Those numbers above also don't include the 18 times he had 4 fouls in a game. (Just so you don't accuse me of cherry-picking that, he has only had 8 or 9 rebounds in a game 4 times.)
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Dec 15, 2014 10:54:31 GMT -5
I didn’t say he’s entitled to his minutes I said he’s earned his minutes. He’s done that by fulfilling his role. That role would be interior defense and rebounding. This is where I keep saying everything is relative to the alternatives. Perhaps you don't mean it, but what you imply here is that it doesn't matter how good the alternatives are, as long as Hopkins plays defense and rebounds, he should get his minutes. Never mind that he defined that role in such a limited manner by being hopeless on offense. Are you really saying that if Kevin Durant was his PF backup, then Hopkins can still keep his minutes simply by playing D and rebounding? Is that all it takes? Succeeding in a limited role even if the player behind is a better all-around player? You brought in defensive win shares. I'm not a huge fan, but win shares seem to think Paul White's defense is close enough that, combined with his huge offensive advantage, makes him the superior player. By like 50%. The game is obviously played on both sides of the ball. There's always a thousand things that could have gone differently, but that's hardly a defense of Hopkins, who almost every game throws away possessions that either another player would convert easily or have no chance of going in. These aren't the missed shots of a guy who is shooting 50%. The rebounding thing is not nearly the issue you make it out to be. Defensive rebounding is largely a team activity with the individual getting the board often being discretionary. Hopkins is going to continue to back up Smith. But when Smith's out there, well he's rebounded as well as Hopkins this year. I know the drumbeat is that Hopkins is our best rebounder -- so far, it's actually been Smith by a hair. I can also project forward a bit. White and Copeland are going to rebound. They are going to get better.
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Dec 15, 2014 10:54:48 GMT -5
My feeling is that there is a little bit of a disconnect here. I think most people here agree that Hopkins has a place on this team as the backup to Josh Smith at center. I have not seen anybody suggesting that Hopkins should not play that role (really, unless you're giving Hayes that role, there's nobody else who can do it).
As far as Hopkins playing as PF, my feeling is that he isn't actually playing there alongside Smith for a significant amount of minutes each game anyway (and I'd tend to agree that I want to see Hopkins mostly as a backup for Smith, with White/Copeland getting the other time). White and Copeland might have smaller frames than Hopkins, but for the most part they are going to be guarding the PF on other teams. Sure, against Perry Ellis you might want Hopkins defending there, but I don't think it's nearly as big a deal when you're facing most teams who do not have a dominant PF.
I do think Hopkins has played better in the last few games (staying within himself), but he still has been stuffed numerous times and turned it over a good bit. It does seem like he's improved on a few of his weaknesses, so let's hope that continues. I don't expect his offense to get any better, but he can definitely improve on his turnovers and take fewer shots likely to be stuffed (though that tends to be possible on most shots).
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rockhoya
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Post by rockhoya on Dec 15, 2014 11:23:42 GMT -5
Yeah cause it's his fault that he did a good job adjusting to how the game was being called, he let up sooo many offensive rebounds and White is definitely nearly as strong as him and will be fine in the post....oh and not to mention if it wasn't for DSR we wouldn't have even been in that game. Mikael Hopkins in 3+ yrs at GU: 14 DQs (5 fouls) 5 double-digit rebound games Suggesting Mikael is going to adjust to the way the game is getting called is like betting on the sun not coming up tomorrow. Those numbers above also don't include the 18 times he had 4 fouls in a game. (Just so you don't accuse me of cherry-picking that, he has only had 8 or 9 rebounds in a game 4 times.) Re-read what I wrote. I was simply responding to the poster detracting from Hop's performance because he adjusted appropriately to the way the game was being called. That's what he's supposed to do how are you gonna dock him for that? Please if you're responding to my post actually stick to the discussion points that exist.
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lichoya68
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OK YOUNGINS ARE HERE AND ARE VERY VERY GOOD cant wait GO HOYAS
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Post by lichoya68 on Dec 15, 2014 11:37:53 GMT -5
Can be VERY good yup lost to three basically top 20 teams beat on florida yup can play with anyone and youngins coming along FAST josh be consistant and dsr hit some shots and OH WOWOWOWOWOWOWOWOWOWOOW go hoyas win one by one by at least one. YUP WE ARE GOOD. NOW.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2014 11:44:12 GMT -5
Mikael Hopkins in 3+ yrs at GU: 14 DQs (5 fouls) 5 double-digit rebound games Suggesting Mikael is going to adjust to the way the game is getting called is like betting on the sun not coming up tomorrow. Those numbers above also don't include the 18 times he had 4 fouls in a game. (Just so you don't accuse me of cherry-picking that, he has only had 8 or 9 rebounds in a game 4 times.) Re-read what I wrote. I was simply responding to the poster detracting from Hop's performance because he adjusted appropriately to the way the game was being called. That's what he's supposed to do how are you gonna dock him for that? Please if you're responding to my post actually stick to the discussion points that exist. My point is that Hop doesn't adjust to anything. Does that not apply here? He is what he is, as evidenced in part by his inability to stop fouling. Considering Josh and Jabril already foul at very high rates, this isn't a positive for our current starting lineup. Either they need to stop (not likely) or some minutes need to be redistributed. And Josh is definitely not my first choice... Reminder - I'm just trying to make an argument for the original idea that the Hoyas can become a very, very good team.
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rockhoya
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Post by rockhoya on Dec 15, 2014 11:58:39 GMT -5
Re-read what I wrote. I was simply responding to the poster detracting from Hop's performance because he adjusted appropriately to the way the game was being called. That's what he's supposed to do how are you gonna dock him for that? Please if you're responding to my post actually stick to the discussion points that exist. My point is that Hop doesn't adjust to anything. Does that not apply here? He is what he is, as evidenced in part by his inability to stop fouling. Considering Josh and Jabril already foul at very high rates, this isn't a positive for our current starting lineup. Either they need to stop (not likely) or some minutes need to be redistributed. And Josh is definitely not my first choice... Reminder - I'm just trying to make an argument for the original idea that the Hoyas can become a very, very good team. No it doesn't apply to my post or anywhere else for that matter.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2014 12:46:48 GMT -5
@sf
Josh gets half his rebounds of his own misses, he’s not as good of a rebounder as Mike c’mon man.. lol.. And if you don’t think defensive rebounding is an important stat your pretty much at odds with every descent coach out there… Why should I care if he misses by 50 feet or it rims out? It’s still a miss, you keep bringing this up like it matters. Again he is basically last on the team in shots attempted and 3rd in assts. It’s not like he’s out there going for his.
Where do they rank against him in Blocked Shots per 40 and in rebounding per 40? Aka the things Coach has emphasized Mike need to do.
Don’t really know what you guys are arguing for but if Ike plays well he’ll get minutes he’s averaged 20 a game since Butler, but no reason to downplay Hopkins contributions. He’s been very good in his role this year.
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Dec 15, 2014 12:47:03 GMT -5
My feeling is that there is a little bit of a disconnect here. I think most people here agree that Hopkins has a place on this team as the backup to Josh Smith at center. I have not seen anybody suggesting that Hopkins should not play that role (really, unless you're giving Hayes that role, there's nobody else who can do it). As far as Hopkins playing as PF, my feeling is that he isn't actually playing there alongside Smith for a significant amount of minutes each game anyway (and I'd tend to agree that I want to see Hopkins mostly as a backup for Smith, with White/Copeland getting the other time). White and Copeland might have smaller frames than Hopkins, but for the most part they are going to be guarding the PF on other teams. Sure, against Perry Ellis you might want Hopkins defending there, but I don't think it's nearly as big a deal when you're facing most teams who do not have a dominant PF. I do think Hopkins has played better in the last few games (staying within himself), but he still has been stuffed numerous times and turned it over a good bit. It does seem like he's improved on a few of his weaknesses, so let's hope that continues. I don't expect his offense to get any better, but he can definitely improve on his turnovers and take fewer shots likely to be stuffed (though that tends to be possible on most shots). A good point regarding matchups. Neither White nor Copeland is nearly strong enough to defend a real PF right now. Another year or do in the weight room will help. But since there are very few outstanding PF's that play down low, the youngsters will be able to hold their own in most games. And they should get plenty of minutes in those contests.
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sleepy
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Post by sleepy on Dec 15, 2014 12:51:05 GMT -5
I'm certainly not defending Hopkins, i'm amazed sometimes at his inability to score in close unguarded with nothing but the rim in front of him.
we complain about his fouling i'm not sure we are watching the same game seems to me at least one or two of his fouls a game are the result of playing help defense. this was a major occurence last year and continues today where penetration to the basket though improved is pretty simple with our guard play.
we are complainig about turnovers yes a few wtf when he is looking to make a move to the basket but he is much better than last year from what i have seen. No one in this thread is giving him any credit for his ability running the offense if you want to replace him with white or copeland go ahead i have yet to see from either the ability to catch, look screen or make a pass out of our offense. Smith is ok but not at the level hopkins is at purely from 4 years of experience. this also leads to a few more turnovers.
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