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Post by jerseyhoya34 on Apr 9, 2005 12:47:00 GMT -5
Not a DeAndre Thomas comment but read in Washington Post today that David Neal, O'Connell HS, Arlington VA will sign with Maryland. Think Hoyas had offered him. We did not offer him a scholarship. He received an offer from Clemson in addition to the Twerps.
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DFW HOYA
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Post by DFW HOYA on Apr 9, 2005 13:08:55 GMT -5
We did not offer him a scholarship. He received an offer from Clemson in addition to the Twerps. Sorry to hear that. Would have been a solid addition and it sounded that Neal was holding hope for an offer which never came. So why does Georgetown continue to miss on picking up kids from the WCAC? It's a continuing failure within the recruiting system that local kids from good schools are simply not a priority to Georgetown. Go down the list: DeMatha--no players since 1971 St. John's--no players since 1961 Carroll--one since 1980 Gonzaga--no players since 1990 Good Counsel-none ever McNamara-none ever Ireton-none ever O'Connell-none ever Paul VI -none ever Comments welcome.
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GUHoya07
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Post by GUHoya07 on Apr 9, 2005 13:14:29 GMT -5
Neal was a questionable talent according to many. He may turn out being decent, but I dont think anyone feels he'll be a real impact player. We've got plenty of role players and right now it doesnt make sense taking risks on guys who may not even be able to play effectively in the post in the Big East.
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DFW HOYA
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Post by DFW HOYA on Apr 9, 2005 13:21:50 GMT -5
David Neal was first team all-Met. The only other All-Met for Georgetown hasn't formally committed, either.
Not an impact player? One can argue that most of next year's freshmen will be role players, too.
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nychoya3
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Post by nychoya3 on Apr 9, 2005 13:29:17 GMT -5
Once TEXTcouldTEXT argue that, but I don't think you'd be right. At the very least, Sapp is clearly a top tier talent. No one is a slam dunk star, that's true, but it hardly follows that Neal would be a good addition. There are many levels of role player, and the staff evaluated Neal intensively and decided that he wasn't worth a scholarship right now. We offered him a prefered walk on slot with the potential for full ride down the road.
The WCAC comment is definitely true, though I don't think it implies we should have taken Neal (or Paul Johnson, the star at Gonzaga). Dematha is stacked in the coming years, and I'm sure sume of those other schools will have some stars.
Neal's scouting report is basically that he's a very smart player, but he's a 6'6'' power forward without great athleticism. Let's say he's a stronger, but smaller version of Sead. Is that worth a scholarship, regardless of what high school he attends.
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GUHoya07
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Post by GUHoya07 on Apr 9, 2005 13:30:32 GMT -5
Yeah, but Neal seems extremely questionable. While all of next year's class could possibly end up being role players (I think at least 1 or 2 guys will be more than that) Neal may not even be a Big East level player. He's only 6' 6" and I think its going to be extremely hard for him to do much in a major conference at the next level.
Maybe I didnt express myself correctly. Role players are fine, you need them mixed in with the stars. However, guys who may never contribute are risky.
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Post by jerseyhoya34 on Apr 9, 2005 13:34:30 GMT -5
David Neal was first team all-Met. The only other All-Met for Georgetown hasn't formally committed, either. Not an impact player? One can argue that most of next year's freshmen will be role players, too. The WaPo selections are shrouded in local politics, so I wouldn't read much into them. Neal had a great season, but it was a DOWN year for DC metro hoops. Paul Johnson, for example, was, at some point, considered the best senior in the area, and he's raking in PL and Ivy interest. The word from many local scouts and analysts is that Neal would not be able to bang in the paint in the BE. I trust their judgment. I agree with your point about locals to a certain extent. Our recruiting should focus on the metro area and MD/VA. This said, it should also be about attracting the best players. Esh and his staff did a good job with the Hibbert/Green group. One was the best player in the area, and the other was in the upper echelon. This year, I don't fault our staff because it was a down year, and we picked up a top 50 talent in Sapp. If my understanding is correct, he'll turn into the best college player from this area. At the same time, some of the schools you mention didn't have anyone of note. Good Counsel is down. Ireton's high majors are underclassmen. DeMatha's high majors are in the same boat, and we have been monitoring many of them. I also think another issue is that the program needs to regain credibility after having some down years that nearly destroyed GU bball as we know it. The fact that many of our recent recruits came from the left coast should tell us what kind of reception we were receiving in local gyms and rightfully so. There are no role players in JT3's system. Every player is expected to be able to do the same fundamental things on the court. Some guys add things in certain areas more than others, but they're all expected to be able to run the offense and play within its context. I also think that JT3 expects the frosh to come in and contribute from day one. He'll wait and see what he has first, but I don't think he expects to sit any of the frosh like he did this season.
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DFW HOYA
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Post by DFW HOYA on Apr 9, 2005 13:37:50 GMT -5
Neal may not even be a Big East level player. He's only 6' 6" and I think its going to be extremely hard for him to do much in a major conference at the next level. Last point on Neal, because my concern is more on the WCAC: You say that Neal may not be a Big East player, but it's not like he signed with Bucknell or Siena. He signed with an ACC school, which sends a positive a sign to area coaches that College Park is interested in this league, even for a prospect that won't be a 2,000 point scorer for the Terps. If you're an up and coming kid in this conference next year, is Georgetown already at a disadvantage?
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Apr 9, 2005 13:42:07 GMT -5
David Neal was first team all-Met. The only other All-Met for Georgetown hasn't formally committed, either. Not an impact player? One can argue that most of next year's freshmen will be role players, too. Manny Quezada and Folarin Campbell were last year, too, right. First team All-Met means very little. But Neal may have helped us. However, if JTIII thinks he can close the players were listed with for '06, I can understand the decision. As for your comment about Sapp, Jessie CAN'T sign until April 13th, I believe. So that's not an issue. And most people think Sapp has a much, much better chance than Neal to be an impact player. Neal seems to be longer on effort than on talent, which is a great player for a team to have, if they alreayd have talent. On your last point, DFW, I don't think PJ or Neal is going to keep people away. We did get Jeff Green last year and Roy Hibbert. While not WCAC, they are DC folk. Sapp is not DC or WCAC but players respect his game here. We're supposedly recruiting DeMatha very hard.
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Post by jerseyhoya34 on Apr 9, 2005 13:46:35 GMT -5
Last point on Neal, because my concern is more on the WCAC: You say that Neal may not be a Big East player, but it's not like he signed with Bucknell or Siena. He signed with an ACC school, which sends a positive a sign to area coaches that College Park is interested in this league, even for a prospect that won't be a 2,000 point scorer for the Terps. If you're an up and coming kid in this conference next year, is Georgetown already at a disadvantage? I don't necessarily see it that way. UMD got some pretty bad press/discussion toward the end of the season with some rumors of serious altercations within the program. So, I am not worried about College Park commanding the respect of the locals. To a certain extent, I think a lot of this is speculative because we don't have a good idea as to what we'll do with our schollies in 2006. I view 2005 as a funky situation because of time constraints on our recruiting. From what I've read, I'll take the job that we did locally over the job that UMD did. Their assistants are not known for great recruiting in some local areas, and they don't have great relations with DC Assault. We have both.
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RDF
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Post by RDF on Apr 9, 2005 14:17:42 GMT -5
Sorry to hear that. Would have been a solid addition and it sounded that Neal was holding hope for an offer which never came. So why does Georgetown continue to miss on picking up kids from the WCAC? It's a continuing failure within the recruiting system that local kids from good schools are simply not a priority to Georgetown. Go down the list: DeMatha--no players since 1971 St. John's--no players since 1961 Carroll--one since 1980 Gonzaga--no players since 1990 Good Counsel-none ever McNamara-none ever Ireton-none ever O'Connell-none ever Paul VI -none ever Comments welcome. First of all, I thought Eric Micoud attended St. John's and Tony Bethel was originally a McNamara player before leaving to go to Montrose Christian I believe. Secondly, Hoyas recruited Mo Diane the kid from DeMatha who signed with UVA very hard--he visited the Campus and was being recruited very aggressively. Same with DeMatha underclassmen Jeff Allen and Nigel Munson. Hoyas contacted David Neal and were one of first local teams to do so. They told him their situation and he was interested. Fact is Maryland offered him a scholarship as did Clemson--Notre Dame also evaluated Neal and didn't offer. I think it's a cop-out to say GU didn't show interest--they didn't offer a scholarship, but they contacted him before Terps did, so to me that is being interested--and they attended his games to scout him as well. I think the other posters said it best--you have to build ties/respect before you expect to see the kids start naming you as a favorite and beating down the door to come to GU. We had numerous underclassmen visit for games---Vernon Macklin, Chris Wright, Nolan Smith, Michael Beasley, Anthony McClain, Dajuan Summers, Chris Braswell, Scotty Reynolds, etc..... and they are all from MD,VA, and DC. That's not a bad sign, but now Hoyas need to work their butts off to sign a few of them. It's not as easy as just recruiting them, you have to keep at it and show kids a reason for them to want to come join the program. Staff is doing what it takes in my opinion and hasn't alienated anyone locally as of now.
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EasyEd
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Post by EasyEd on Apr 9, 2005 15:03:42 GMT -5
The Recruiting Master List thread says we offered to David Neal.
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Post by jerseyhoya34 on Apr 9, 2005 15:06:45 GMT -5
The Recruiting Master List thread says we offered to David Neal. It is not correct in many cases, this being one of them.
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DFW HOYA
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Post by DFW HOYA on Apr 9, 2005 19:26:53 GMT -5
Agreed--Eric Micoud did go to St. John's.
Bethel went to McNamara through 11th grade but finished at Montrose, so that is why he wasn't included.
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JimmyHoya
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Post by JimmyHoya on Apr 10, 2005 15:58:44 GMT -5
Didn't Ruben Bountje-Bountje go to Carroll?
And we don't want anybody from Ireton or McNamara...they're horrendous. The girls team on the other hand hopefully has been looking at those institutions.
Paul VI, Good Kounsel, and Carroll are pretty meh'ish anyway. One year they've got talent, the next they're barren.
O'Connel wasn't that good until Joe Wooton got there. They were BI 2, but with a much larger student body.
Finally, no losses from Gonzaga either. Their last great was Church. They've had great teams and pretty decent players, but they all end up at the Niagra's, Fordham's, Coastal Carolina's and Hofstra's of Div I. Even their last team that cracked the top 5 USA rankings didn't have anyone significant besides Alvin Brown, a minor role player for Xavier from 97-01, I believe.
But he is right about Dematha and O'Connell, I guess.
And if I may offer up a new theory on the lack of WCAC recruits coming to G'town, besides our own recruitment breakdowns, the culture of the athletics and overall social atmosphere for many of those WCAC schools doesn't mesh well with Georgetown and what it is known for around the city. While you might see a few Gonzaga kids hanging around G'town area, pretty much to every other WCAC school, that part of town is foreign to them. On the flip side, if you go to College Park, you'll find Dematha, St. John's, and Carroll students hanging around. Granted, it is a rather superficial way to look at it, but Georgetown is "IAC", UMD is "WCAC". It's just the natural instincts of some of these larger WCAC kids to head to UMD, while the smaller IAC schools stick with G'town.
...all that said, I'll take Mike Beasley no matter where he went to school.
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SirSaxa
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Post by SirSaxa on Apr 10, 2005 16:46:46 GMT -5
As for DeMatha, why is it that no one has pointed out the feud that existed for many years between JT-Pops and John Wooten? That was the reason no one from DeMatha went to GU for a very long time.
Now that it's over, maybe we will get some of their kids.
JT3 appears to be doing a good job on the recruiting trail, but we can't expect miracles overnight.
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DFW HOYA
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Post by DFW HOYA on Apr 10, 2005 18:24:39 GMT -5
The Thompson-Wootten feud was certainly a factor, but Thompson left six years ago and Wootten three and it doesn't seem like things are moving much.
As to the above post saying Georgetown is more IAC friendly and Maryland more WCAC-friendly, is that a Catholic issue, an economics issue, or an admissions issue? Are fewer WCAC kids looking at Georgetown as a whole?
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Post by jerseyhoya34 on Apr 10, 2005 18:33:16 GMT -5
The Thompson-Wootten feud was certainly a factor, but Thompson left six years ago and Wootten three and it doesn't seem like things are moving much. JT3 was in frequent attendance this year at DeMatha games. I don't know if Esherick made a habit of going to high school games, so I can't say anything for or against him on this issue. Then again, one must ask what schools we did a good job with during the "interregnum." Sure, we signed a few Montrose guys, but was that beneficial for the program? Don't expect us to sign any DeMatha players for 2005, as the talent is in the next class.
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JimmyHoya
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Post by JimmyHoya on Apr 10, 2005 20:53:06 GMT -5
TAs to the above post saying Georgetown is more IAC friendly and Maryland more WCAC-friendly, is that a Catholic issue, an economics issue, or an admissions issue? Are fewer WCAC kids looking at Georgetown as a whole? I think of it more of an identity issue. I don't mean to play on stereotypes..but this is how I see it from a non-IAC/WCAC DC student's perspective. No matter where you live, the Prep, St. Alban's, Bullis, etc. (and all their sister schools from the ISL too) seem to migrate towards Georgetown on the weekends. I'm sure you've all seen the hudnreds of high schoolers on M St. at night. They are almost all privledged private school kids from IAC schools. Conversely, if you look at the WCAC kids they all seem to stay in their own neighbor. Bethesda guys stay in Bethesda, No. Va guys hang stay south of the district, and the NE people stay up there, in College Park, PG County, etc. Don't ask me why, the whole thing puzzles me. I guess because these WCAC are typicaly larger, so they've got more school buddies close to home they don't move around much? I dunno. I guess what I'm trying to illustrate is that the neighborhood of Georgetown has a clearly defined "rich kids" rep and people are drawn/stay away accordingly. It's not like it's some school's "turf", but there's a definte aura about the place. Other people consider it to be an expensive craphole. Anyway, this idea just popped in my head earlier. Take it for what it's worth, I've just always been amused by my travels to Georgetown and College Park and the distinct difference in the high school populations. You've got your "preppy lax players" who want to be seen, and your low key people who just want to chill. Different cultures, different schools, and definitely different perceptions of both are prevalent among the schools.
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bmartin
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Post by bmartin on Apr 10, 2005 23:16:14 GMT -5
Don't forget JTIII and Burke are Gonzaga grads themselves. They recruited Luke Owings to Princeton. They did not offer a scholarship to Neal or Johnson because they obviously were higher on the guys they signed. They have been doing the groundwork to get top local players in future classes.
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