Another NCAA Pratfall: The Post-Game Thread

[dreamhoya]

you know what. looking at what's transpiring in the tourney, how do you chalk it up to the coach when we handle SU twice and beat Louisville, yet both are demolishing in the tourney...

[TC]

Mar 23, 2013 17:28:39 GMT -5 hoyas1995 said:

Mar 23, 2013 17:27:32 GMT -5 skyhoya said:

JTIII needs to change a few things. He needs to bring in some new blood on the coaching staff with some new ideas. He also needs a real big man coach.

I never considered Othella a "big man". More of a PF.

A PF is not a "big man"? WTF!

Othella was listed when he played as taller than Josh Smith. I have no idea where they ring in with shoes off, but I'm guessing there's not more than an inch of difference.

[guru]

Mar 23, 2013 21:42:34 GMT -5 berrypatch26 said:

One last comment: if you're a top seed, whether at the US Open or at the Big Dance, you're not only expected to win, you're expected to crush, like, 6-0, 6-0. To claim "bad luck" over and over again, simply doesn't cut it; you shouldn't have been seeded at all. Maybe you shouldn't have been in the tourney at all.
So, what can be done about this situation, our Hoya situation? If nothing is done, then recruiting will dry up in a flash. Or worse.
Obviously, ALL of the staff has got to wake up and smell the coffee; the TEAM does too.
Is it unfair to place the burden on the team? No, some of them will get to ring the cash register big time, KA-CHING, if they go pro.
Is it unfair to place the burden on the staff? No, because they are the old pros, the adults, the experienced, seen-it-all dudes.
Is it unfair for the fans - students, alumni, benefactors, friends and supporters - to have to deal with the present Hoya iteration? The clear answer is YES; it is unfair for us.
Does that mean a staff change? Perhaps.
Does that mean some guys play, while others don't. Perhaps.

Do you promise that's your last comment?

[guru]

Mar 23, 2013 7:19:00 GMT -5 berrypatch26 said:

"What you saw out there wasn't typical Georgetown basketball," said Coach Thompson.

Actually, it was Georgetown basketball. A wonderfully surprising, Cinderella-season, marred by inexplicable, horrendous losses, AGAIN.

I went to bed at 7pm with a truly crippling stomach ache. It sounds stupid, but I must have been feeling worried. Too many other upsets in the tourney. Too many complacent seeded teams. Still, JT III and the Hoyas should have learned their lesson already.

(My friend in Philly says we owe him nothing, we're all good. I offered to cover the cost of the tickets for Sunday - told him I'd prefer to stay home and cry. He said that his friend was wheeling and dealing tickets depending on the outcome of the games; no problem).

Otto would have been a high lottery pick if the team won some tournament games. Not now.
In fact, he's better off staying in school, getting stronger, getting a degree. He's good now, but he's no Kobe Bryant or LeBron James.

JT III is another story. Can't keep pretending. True winners actually win.

It was a Cinderella-season all right. Low expectations turned into high hopes. Then the clock struck midnight.

Sorry, deleted. Otto isn't Lebron or Kobe? Is that some kind of indictment? deleted.

[jorand]

Mar 23, 2013 18:50:04 GMT -5 Big Dog said:

Mar 23, 2013 16:08:57 GMT -5 guru said:

JT3 is the anti-Izzo. Overall, he's one of the worst tournament coaches of all time. The resume speaks for itself. And I really like the guy. Just hope he pulls it together in the postseason soon.

His NCAA tournament record is 8-7.

Yeah, but most of those wins came in 2007....

[ColumbiaHeightsHoya]

We also crushed duke and butler the year they met in the final. We just suck in the tourney. For next years WAG shirt I suggest, legends are made in January, f::k march

[guru]

Mar 23, 2013 18:50:04 GMT -5 Big Dog said:

Mar 23, 2013 16:08:57 GMT -5 guru said:

JT3 is the anti-Izzo. Overall, he's one of the worst tournament coaches of all time. The resume speaks for itself. And I really like the guy. Just hope he pulls it together in the postseason soon.

His NCAA tournament record is 8-7.

BD, come on. Look at the losses. They are abysmal. And after a very good start, with a Sweet 16 and Final 4 out of the gate, his record is 2-5 over the past 6 seasons, with an average seed of around 3. That's terrible. He has more losses to double digit seeds than most coaches who have been in the game much longer.

[indianhoop]

Well, look on the bright side, you could be in the Patriot League in basketball too.

[hoyas1995]

Remember the days when we were almost a lock to win our first round NCAA games, even as a 6-10 seed? I'd take that any day right now

[hoyas1995]

Even Craig Esherick made it to the 2nd weekend in his lone tourney appearance. (Half the credit goes to Hampton)

[dreamhoya]

If anyone gets a chance, go back and watch the game. There were 4-6 key plays in that game. FGCU was taking and making some questionable shots. Wow....

[gujake]

Just did a quick calculation based on KenPom's "initial states" -- these are the probabilities he gives for each team to win before each game starts. For example, he gave us a 90% chance of beating FGCU.

KenPom doesn't have this data from 2008 or earlier so I only looked at the FGCU, NC State, Belmont, VCU, and Ohio games.

Based on these probabilities (and assuming they were independent events), the chance that you would expect us to go 1-4 or worse in those games is almost exactly 2%.

I won't try to interpret that number at all but thought others might find it interesting.

[MCIGuy]

Mar 23, 2013 21:41:47 GMT -5 TC said:

Mar 23, 2013 17:28:39 GMT -5 hoyas1995 said:

I never considered Othella a "big man". More of a PF.

A PF is not a "big man"? WTF!

Othella was listed when he played as taller than Josh Smith. I have no idea where they ring in with shoes off, but I'm guessing there's not more than an inch of difference.

O went from 6'11 to 6'10 to 6'8. He probably was closer to 6'7. Josh is at least a couple of inches taller.

[jwp91]

Mar 23, 2013 23:08:25 GMT -5 dreamhoya said:

If anyone gets a chance, go back and watch the game. There were 4-6 key plays in that game. FGCU was taking and making some questionable shots. Wow....

To their credit, they played with a ton of confidence. That combined with our doubt was the difference IMHO.

[cosmopolitanhoya]

Mar 23, 2013 22:09:58 GMT -5 ColumbiaHeightsHoya said:

We also crushed duke and butler the year they met in the final. We just suck in the tourney. For next years WAG shirt I suggest, legends are made in January, f::k march

yeap... that year still Editeded me off the most. so many people from duke have teased me about that all year along and even the year after... how do we crush a team by 30 pts in front of the u.s. president and gets bounced out in the first round, while that team that we destroyed wins the tournament... just inexplicable.

[cosmopolitanhoya]

Mar 23, 2013 22:02:20 GMT -5 guru said:

Mar 23, 2013 7:19:00 GMT -5 berrypatch26 said:

"What you saw out there wasn't typical Georgetown basketball," said Coach Thompson.

Actually, it was Georgetown basketball. A wonderfully surprising, Cinderella-season, marred by inexplicable, horrendous losses, AGAIN.

I went to bed at 7pm with a truly crippling stomach ache. It sounds stupid, but I must have been feeling worried. Too many other upsets in the tourney. Too many complacent seeded teams. Still, JT III and the Hoyas should have learned their lesson already.

(My friend in Philly says we owe him nothing, we're all good. I offered to cover the cost of the tickets for Sunday - told him I'd prefer to stay home and cry. He said that his friend was wheeling and dealing tickets depending on the outcome of the games; no problem).

Otto would have been a high lottery pick if the team won some tournament games. Not now.
In fact, he's better off staying in school, getting stronger, getting a degree. He's good now, but he's no Kobe Bryant or LeBron James.

JT III is another story. Can't keep pretending. True winners actually win.

It was a Cinderella-season all right. Low expectations turned into high hopes. Then the clock struck midnight.

Sorry, deleted. Otto isn't Lebron or Kobe? Is that some kind of indictment? deleted.

what happened to everyone who crowned otto as the next scottie pippen? come on now. even syracuse fans compared otto to their greatest player in carmelo after how he closed down carrier dome by himself.

he is still going to be lottery pick, most likely top 5, regardless of the outcome of our season. i do believe there is a slim chance that he comes back just like greg did after his freshman year. time will tell~

[whatmaroon]

2010 Ohio: 56.5% from 3 (season 36.5%)
2011 VCU: 48.0% from 3 (season 37.0%)
2012 Belmont: 37.0% from 3 (season 38.1%), and hey, a win
2012 NC State: 46.7% from 3 (season 35.5%)
2013 FGCU: 40.0% from 3 (season 33.2%)

There's obviously more going on than just how well our opponent shoots the 3, but it'd be nice to get an opponent that shoots 30-35% like the teams we play in the regular season do.

[SSHoya]

Just reading about Wichita State's upset over Gonzaga and the article says the Shocker's motto is "play angry."

[DanMcQ]

An interesting take, which will undoubtedly be cast aside by the overwhelming wave of cynicism on display here since Friday...

ajerseyguy.com/?p=6074

Through all of this chatter, Donaldson’s main point is clear, but it is also perplexing. What is this year’s selection process about, and how does a team like FGCU, which beat Miami and played other big boy schools such as Duke, St. John’s and Iowa State even for most or at least part of the game, wind up on the 15 line with teams such as Albany, Montana and Iona? All of those schools pretty much followed script and went down in their first round games without much of a fight, although Albany made Duke sweat through most of the second half before losing, 73-61.

This year’s committee did a fairly good job of putting the 68 field team together, with a minimum of controversy. You an argue the points of Mercer, which took its ire out on not receiving an at-large NCAA spot by clipping Tennessee in its first round NIT game.

What is much more debatable is the seeding process. Former Big East commissioner Mike Tranghese, who is also a former chairman of the selection committee, says his judgement on teams was based on the “eye test’.

As a basketball guy, Mike T, would throw out RPI’s and strength of schedule numbers as a tie-breaker and simply look at a team with a simple question. “How good are they and can they play?”

All anyone had to do was look at FGCU coming out on Friday and warming up and your immediate reaction would be, “Wow, these guys may be pretty good.” They easily pass the “eye test”.

How good are they?

Better than a 15 seed, probably, although the committee will argue that a loss at Maine, which finished back in the pack in the America East and Atlantic Sun losses at Lipscomb and at Stetson are harder to explain.

Finishing behind Mercer is even tougher since FGCU beat Mercer in two of their three meetings, including a 13 victory on Mercer’s court in the Atlantic Sun tournament championship game.

Realistically, FGCU should have been a 12, 13 or 14 seed. After a somewhat bumpy start, the Eagles had it figured out by the last month of the season.

...Not an excuse for a loss (there isn't any) and not as big a miss as Oregon's ridiculous seeding, but certainly FCGU's seeding did the Hoyas no favors.

[hoopsmccan]

Mar 24, 2013 5:55:20 GMT -5 DanMcQ said:

An interesting take, which will undoubtedly be cast aside by the overwhelming wave of cynicism on display here since Friday...

ajerseyguy.com/?p=6074

Through all of this chatter, Donaldson’s main point is clear, but it is also perplexing. What is this year’s selection process about, and how does a team like FGCU, which beat Miami and played other big boy schools such as Duke, St. John’s and Iowa State even for most or at least part of the game, wind up on the 15 line with teams such as Albany, Montana and Iona? All of those schools pretty much followed script and went down in their first round games without much of a fight, although Albany made Duke sweat through most of the second half before losing, 73-61.

This year’s committee did a fairly good job of putting the 68 field team together, with a minimum of controversy. You an argue the points of Mercer, which took its ire out on not receiving an at-large NCAA spot by clipping Tennessee in its first round NIT game.

What is much more debatable is the seeding process. Former Big East commissioner Mike Tranghese, who is also a former chairman of the selection committee, says his judgement on teams was based on the “eye test’.

As a basketball guy, Mike T, would throw out RPI’s and strength of schedule numbers as a tie-breaker and simply look at a team with a simple question. “How good are they and can they play?”

All anyone had to do was look at FGCU coming out on Friday and warming up and your immediate reaction would be, “Wow, these guys may be pretty good.” They easily pass the “eye test”.

How good are they?

Better than a 15 seed, probably, although the committee will argue that a loss at Maine, which finished back in the pack in the America East and Atlantic Sun losses at Lipscomb and at Stetson are harder to explain.

Finishing behind Mercer is even tougher since FGCU beat Mercer in two of their three meetings, including a 13 victory on Mercer’s court in the Atlantic Sun tournament championship game.

Realistically, FGCU should have been a 12, 13 or 14 seed. After a somewhat bumpy start, the Eagles had it figured out by the last month of the season.

...Not an excuse for a loss (there isn't any) and not as big a miss as Oregon's ridiculous seeding, but certainly FCGU's seeding did the Hoyas no favors.

Davidson, yes. FGCU...I really don't think so. It was a choke job, plain and simple. We came out ridiculously tight - bricking free throw after free throw, layups and open jumpers. Instead of being up 7, we could have easily been up 14 with just average free throw shooting and layups. Then you see a 15 seed that is scrambling...taking chances and forcing shots. Maybe those shots still go in. Maybe taking chances leads to some turnovers. Or, more likely, those shots don't go in, taking chances leads to easy Hoyas points. But we kept them in it, kept the crowd in it and now I'm forced to go to Build a Bear workshop with my kids and nephews rather than sitting on my couch, drinking beer with my brother. Edited me.