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Post by strummer8526 on Sept 20, 2011 14:37:22 GMT -5
Call it "clutter" if you want, but I maintain: the 24 team ACC is the most "fun" option. 16 football schools, 8 basketball-only schools. ACC North = Big East; ACC South = old ACC. Imagine the craziness when the "conference tournament" features semifinal games that are equivalent to BE and ACC finals. And THEN, on top of that, you get an old-school ACC/BE rivalry game. It would top off every conference tourney with a "traditional" ACC/BE showdown. That would easily be the most fun thing in college basketball and maybe all of sports (at least for BE/ACC basketball fans).
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KennaHoya
Century (over 100 posts)
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Post by KennaHoya on Sept 20, 2011 14:38:56 GMT -5
You would expect the football schools to do this - and the conference Commissioner will attend. Look, it is better than each one reacting on their own and trying to secure their own interests without looking the others in the eye (remind you of anyone?). And football has got to be one focus of their decision - why talk about it first with all the ADs including those who do not have any football interest? I would suspect Georgetown is engaged in discussions with these ADs separately, and will learn of the discussions from tonight as well.
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guru
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Post by guru on Sept 20, 2011 14:38:59 GMT -5
College basketball is more about coaches building programs than about league affiliations or facilities. Look at how bad the ACC has been except for Duke and UNC. Look at how bad the SEC has been except for Kentucky and Florida. Look at how bad the PAC 10 has been, period. Despite all the TV money and facilities, etc. for the BCS conferences, in each of the past two seasons, there were 5 mid-majors in the Sweet 16: Butler, VCU, Richmond, BYU, San Diego St. in 2011 and Butler, Xavier, Northern Iowa, Cornell, and St. Mary's in 2010. What about forming the Big Country Conference as a large bi-coastal collection of non-BCS hoops schools, split into two divisions? Rotate the conference tourney between West Coast, East Coast and midwestern metropolis(es?)
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Dhall
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Post by Dhall on Sept 20, 2011 14:39:13 GMT -5
Enough with the facilities and the TV money and the conference affiliation. College basketball is all about the coach. You need a guy who can recruit top players and win games with them. So yes, money and facilities and conference affiliation help to attract a coach, but if you can find a way to pay a great coach despite deficiencies in those areas, then everything else will be fine. Kind of like what we did with the two John Thompsons.
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guru
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Post by guru on Sept 20, 2011 14:40:21 GMT -5
Call it "clutter" if you want, but I maintain: the 24 team ACC is the most "fun" option. 16 football schools, 8 basketball-only schools. ACC North = Big East; ACC South = old ACC. Imagine the craziness when the "conference tournament" features semifinal games that are equivalent to BE and ACC finals. And THEN, on top of that, you get an old-school ACC/BE rivalry game. It would top off every conference tourney with a "traditional" ACC/BE showdown. That would easily be the most fun thing in college basketball and maybe all of sports (at least for BE/ACC basketball fans). Not happening, unfortunately. It's a no-hoper.
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KennaHoya
Century (over 100 posts)
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Post by KennaHoya on Sept 20, 2011 14:46:06 GMT -5
That is a pretty big IF there Dhall. You are of course correct that the coach is the essential element. But you need revenue to pay a coach market wages. And if you listen carefully to JT III, his long term commitment to Georgetown needs to be secured by a commitment to improving the facilities as well.
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hoyabinx
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Post by hoyabinx on Sept 20, 2011 14:46:55 GMT -5
College basketball is more about coaches building programs than about league affiliations or facilities. Look at how bad the ACC has been except for Duke and UNC. Look at how bad the SEC has been except for Kentucky and Florida. Look at how bad the PAC 10 has been, period. I think this proves an important point. The concerns of irrelevancy stem from the fact that we are not connected to BCS football. That being the case, we have been playing on borrowed money for a long time. Unfortunately, this time there will be no borrowed money because all BCS schools have "wised up."
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Post by fsohoya on Sept 20, 2011 14:47:47 GMT -5
You would expect the football schools to do this - and the conference Commissioner will attend. Look, it is better than each one reacting on their own and trying to secure their own interests without looking the others in the eye (remind you of anyone?). And football has got to be one focus of their decision - why talk about it first with all the ADs including those who do not have any football interest? I would suspect Georgetown is engaged in discussions with these ADs separately, and will learn of the discussions from tonight as well. Agreed. I do, though, hope at some point they all meet together to honestly discuss their thoughts and plans. I undertsand schools looking out for themselves, but I don't think honesty -- even is it's strictly behind closed doors -- is too much to ask for at this point.
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hoyabinx
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Post by hoyabinx on Sept 20, 2011 14:50:54 GMT -5
Re Facilities:
What are the chances that we could use the Smith Center. GW would get additional revenue and perhaps we could get a better deal than what we have with Verizon, using Verizon for the big games.
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vcjack
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Post by vcjack on Sept 20, 2011 14:52:24 GMT -5
Re Facilities: What are the chances that we could use the Smith Center. GW would get additional revenue and perhaps we could get a better deal than what we have with Verizon, using Verizon for the big games. No, I would rather play games in the McDonough parking lot than be a squatter at the Smith Center. Playing games at Georgetown Prep makes more sense to me
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RBHoya
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Post by RBHoya on Sept 20, 2011 14:56:11 GMT -5
Not sure why people call this clutter, our potential "new league" (not a fan of "The Catholic Conference") has been touched on in several other threads, but its good to have one place where we can brainstorm all of our ideas. I have several, but since I've spent too much time today posting/surfing already, I'll get them out some time later.
Other than a small number of folks I think most of us agree that staying attached to a BCS AQ Conference for as long as we can is the best path. But when/if that falls apart, I hope we're prepared. Being prepared for this scenario doesn't mean any of us are hoping for it, but given that the odds are pretty decent at this point that it's our future, lets make the best of it. Wouldn't be surprised if ideas in a thread like this were more thought than the Presidents and ADs were putting into it.
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hoyabinx
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Post by hoyabinx on Sept 20, 2011 14:57:40 GMT -5
Re Facilities: What are the chances that we could use the Smith Center. GW would get additional revenue and perhaps we could get a better deal than what we have with Verizon, using Verizon for the big games. No, I would rather play games in the McDonough parking lot than be a squatter at the Smith Center. Playing games at Georgetown Prep makes more sense to me I don't really think playing at Georgetown Prep makes more sense, given our students could walk to games at the Smith Center.
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Post by fsohoya on Sept 20, 2011 15:04:08 GMT -5
No, I would rather play games in the McDonough parking lot than be a squatter at the Smith Center. Playing games at Georgetown Prep makes more sense to me I don't really think playing at Georgetown Prep makes more sense, given our students could walk to games at the Smith Center. Better to play at McD than be seen as sinking so low we have to beg GW for space. And I, for one, think McD would be a nice place for lower-tier games if it could be spruced up a bit and we could jam 4,000 in it. (Assuming we can't stay hooked to a BCS conference.)
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vcjack
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Post by vcjack on Sept 20, 2011 15:09:48 GMT -5
No, I would rather play games in the McDonough parking lot than be a squatter at the Smith Center. Playing games at Georgetown Prep makes more sense to me I don't really think playing at Georgetown Prep makes more sense, given our students could walk to games at the Smith Center. If the alarmists are right and we'll struggle to get in the quadruple digits for attendance at most games, McDonough would work just fine
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hoyabinx
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Post by hoyabinx on Sept 20, 2011 15:15:11 GMT -5
I don't really think playing at Georgetown Prep makes more sense, given our students could walk to games at the Smith Center. Better to play at McD than be seen as sinking so low we have to beg GW for space. And I, for one, think McD would be a nice place for lower-tier games if it could be spruced up a bit and we could jam 4,000 in it. (Assuming we can't stay hooked to a BCS conference.) I'd be willing to bet a lot of money that any renovation of that size would have to be approved by the neighborhood. I would be willing to bet ALL my money that if we need neighborhood approval, we wouldn't get it.
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RBHoya
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Post by RBHoya on Sept 20, 2011 15:20:19 GMT -5
*Trying hard to stop posting*... Not to be the "Told ya so" guy, but I am glad to see some people coming around to the need for a place to play games on-campus (and not just a practice facility). I've thought/feared for 5 or 6 years now that a day of reckoning would come, where we'd be split from the football schools and forced to fend for ourselves. And in that scenario, I feel MUCH more optimistic about our chances for success if we have a renovated McDonough that is capable of hosting men's games. NOT a big, new shiny stadium like the Pete or Comcast. But basically, knocking out some walls in McDonough to add in additional and steeper risers to cram more people in. It will not be pretty or state of the art, but it could be a great environment for some home games and would make us a much more stable program. Many people blew off the idea, telling me that McD was too hard to get to, we needed to stay in Verizon. I tried to explain that Verizon is great for a schedule packed with Cuse and UConn and Pitt, but might not be so great if our conference blows up. Here we are.
Plus side, there is still a small amount of time if we act fast. Some semblance of the BE is going to exist for another year or two. We can hopefully survive another year or two beyond that by playing in Verizon (with a few McD games per year) before the air starts to come out of the balloon and the attendance starts to dwindle. That SHOULD be enough time to get something done, if the permits and whatnot were in place. Somehow, I doubt it. I suspect we're looking at several years of curtained off upperdecks at Verizon.
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Post by fsohoya on Sept 20, 2011 15:26:16 GMT -5
*Trying hard to stop posting*... Not to be the "Told ya so" guy, but I am glad to see some people coming around to the need for a place to play games on-campus (and not just a practice facility). I've thought/feared for 5 or 6 years now that a day of reckoning would come, where we'd be split from the football schools and forced to fend for ourselves. And in that scenario, I feel MUCH more optimistic about our chances for success if we have a renovated McDonough that is capable of hosting men's games. NOT a big, new shiny stadium like the Pete or Comcast. But basically, knocking out some walls in McDonough to add in additional and steeper risers to cram more people in. It will not be pretty or state of the art, but it could be a great environment for some home games and would make us a much more stable program. Many people blew off the idea, telling me that McD was too hard to get to, we needed to stay in Verizon. I tried to explain that Verizon is great for a schedule packed with Cuse and UConn and Pitt, but might not be so great if our conference blows up. Here we are. Plus side, there is still a small amount of time if we act fast. Some semblance of the BE is going to exist for another year or two. We can hopefully survive another year or two beyond that by playing in Verizon (with a few McD games per year) before the air starts to come out of the balloon and the attendance starts to dwindle. That SHOULD be enough time to get something done, if the permits and whatnot were in place. Somehow, I doubt it. I suspect we're looking at several years of curtained off upperdecks at Verizon. I'm with you, RB, but Binx as right about the neighbors. Still, we could argue we were just going back to the 1970s/80s status quo!
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Bando
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
I've got some regrets!
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Post by Bando on Sept 20, 2011 15:32:29 GMT -5
*Trying hard to stop posting*... Not to be the "Told ya so" guy, but I am glad to see some people coming around to the need for a place to play games on-campus (and not just a practice facility). I've thought/feared for 5 or 6 years now that a day of reckoning would come, where we'd be split from the football schools and forced to fend for ourselves. And in that scenario, I feel MUCH more optimistic about our chances for success if we have a renovated McDonough that is capable of hosting men's games. NOT a big, new shiny stadium like the Pete or Comcast. But basically, knocking out some walls in McDonough to add in additional and steeper risers to cram more people in. It will not be pretty or state of the art, but it could be a great environment for some home games and would make us a much more stable program. Many people blew off the idea, telling me that McD was too hard to get to, we needed to stay in Verizon. I tried to explain that Verizon is great for a schedule packed with Cuse and UConn and Pitt, but might not be so great if our conference blows up. Here we are. Plus side, there is still a small amount of time if we act fast. Some semblance of the BE is going to exist for another year or two. We can hopefully survive another year or two beyond that by playing in Verizon (with a few McD games per year) before the air starts to come out of the balloon and the attendance starts to dwindle. That SHOULD be enough time to get something done, if the permits and whatnot were in place. Somehow, I doubt it. I suspect we're looking at several years of curtained off upperdecks at Verizon. If we're playing games at an expanded McDonough, then we really are a mid-major. Even a 6000 seat arena would kill season ticket sales (only 100 alumni allowed to go to games!), and the transportation situation would be a complete clusterf---. I continue to be amazed that people see the big enough, on top of a transportation hub Verizon Center as some sort of great evil.
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Post by HometownHoya on Sept 20, 2011 15:36:58 GMT -5
Bando, its not that people see it as a great evil...its that it is a HUGE stadium that even in the top BBall conference in the country, we do not sell out more then 25%. The games that we DO sell out are usually UConn, Cuse, Pitt, L'ville, and WVU...there goes 3 of those. I agree that McD is much too small for where we are but at the same time, it is beginning to look like Verizon MAY be too big.
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Post by fsohoya on Sept 20, 2011 15:39:28 GMT -5
Bando, its not that people see it as a great evil...its that it is a HUGE stadium that even in the top BBall conference in the country, we do not sell out more then 25%. The games that we DO sell out are usually UConn, Cuse, Pitt, L'ville, and WVU...there goes 3 of those. I agree that McD is much too small for where we are but at the same time, it is beginning to look like Verizon MAY be too big. And no one is saying play all games at McD, or just keep McD as-is. Play big games there, but save some money and play smaller ones at McD. It might just be a sacrifice we have to make.
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