Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 5, 2008 14:55:24 GMT -5
The large oil profits are generally cited as evidence that gas prices could be lower without putting poor Exxon out of business. I think of it differently; these companies have the capacity to absorb higher taxes w/o being destroyed. Will that raise gas prices? Probably. Do I care? Not really. Burning fossil fuels creates negative externalities, and if you paid attention in econ, you'll remember that the way to internalize the externality is to tax the bejeezus out of it. As much as it will hurt in the short run, I'm kinda hoping prices get high enough that we actually decide to do something about it as a society. Maybe that makes me insensitive to the Plight of the Working Class, but if you take the tax revenue and spend it on something useful like schools or public health instead of conquest, we'll all end up better off anyway. Who do you think owns "Big Oil"? Just about anybody that has a retirement plan, for instance, or who owns shares in mutual funds, for another instance. So, profit from a business such as oil, results in people's savings or retirement growing. Unfortunately, the rest of the crummy economy is more than offsetting any oil-company windfalls in my portfolio at the moment. |
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Post by atlasfrysmith on Aug 5, 2008 15:06:08 GMT -5
Who do you think owns "Big Oil"? Just about anybody that has a retirement plan, for instance, or who owns shares in mutual funds, for another instance. So, profit from a business such as oil, results in people's savings or retirement growing. Well then the fund managers better move money out of oil stocks before the taxes start. Seriously though, I'm supposed to root for an industry, despite any other misgivings, because someone owns stock in it? My 401k probably has money in defense stocks, too--should we start more wars to help them out? Hey, let's promote smoking; it helps the tobacco companies and the pharmaceutical companies! But my point wasn't about hurting Big Oil, anyway, it was about reducing the use of fossil fuels. Sucks if you make them, sure, but a just government has to legislate on behalf of society as a whole. |
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Post by Coast2CoastHoya on Aug 5, 2008 18:14:25 GMT -5
No 8% isn't huge, but that fact gets completely lost to everyone who watches CNN and only pays attention to headlines where they highlight pointless measures such as profit per hour. Hell even the GAP turned a 7% profit in their latest quarter ($3.4 billion in sales vs. 249 million in profit). Maybe Congress should take up a windfall tax on retailers as well... Ouch, R Street ... I don't even watch CNN. [/feigned offense] But I'm glad you took the bait. We can even forget about profit and just focus on revenue if you like. I don't really care. Hell even Alan Greenspan has expressed his concerns that dominance of oil companies threatens the overall health of the economy in the long run, especially if the benefits the companies realize as a result of assistance* from taxpayers isn't returned, so the companies get a windfall and the taxpayers foot a bill for which they do not realize concommittant benefits. *For those who completely missed my point, no 8% isn't that big (8%, of course, fails to take account of the myriad ways companies can hide profits, many of which Exxon may or may not take advantage of), and no, I'm not picking on companies who turn a profit. Duh! My point was this: taxpayers directly and indirectly subsidize the oil and gas industy in this country as a result of tax breaks, leasing and allowing drilling of natural resources well below market value, direct infrastructure investments to support production, and mitigation projects after the fact -- for which the companies generally do NOT compensate taxpayers. What should we do? Allow the market to set the price, and charge the companies accordingly. Let the windfall go to the American taxpayer for use in paying for problems and issues that affect the nation -- like overreliance on oil. Isn't that the purpose of market capitalism? |
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Post by Coast2CoastHoya on Aug 5, 2008 18:19:12 GMT -5
Also, just wanted to throw this one out there: www.time.com/time/politics/article/0,8599,1829354,00.html?cnn=yes This kind of bald, reckless, shameless, bully-in-the-sandbox crap absolutely sickens me. You want to talk about whether Obama stands for something? How about people using modicum of personal responsibility to help tackle national and global problems. Seems today's Republicans can't even get behind that. Sad. Really, that "sickens" you? Have we all become a bunch of pansies when it comes to political campaigning? This stuff is child's play. Ok, let's pick a different phrase. It Editedes me off and reflects badly on the people saying it, the people promoting it, and the agenda underlying it. It makes me want to grab the nearest jerk with a popped collar and brain him. You want to talk about a bunch of pansies? How about a bunch of whiners who are also hypocrites (thanks Filo): Anybody remember Senate Repubs whining about a filibuster here and there by Senate Dems? www.nytimes.com/2007/12/02/weekinreview/02herszenhorn.html?ref=todayspaper |
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Filo
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,928
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Post by Filo on Aug 5, 2008 21:11:24 GMT -5
You want to talk about a bunch of pansies? How about a bunch of whiners who are also hippocrates:.. C2C -- you have really gone too far. So now you are saying that some republicans are actually physicians from ancient Greece? Can you provide a link, please? |
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Post by StPetersburgHoya (Inactive) on Aug 5, 2008 21:14:11 GMT -5
You want to talk about a bunch of pansies? How about a bunch of whiners who are also hippocrates:.. C2C -- you have really gone too far. So now you are saying that some republicans are actually physicians from ancient Greece? Can you provide a link, please? Good catch, sir. |
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Boz
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
123 Fireballs!
Posts: 10,355
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Post by Boz on Aug 6, 2008 8:51:28 GMT -5
It makes me want to grab the nearest jerk with a popped collar and brain him. Just so you know, while we may disagree politically (and disagree as to the appropriateness and effectiveness of the "tire guage" issue), I wholeheartedly support the assertation that just about* everyone with a popped collar is a jerk....and deserves to be brained. It's worthy of a Constitutional amendment, really. (*if you were actually a singer -- or sax player -- in an 80s band and you are currently on a reunion tour, pop away; otherwise, no excuses; and if your name is Paul Reiser, you need to be put to death) |
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Post by Coast2CoastHoya on Aug 6, 2008 8:51:42 GMT -5
C2C -- you have really gone too far. So now you are saying that some republicans are actually physicians from ancient Greece? Can you provide a link, please? Good catch, sir. Well player, sir. I wonder what So-Crates would say about that .... |
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