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Post by HoyaSinceBirth on Apr 30, 2008 19:52:55 GMT -5
i agree with hilltopper. I think this is a stupid non issue that shouldn't be distracting voters from important issues.
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SaxaCD
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Post by SaxaCD on May 1, 2008 6:39:09 GMT -5
i agree with hilltopper. I think this is a stupid non issue that shouldn't be distracting voters from important issues. I pretty much agree. The attitude reflected in statements like "a typical white woman" is more important to scrutinize and dig into than a nutjob who was an ally and now a pariah for political purposes. |
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on May 1, 2008 11:24:47 GMT -5
Funny how the apparent left-wingers on here are the ones who keep bringing up "but he's black" and "scary black man" over and over. Is being black some sort of negative quality that we shouldn't be mentioning? Please, kc, do elaborate. It shouldn't be a quality one way or the other in electing a president. Usually it's the liberals crying about conservatives being racist, but it's the liberals who keep bringing up race. You're the one who said "scary black man," so why don't YOU elaborate on what you meant. |
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Bando
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Post by Bando on May 1, 2008 16:56:57 GMT -5
"Bringing up race" is not the same thing as "being racist". Simply talking about race is not something to be decried. What I and other liberals are mad at are attacks against Obama on the Wright matter that appeal to racial fear, hence "scary black man." People talk like we now have worry whether Obama is some sort of radical black nationalist, which is patently ridiculous. Playing a game of "gotcha" when someone acknowledges Obama's race is missing the point entirely.
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on May 1, 2008 18:26:57 GMT -5
"Bringing up race" is not the same thing as "being racist". Simply talking about race is not something to be decried. What I and other liberals are mad at are attacks against Obama on the Wright matter that appeal to racial fear, hence "scary black man." People talk like we now have worry whether Obama is some sort of radical black nationalist, which is patently ridiculous. Playing a game of "gotcha" when someone acknowledges Obama's race is missing the point entirely. I just think he's a scary, crazy guy - black, white or whatever. Do we even have "radical black nationalists" around anymore? I think that was before my time (and yours) mostly. In the 60s and 70s??? |
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EasyEd
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Post by EasyEd on May 1, 2008 18:50:21 GMT -5
Northwestern University which had been scheduled to award an Honorary Doctorate of Sacred Theology to Rev. Wright has withdrawn the offer.
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Bando
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Post by Bando on May 1, 2008 19:11:24 GMT -5
"Bringing up race" is not the same thing as "being racist". Simply talking about race is not something to be decried. What I and other liberals are mad at are attacks against Obama on the Wright matter that appeal to racial fear, hence "scary black man." People talk like we now have worry whether Obama is some sort of radical black nationalist, which is patently ridiculous. Playing a game of "gotcha" when someone acknowledges Obama's race is missing the point entirely. I just think he's a scary, crazy guy - black, white or whatever. Do we even have "radical black nationalists" around anymore? I think that was before my time (and yours) mostly. In the 60s and 70s??? No, not that I know of. That's the whole point. Some (certainly not all) conservative groups have said that Obama's relationship with Wright means Obama has to answer for a lot more now. I think that's crazy because Obama obviously doesn't believe in such crazy crap. |
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hoya9797
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Post by hoya9797 on May 1, 2008 20:54:48 GMT -5
OK, well in fairness, you did write the words "scary black man," which, yes, do imply a degree of negativity, no? With respect to Hagee, I will stand corrected if anyone has additional information, but it seems that the only source who says that McCain sought out his endorsement is Hagee himself. Hagee is as much of an egomaniac as Wright, so I'm not really going to buy into that too much. If McCain or his campaign has made donations to his church, written letters soliciting his support, invited him to speak or anything else that would indicate "seeking out" an endorsement, that's one thing. But I put no more into the statement of this loon than I do the statements of the other loon in question, Rev. Wright. Finally, this is a pretty simple analysis, at least in my opinion. Barack Obama is a politician. He joined this church for political advantage. He stayed with Wright for 20 years for political advantage. He is divesting himself now for political advantage (or political survival as the case may be).** No problem. Politicians do that sort of thing. Yes, John McCain, Mr Maverick himself, included. But there is often a price to pay, and Obama is paying it. It won't destroy him, but it will hurt. As will some of Clinton's & McCain's political alliances over the course of the rest of this campaign. **Edit: In a nod to fairness to Obama, everything in each of these stages probably wasn't 100% for political advantage. I'm sure there are/were some noble motives involved as well. But I'm sure it didn't hurt too much to join one of the most influential black churches in this part of Chicago to build his political career. No, the reason he joined wasn't solely for political advantage. He also joined to get a chick. It's not a coincidence that he joined this church and found religion shortly after he met the woman who is now his wife. |
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Post by HoyaSinceBirth on May 2, 2008 9:17:41 GMT -5
I just think there are more important issues to focus on maybe it's just me, but i'd prefer we focused on i don't know healthcare reform, the economey, the energy problem, the enviornment, foreign policy, something like that. that'd be great.
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Boz
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Post by Boz on May 2, 2008 10:18:12 GMT -5
I just think there are more important issues to focus on maybe it's just me, but i'd prefer we focused on i don't know healthcare reform, the economey, the energy problem, the enviornment, foreign policy, something like that. that'd be great. Boooooorrrriiiiinnnnnggg! ;D |
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Post by AustinHoya03 on May 2, 2008 11:00:15 GMT -5
i'd prefer we focused on i don't know healthcare reform I think this non-issue has as much traction as it does (check out the WaPo op-ed page today -- nobody will shut up about this, particularly anyone who leans left) partly because this campaign has been so long, and the candidates haven't said anything new on the issues in MONTHS. I personally feel as if I am being beaten over the head any time Obama or Clinton brings up their health care plan AGAIN. |
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Boz
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Post by Boz on May 2, 2008 14:24:59 GMT -5
Because that dead horse is still lookin' at me funny and is just askin' for a beating..... ;D A Rasmussen survey on the subject at hand: tinyurl.com/5mv5b6 |
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Post by strummer8526 on May 3, 2008 22:51:33 GMT -5
Because that dead horse is still lookin' at me funny and is just askin' for a beating..... ;D A Rasmussen survey on the subject at hand: tinyurl.com/5mv5b6No more dead horse jokes in this election cycle. |
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moe09
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Post by moe09 on May 4, 2008 17:22:05 GMT -5
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EasyEd
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Post by EasyEd on May 4, 2008 18:19:38 GMT -5
The Wright thing is a non-issue just like George Allen's Macaca moment and Trent Lott's Strom Thurmond comment.
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SDHoya
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Post by SDHoya on May 5, 2008 8:48:45 GMT -5
I agree that the Wright issue is really irrelevant as an issue in the campaign. However, the silver lining here is that the Wright issue has finally gotten the media and the public to drop this perception of Obama as being some super-human, post-partisan, hopemonger, whatever BS term or image (like Unifier and Compasionate Conservative). Obama was essentially going to be given the nomination not based on his policies or experience, but rather based on how cool he was. With this Wright controversy, he is all of a sudden not so cool anymore, so he now has to actually show himself as a politician. If he is able to do so, good for him.
Wright helped to show America that Obama is in fact not Black Jesus. That was Earl the Pearl.
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vagrant
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Post by vagrant on May 5, 2008 9:03:42 GMT -5
Some of us decide on a President based on two aspects, issues and character. Because of his youth, I know very little about Obama and this campaign has been the tool through which I am finding out what he stands for and who he is. It is in my opinion wrong to talk only about the issues. Yes, I know these are important, very important.
But just as important is the issue of whether Obama has the character to lead this country forward. And this is where the Rev. Wright issue is troubling. I will never know how Obama truly feels, and it is certainly not important what Obama's faith is, Christian, Jewish, Mormon, Muslim, BLT, etc. But the question remains, if Obama was naive enough not to realize Rev. Wright's positions in these matters, if he was unable to sense the hate in the man, will he be able to understand the hatred of Iran for all things American for example? Will he also be duped by other foreign leaders, or even by his circle of advisors?
I am afraid of a repeat of the Carter disaster which most of you are too young to remember and have learned through revisionist history. Carter is a great man, a man with a huge heart. But Carter was to naive, too gullible. Soon after Brezhnev promised him that the USSR would keep to their borders, a promise that elicited a kiss in the cheek from Carter, Brezhnev invaded Afghanistan. Then there was Iran.
The issues are important but this Rev Wright issue can not go away because Barrack himself teaches us more about himself by continuing to change the story.
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Bando
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Post by Bando on May 5, 2008 10:32:28 GMT -5
New CBS poll: Obama over McCain by 11 points, most Americans approve of his handling of Wright. Link |
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Bando
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Post by Bando on May 5, 2008 10:36:24 GMT -5
Is it possible that there's more to Wright than these sermons, and that his relationship to Obama is more complex that the 20 seconds of one sermon you've seen?
Apparently white preachers who say crazy hateful things are something that aren't as much a big deal (see McCain endorsers Falwell, Hagee, etc.).
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on May 5, 2008 10:54:16 GMT -5
Is it possible that there's more to Wright than these sermons, and that his relationship to Obama is more complex that the 20 seconds of one sermon you've seen? Apparently white preachers who say crazy hateful things are something that aren't as much a big deal (see McCain endorsers Falwell, Hagee, etc.). Wake me when McCain has gone to Falwell's church or Hagee's church for 20+ years, is married by one of those guys, etc. |
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