calhoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,351
|
Post by calhoya on Mar 24, 2008 9:27:33 GMT -5
It was a horrible loss to a talented team playing a home game. Enough said. But how many of us had the Hoyas winning it all? Not this year and not this team. This team is filled with great character guys with a lot of talent, but realistically several other teams this year had more complete "basketball players."
Only one team will not end its season on a losing note. Everyone else goes home with regrets and frustration. Thanks to Roy, Jon, Jr. and Crawford for a great season. But this was not a team built to win it all--at least not without the missing part in Jeff Green.
Hibbert is amazing in his progress over the past 4 years, but still not a very complete basketball player--as the upcoming draft will bear out. He doesn't play to his height and doesn't yet have the athleticism or aggressiveness needed to star at the next level. Wallace is smart, a hell of a shooter, but not quick enough to play defense on the more talented guards. Ewing--what heart and what energy, but not a consistent shot and a little undersized to be a power forward. Summers will be great--as a 3 not a 4. Freeman had an outstanding freshman year, and will improve. Wright--we hardly new you, but wait until next season. Rivers will continue to improve, as will Macklin. They both need to work on offense all summer long.
Just not enough pieces for this year and yet they still had a great season. Let's revel in what this group did and what next year's team can build upon.
|
|
hoyaboy1
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,346
|
Post by hoyaboy1 on Mar 24, 2008 9:38:09 GMT -5
Sports isn't all or nothing. After the initial blow I was extremely happy with last season - heck, I still think about how amazing winning the BE tourney and taking down Vandy and UNC in dramatic fashion in the NCAAs was.
I don't foresee myself looking back on this season with the same attitude; more likely, I'll think about the seniors going out with a blowout loss to Pitt and a debacle against an inferior Davidson team.
|
|
Madgesdiq
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,434
|
Post by Madgesdiq on Mar 24, 2008 9:40:52 GMT -5
Strawman argument.
Why don't you revise the heading of your thread to "WHO EXPECTED THIS TEAM TO ADVANCE FURTHER IN THE NCAA TOURNAMENT THEN TWO TEAMS IT BEAT IN THE LAST 10 DAYS BY A COMBINED 36 POINTS?"
If Brook Lopez's shot bounces a little differently, Georgetown would have had the strange distinction of ending its season with its last 4 wins being against Sweet Sixteen teams.
Certainly, a team good enough to beat Marquette and Louisville in the last week of the BE regular season and blow the doors off Villanova and West Virginia in the BET, had "enough pieces" to make the Final Four and a run at the National Championship.
|
|
calhoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,351
|
Post by calhoya on Mar 24, 2008 10:04:19 GMT -5
It's easy to be fooled by the Hoyas record this year. But we won a lot of games because of poise, not necessarily because we were the more talented team. I think that talent wise, the Big East had a lot of teams that were very close to each other. I think that this year's team was great and I am very upset that they lost--particularly to Davidson, but I did not have them in the Final Four. I had Kansas. Overall, as disappointed as I am, I cannot see this team as underachievers. They were one starting power forward (rebounder) away from the FInal Four, in my opinion.
|
|
theexorcist
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,506
|
Post by theexorcist on Mar 24, 2008 10:16:22 GMT -5
Calhoya - That's the really frustrating thing to me. I may not have really thought GU was going to win it all, but I did think that, in a close game, we were bulletproof.
Well, that and losing to a team whose best player looks exactly like Harold Ford.
Madgesdiq - that's the beauty and pain of a one-and-done tourney.
|
|
Madgesdiq
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,434
|
Post by Madgesdiq on Mar 24, 2008 10:44:57 GMT -5
Madgesdiq - that's the beauty and pain of a one-and-done tourney. I don't disagree with you. But I do disagree with the premise of this thread. This team certainly had accomplished enough this year and had enough battle-tested senior experience to lead one to believe it was capable of a deep tourney run. I imagine they thought so.
|
|
|
Post by Coast2CoastHoya on Mar 24, 2008 11:31:35 GMT -5
Didn't expect us to win it all. Did expect us to make it to the second weekend. I thought all year long we were about Sweet 16 caliber, and could make it to the Final Four with poise, toughness, discipline, and a dash of luck like last year. Too many things went wrong yesterday (despite our awesome stat line, TOs and fouls notwithstanding) for that to happen; our weaknesses were exposed and we fell. After the miracles of the past 2 seasons, I thought that III and the seniors would do it again (or at least could). The fact that it didn't happen, well, happens.
All of this is in the larger context of this team and this coach exceeding any expectation I had for them in 2004, and being 4 points from the mark I expected from them at the start of the 07-08 season.
|
|
|
Post by HometownHoya on Mar 24, 2008 12:04:01 GMT -5
Its the NCAA Tournament...anything can happen, and to be honest...I did actually believe that we could win it all, I admitted the entire time that we would have to be playing flawless (something that we have not seen on a consistent basis) but I did think we had a shot. Losing in the second round to Davidson, that I did not expect at all.
|
|
EasyEd
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 7,272
|
Post by EasyEd on Mar 24, 2008 12:22:50 GMT -5
In answer to your question, no one, except maybe Seth and Gottleib.
|
|
mapei
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,088
|
Post by mapei on Mar 24, 2008 12:54:04 GMT -5
I thought that it would take an extraordinary amount of luck for this year's team to make the final four. Heck, I was surprised that we were good enough to earn a 2 seed. I think that, for the most part, we had less pure talent than top-10 teams and overachieved due to poise, heart, teamwork, and great coaching.
I did think we'd make the round of 16, but I also have watched Davidson enough to know that they were going to beat Gonzaga and make us be at our best to advance. We weren't and we didn't. Basically, we fell a game short of where I thought we would end up.
How it happened yesterday, blowing a 17-point second-half lead, was devastating.
|
|
hifigator
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,387
|
Post by hifigator on Mar 24, 2008 13:03:29 GMT -5
I don't think you should patronize yourself calhoya. Is it the end of the world? No, but to excuse a first weekend exit because you didn't think the boys could win it all is a bit of a stretch at the very least. Personally, in my pools that matter (the ones for money) I had the Hoyas losing to UNC in the Final Four, but I would have been pulling for them in every game. I am not in any way pleased to lose "to a talented team playing a home game."
|
|
jacko
Bulldog (over 250 posts)
GET SOME
Posts: 499
|
Post by jacko on Mar 24, 2008 13:05:31 GMT -5
Expecting them to win based on the idea that you truly believe in your heart that they will win? Or believe it's a real possibility? I think all Hoya fans knew it was a possibility, but didn't legitimately expect them to win. Seriously, did you think this team would play 12 consecutive good halves of basketball? I didn't. I hoped they would, and I knew it was possible. That's what happens in the tourney. You have to assume that the other team will be playing well, unless you're talking about an ugly game like UCLA/Kansas last year or that Maryland/Indiana final a few years back where the W goes to the team that has 35 turnovers instead of 40 or shoots 30% instead of 25%. But we got away with murder a lot this year - against teams that we could beat with subpar stretches. And we had our subpar stretches in last year's tourney (let's just talk about the first 4) - they just never came in the last 10 minutes of a game.
So I guess what I'm saying is that this isn't necessarily surprising to me. But I still can't believe it - if that makes any sense.
|
|
brooklynhoya
Century (over 100 posts)
With a kiss!
Posts: 224
|
Post by brooklynhoya on Mar 24, 2008 13:15:36 GMT -5
I have said all along that this year's time was not better than last year's, and that we were a Sweet 16 team, nothing more. I'm disappointed, but not terribly surprised, that we didn't even get that far. That said, I did have them in the Elite 8 in my bracket.
|
|
the_way
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
The Illest
Posts: 5,419
|
Post by the_way on Mar 24, 2008 13:24:32 GMT -5
Our most talented team under the JTIII era was the 2005-2006 team. They played the National Champions, Florida, the tougest and dominated a good Ohio State team. That team made it to the Sweet Sixteen.
Last year's team, had a nail-biter against Vanderbilt in the Sweet 16 and OT win against a more talented UNC team in the Elite 8 to make it to the Final Four.
This year's team wasn't as strong as the 2 previous teams above. So, at the most, I expected a sweet 16. But given the way we played all year and our weaknesses and flaws, i'm not surprised we lost to a good team like Davidson. We wouldn't have beaten Wisconsin anyway.
|
|
calhoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,351
|
Post by calhoya on Mar 24, 2008 14:35:40 GMT -5
Didn't mean to say that I expected them to lose to Davidson or to Wisconsin for that matter. Certainly did not expect them to blow a 17 point lead in the 2nd half, although we have shown in our losses that we are capable of playing two very different halves.
What I am saying is that when the emotion of the loss begins to fade, I realize that this team was not the most talented team in the country and did not have the best pieces. What it had was good coaching, incredible heart and a group of talented and overachieving seniors combined with promising talent from the junior and younger classes. I really enjoyed the season and refuse to allow a disappointing end to it ruin the memory of this year.
|
|
|
Post by FrazierFanatic on Mar 24, 2008 16:04:45 GMT -5
You had me right up until "overachieving". I don't think they overachieved their potential at all. The coaches, who know a thing or two, picked us as co-favorites to win the BE. The Committee, which knows a thing or two, picked us as a 2 seed. We therefore may have underachieved a little. Thta said, any time you win a major conference outrighr, 2 years in a row, get to the BET finals 2 straight years with one win, and make a final four, you should be darned proud of your accomplishments - and you are right, that is what I will remember about the seniors.
|
|
kghoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,992
|
Post by kghoya on Mar 24, 2008 16:35:57 GMT -5
i did. i mean why not? every other team has flaws and we have jt3 as our coach
i think this loss might be good for him in the long run
of course i hate it more than bum himself right now
|
|
Big Dog
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,912
|
Post by Big Dog on Mar 24, 2008 17:22:30 GMT -5
Actually, lots of us did, or at least seriously believed it to be possible, when the season started, and perhaps even up to and through the Memphis game.
So it all depends on your baseline. This season certainly had some great moments, and the Big East title again was awesome. But I think in the end analysis, doesn't it have to be ruled a disappointment? Do you think this was the way Roy envisioned it would end when he came back? Before the opening tip of the first game, nobody on this board would have been willing to accept "second round exit" as the expectation.
I think the disappointment has to be measured to some degree in light of where this program has come from, but I don't think high expectations are something we should deny--we should embrace them. Its great to be great, and its great to expect great things. All of the best programs do it, and as the recent past has taught us, lowered goals and expectations are a dangerous game. I'm sure the players and coaching staff are very disappointed and we can be to.
|
|
Madgesdiq
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,434
|
Post by Madgesdiq on Mar 24, 2008 18:27:23 GMT -5
I am surprised by how many Georgetown fans on this board expected less from the team than the team expected from themselves.
|
|
calhoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,351
|
Post by calhoya on Mar 24, 2008 19:02:34 GMT -5
I am glad the players expected alot from themselves. I too think that having lofty expectations is a sign that the team has returned to the upper echelon. Yet, while the team could in a perfect world have put together an incredible string of games to win it all, the reality of this team is that it had flaws that werre greater than those of some other teams.
The HOYAs' inconsistency at the FT line, their poor rebounding--offensive and defensive, their lapses in concentration and tendency to rely only on the 3 point shot, their high turnover numbers in many games, and the tendency of their big men to disappear from time to time, did not portend a national championship. Other tournament teams have similar flaws and in many instances more, but the eventual champion will likely not.
No one I have read on this board is more disappointed than I am, but in an effort to be realistic, I did not have the same expectation (at the beginning of the tournament-not the beginning of the season) for this year's tournament team as the last year's team. That is not an attempt to excuse or justify, just to acknowledge what they were when the tournament began.
|
|