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Post by AustinHoya03 on Feb 14, 2008 11:48:13 GMT -5
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SFOHoya
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Post by SFOHoya on Feb 14, 2008 16:37:23 GMT -5
I think we're essentially agreeing with each other: 31in = sucky, 32in = sucky (and, yes, I omitted Frontier because they won't be around for long with Southwest entering DEN).
My point is that all airlines are cramped in the back (31 or 32 inch pitch). If, as you asserted one inch is the difference between "cramped" and "acceptable", then try 4 to 5 extra inches on UA E+ (wow, how low have the airlines set the bar). That is a major differentiator and a loyalty builder, and why I am able to overlook all of UA's flaws - 4 lousy inches.
Now if only the extra inches came with better service too...
On a somewhat related note, Virgin America (32 inches) employees were running around the streets of San Francisco today. They not only listened to my complaints/suggestions, but they also gave me a couple of T-shirts and a re-usable 20% off coupon:
20% off Virgin America Valid on flights until May 21 (blackouts: 3/20- 24). Must be purchased by 2/17 Promo code: flyvirgin
Enjoy!
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Post by AustinHoya03 on Feb 14, 2008 17:05:36 GMT -5
I think we're essentially agreeing with each other: 31in = sucky, 32in = sucky (and, yes, I omitted Frontier because they won't be around for long with Southwest entering DEN). My point is that all airlines are cramped in the back (31 or 32 inch pitch). If, as you asserted one inch is the difference between "cramped" and "acceptable", then try 4 to 5 extra inches on UA E+ (wow, how low have the airlines set the bar). That is a major differentiator and a loyalty builder, and why I am able to overlook all of UA's flaws - 4 lousy inches. Now if only the extra inches came with better service too... Yeah, you're absolutely right -- seats/legroom are crummy/cramped across the board. And United's legroom is identical to Continental and some of the other big carriers as well -- I just used AA and Frontier because I used them in an earlier example. As I said above, I get a deal which ends up being similar to Economy Plus through American, but the barriers to getting there (flying way too much) are considerably higher than the barriers to flying United's Economy Plus. I assumed the barriers were higher, but it looks like UA has a good program going, and I'd certainly take a look at them if I was close to their hubs and deciding between airlines. Really, I'm probably just bitter because the last time I flew United I got stuck in Denver for 8 hours. DIA is a bad place to be stuck.
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theexorcist
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Post by theexorcist on Feb 14, 2008 17:35:17 GMT -5
If you're stuck in DIA and it's morning, go to Cantina Grill Express and get a breakfast burrito, which is amazingly awesome (I also recommend California Tortilla's breakfast burrito at IAD - if not, go for Subway).
And I'm a United Frequent Flier despite getting stuck in Frankfurt for eight hours. The best part was when we had to go through security twice for no real reason.
Best layover? London Heathrow if you're at Silver on oneworld. They had some spa deal that offered a massage (which I didn't take advantage of) and a shower (which I did, and which had six or seven faucets streaming out pulsed water). The executive lounge had fresh-made chili pasta. Mind-blowing.
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The Stig
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Post by The Stig on Feb 14, 2008 17:48:15 GMT -5
I think pitch is overrated. What matters more to me is the overall comfort of the seat. According to www.seatguru.com the Air New Zealand flights I took this summer had less seat pitch in economy than the American Airlines flight I took to Brazil (by 1-2 inches). But the ANZ seat was way more comfortable. It was new, reclined a lot, and was just the right shape. The AA seat was old and ratty, and just didn't fit right. The recline was minimal, and on the way down the seat was broken. For in-flight entertainment, the ANZ flight had TV's on every seat back with games and a huge selection of on-demand movies/TV shows. The AA flight had TV's above the aisles that showed only a couple of movies the whole flight. Legroom won't increase anytime soon because it reduces the number of people on the flight. But airlines could still improve seat comfort and the overall flight experience a lot.
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theexorcist
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Post by theexorcist on Feb 14, 2008 17:54:34 GMT -5
I think pitch is overrated. What matters more to me is the overall comfort of the seat. According to www.seatguru.com the Air New Zealand flights I took this summer had less seat pitch in economy than the American Airlines flight I took to Brazil (by 1-2 inches). But the ANZ seat was way more comfortable. It was new, reclined a lot, and was just the right shape. The AA seat was old and ratty, and just didn't fit right. The recline was minimal, and on the way down the seat was broken. For in-flight entertainment, the ANZ flight had TV's on every seat back with games and a huge selection of on-demand movies/TV shows. The AA flight had TV's above the aisles that showed only a couple of movies the whole flight. Legroom won't increase anytime soon because it reduces the number of people on the flight. But airlines could still improve seat comfort and the overall flight experience a lot. On the on-demand thing. To a degree, it's a crapshoot. The United flight from Sydney to LAX is (or was, last year) a 747 with one screen (that was showing two movies, one of which was Happy Feet, which is possibly the most evil movie ever made). Most flights that have inflight entertainment have advanced to the nine channel option. A few - British Airways, Air Canada and Qantas (as well, apparently, as Air New Zealand), have what is essentially unlimited choices - sixty or so movies (a Qantas flight a year ago included Snakes on a Plane!). The problem is that these are becoming more commonplace as ipods and DVDs become more popular. They're less of a selling point than they were if you can bring whatever movie you want to see with you.
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Cambridge
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Post by Cambridge on Feb 14, 2008 18:59:55 GMT -5
I forgot to mention about Virgin America.
1) USB hookup for ipod at your seat 2) Power slot for laptops and cellphones for charging 3) Software capability and a verbalized commitment to allow internet browsing at your seat in the near future 4) A huge virgin music library on demand for music
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The Stig
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Post by The Stig on Feb 14, 2008 19:47:40 GMT -5
I think United has seatback TV's on all their longhaul flights now, but they're small and they only play movies on a 2 hour loop. It's basically like having a TV with 9 channels that are all playing movies.
AVOD (on-demand movies, TV shows, games, etc.) is becoming a lot more commonplace on long-haul flights. Every international airline I've flown lately (Qantas, Air New Zealand, LAN Chile) on their long-haul flights. American carriers are really behind the times on that, just like they're behind on everything else.
Laptops and such are good, but when you're playing a movie your laptop isn't going to last for even half of a 10 hour flight. When I fly long-haul I watch videos on my laptop on the domestic connecting flights and layovers, and use the onboard entertainment for the long flights.
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SFOHoya
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Post by SFOHoya on Feb 15, 2008 15:58:50 GMT -5
Now CO is also talking to AA. online.wsj.com/article/SB120310411701272037.html?mod=googlenews_wsjArticle also explains the leverage that NW has on CO. Basically, CO can't merge until NW does so first. "Houston-based Continental has said it prefers to remain independent unless the competitive landscape changes and its rivals pair up. The carrier for now is precluded from merging with another airline because Northwest can block such a move by virtue of holding a "golden share" in Continental. But if Northwest agrees to merge with Delta or another airline, Continental could buy back that blocking preferred stock and be free to chart its own course -- even if Northwest's own deal fell apart later."
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The Stig
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Post by The Stig on Feb 16, 2008 22:39:52 GMT -5
Both of them are probably just exploring their options, and I don't see this one going too far. Newark (CO hub) and JFK (AA hub) would create some antitrust issues, and DFW (AA) and Houston (CO) are too close to coexist, and probably too big to scale back without causing a lot of trouble.
Given the relative sizes of the two airlines and the way that AA tends to operate, this "merger" would probably be more of an AA takeover if it were to happen. By most measures AA is about twice the size of Continental.
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hoyatables
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Post by hoyatables on Jun 19, 2008 15:35:17 GMT -5
Just got an email from United telling me that they are teaming up with Continental.
"As a valued Mileage Plus member, we wanted you to be among the first to hear that Continental and United today announced plans to cooperate globally, linking our networks and services worldwide to deliver new benefits to you. In addition, Continental plans to join United in the Star Alliance®, the most comprehensive airline alliance in the world.
Once implemented, this new partnership, will easily enable you to take advantage of the resources of both airlines to enhance your overall travel experience, and receive more value from your Mileage Plus membership.
First and foremost, this partnership will include new frequent flier reciprocity that will enable you to earn miles when flying on either airline and redeem awards on both carriers. Travel on either carrier will count toward earning elite status. Similarly, members of either airline's airport lounge program will have access to both Continental's Presidents Club network and United's Red Carpet Club® lounges.
Second, together with Continental, we will be able to offer you a more comprehensive domestic route network and together with our Star Alliance partners, greater choice of service throughout the entire world.
Starting in the U.S., you are going to see United and Continental develop extensive code-sharing that will facilitate travel whenever your itinerary involves both carriers. We will be able to provide you with a coordinated process for reservations/ticketing, check-in, flight connections and baggage transfer.
Internationally, Continental and United will establish joint ventures that will allow us to cooperate with each other and with other Star Alliance airlines throughout the world. These joint ventures will enable us to provide you with highly competitive flight schedules, fares and service to more destinations than we do today.
In short, once regulatory approval is obtained, this new partnership between United and Continental will expand your choice of flights and destinations, and improve your ability to earn both miles and elite status in Mileage Plus. Together we will offer you more value whenever you fly. We expect to bring you the benefits of our cooperation starting some time in 2009, and until then, we will keep you informed about our progress. "
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The Stig
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Post by The Stig on Jun 19, 2008 16:27:45 GMT -5
Not too surprising. Continental was always going to be the odd man out in Skyteam after NW and DL merged. Continental has three things that Star needs badly - a Texas hub, a New York hub, and a decent airline in the US.
The loser in this is US Airways, who is now in a pretty awkward situation as the 3rd of 3 US airlines in Star. But they suck anyways (just had an awful trip with them), so if they lose out I don't really care.
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Post by AustinHoya03 on May 3, 2010 12:53:35 GMT -5
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The Stig
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Post by The Stig on May 3, 2010 13:04:25 GMT -5
Took them long enough!
I think they've done a good job so far of bringing in the best of both worlds. Continental was the better run airline, United had the stronger brand name, so having Continental people run an airline called United was a good choice.
The big loser here will probably be Cleveland. The hub there is likely to disappear, thanks to United's Chicago hub. United's Dulles hub might be under threat too, although they could conceivably keep both Newark and Dulles.
US Airways gets shafted once again, and once again I don't shed a tear for that godawful excuse for an airline.
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EasyEd
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Post by EasyEd on May 3, 2010 15:54:45 GMT -5
Substitute Big Ten for United/Continental and Georgetown for Cleveland hub. Similar?
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on May 3, 2010 16:53:47 GMT -5
Cleveland is already more of a regional hub, anyway, and I could see it staying that way. I'm not sure O'Hare is big enough to play that role as well. Of course it is going to lose out on some flights, but there's so many little regional jets out of there I'm not sure you could merge.
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