2007 US News Rankings

[hilltopper2000]

SFHoya -- I agree with you that GU shouldn't try to improve its student body merely because it does not want to fall in the rankings. It should improve its student body because it should want to be a great school and the quality of students is a MAJOR component.

[Jack]

The financial stuff is confusing and no one has all the facts here, so I will avoid it. As for the SATs, lets just say that is one of the more easily manipulated factors, and increasing the average SAT like Washington U has done it is not likely what people would want. Quite simply, if you want higher SAT scores, you make your admission decisions based on SATs to the exclusion of other factors, then you throw money at kids with high SAT scores whether they need it or not.

I am proud Georgetown does not follow that philosophy and still manages to get such strong scores. Sure, SATs matter in the admissions process, but rank in class means more, and looking for kids from non-traditonal backgrounds (with lower scores usually) means a lot. Even if Georgetown was flush with cash, it would be far better served using that cash to go after more kids with lower scores but lots of financial need than paying the way for kids who had the best SAT prep courses.

[SFHoya99]

hilltopper2000 said:

SFHoya -- I agree with you that GU shouldn't try to improve its student body merely because it does not want to fall in the rankings. It should improve its student body because it should want to be a great school and the quality of students is a MAJOR component.

Well, the second part of my argument is

"Quality of Students" should not equal High SATs. And I got in on my SATs, I think.

[SFHoya99]

Financially, our credit rating/inability to acquire more credit looks to be more based on an inability to turn an operating profit than it does to be an amount of debt issue. Our debt to asset ratio isn't the worst I've seen (although I admit I don't know University averages) and our some of our assets are probably vastly understated on the balance sheet (namely land...anyone else think Georgetown University is probably worth more -- land and buildings -- than $700MM?).

Of course, we do have positive cash flow and only $33MM in interest payments. I guess I am missing something b/c it's a school, but if this were a business I don't think they'd be tapped out debt wise.

[hilltopper2000]

Jack -- I understand your point, but it does not look like Wash U is basing admissions on SATs to the exclusion of grades, as it has a higher percentage of students in the top 10% of their high school classes. I'm suggesting throwing money at top students, not just those with high SATs. The whole reason U.S. News went to the 25 - 75% range (so they say) is to allow schools to admit up to 25% of the class without worrying how it would affect their rankings. That's plenty to fill with "non-traditional" students. I don't dispute that GU must also do a better job with financial aid generally.

[SoCalHoya]

Folks should look into the Georgetown Scholarship Program. It's a really good cause and I hope it catches fire.

[CTHoya08]

For what it's worth, one of my friends at Georgetown is transfer student from Vanderbilt, and he has stated that despite Vandy's higher ranking Georgetown is cleary a better/more competitive school, based on the students he has known at both. Granted, this is based on a subjective judgment made by a student, but the fact is that money seems to play a much bigger role in these rankings than it does in the lives of the students and the process by which prospective students pick schools.

[Nitrorebel]

I can only corroborate that type of anecdotal evidence from a slightly different angle. In terms of reputation abroad, Georgetown is almost on the level of Harvard and Yale, and higher than most Ivies and other top 25 schools (most people abroad are more likely to know about G-town than Brown or Dartmouth). So in terms of international credibility, G-town is extremely well respected.

Another interesting stat is one the Wall Street Journal compiles of which undergrad programs send their students to the top graduate programs. G-town consistently ranks in the top 10 in getting its undergrads into the best biz, med, law and non-vocational graduate programs. Again, this isn't factored into the US News Rankings.