Collegiate Licensing

[CO_Hoya]

Link to AP story:

Collegiate Licensing Company (CLC) released its annual list of top schools for licensing revenue for the '05-'06 school year. U of Texas came in #1 (displacing UNC, the 5-time champ until this year) with $8.2 in royalties.


Further info from CLC website:

Georgetown came in 54th, just ahead of Fresno St. and behind such national powers as Colorado St. (52) and Marshall (48).

Other private schools in the top 75 include Duke (23), Stanford (41), BYU (47), Gonzaga (50), Villanova (58), Marquette (69).

Other Big East schools: Notre Dame (3), L'ville (32), Syracuse (33), UConn (36), Pitt (37), Cinci (42), USF (65!)

[StPetersburgHoya (Inactive)]

A couple of questions:

1) Where does the University of South Carolina come in? - they have a clever marketing strategy...
2) Why is UCONN so low?

[LizziebethHoya]

Considering we don't have a Div I-A football team, which fuels a ton of this money especially for Southern and Midwestern schools, this is pretty good for us.

To answer #2) UConn is probably so low because their Div I-A football program is relatively new.

[GIGAFAN99]

SC is #20.

As for question #2, UConn's low because their football team isn't any good and Connecticut isn't a large state. Football drives all this.

Put it this way, Duke is far and away the most popular private school basketball team in the nation with almost every game televised and a huge bandwagon following. But their football team is terrible. They're #23.

Notre Dame is the football equivalent amongst private schools and they're #3.

It is impressive that Georgetown is #54 as a private school with D-1AA football and Gonzaga at #50 is just plain incredible. Go Jesuits!

[TrueHoyaBlue]

Does anyone remember/know what GU ranked in recent years? I feel like this is an improvement, but I'm not sure.

[GIGAFAN99]

Nah, we continue to fall but it's more about that sport with the oblong ball. Duke used to be top 20 every year, but even with Shelden and JJ finished outside the top 20 for the third straight year because Spurrier's the only one giving them top 25 votes in football ;D.

2005: 49
2004: 44
2003: 42
2002: 40
2001: 38

[Oh My!]

I could be wrong, but I am fairly certain we were #1 in CLC sales for a few years in the mid-80's, and maybe even when AI was on campus. I do not necessarily believe it is ourely football driven. Yes, football puts many schools higher on the list, but I doubt that UNC cracks the Top 5 due to its gridiron performances.

While NCAA Football is admittedly "corporate", basketball drives more financially for the NCAA as a whole. On Coach's show this week, Gary Williams stated that 80% of the NCAA's operating budget comes from Men's Basketball. So, we shouldn't sell MBB short.

I understand that the CLC's role is to ensure legal revenues for university apparel, etc., which help strengthen school budgets. I also know that we receive a check from CLC every year, based on licensed sales. When we were winning conference & national championships, we were very high (if not #1) on the sales list.

I seem to recall that the only TEAM of any level that we trailed for one particular year was the Oakland Raiders.

[lichoya68]

VEGAS RAIN I THINK YOUR right that we may have beeen numero unowithout the oblong ball in the eighties or close to it go hoyas WERE BACK THOSE NUMBERS WILL RISE we are georgetown go hoyas ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

[DFW HOYA]

gigafan99 said:

2005: 49
2004: 44
2003: 42
2002: 40
2001: 38

And in 1991...#1.

I've spend the better part of a half hour trying to contain my complete aggravation over this issue, a continuing misstep by many segments of the University (and not limited to athletics) to understand how to effectively market itself. If someone had told you that, coming off national exposure unseen in the last decade and a Sweet 16 appearance, that Georgetown would drop to its lowest level in licensing, what would you have thought?

I fault Nike for a lot of things in their relationship with Georgetown, but not on this one. This isn't a "oh, it's football" matter--ask how Gonzaga has leapfrogged Georgetown on this one. Georgetown, and not just athletics, has to make this a priority, but like a lot of GU priorities, it's stuck in the mud. For a school which is underfunded beyond peer, what would an this kind of licensing revenue do at Georgetown? That could provide ready money for scholarships, for coaches, and for training. An extra $1 million in licensing revenue is the equivalent of someone setting up a $20 million endowment for GU athletics. And that's money that Georgetown is losing in the marketplace every single day.

It's not enough for younger alumni to think "JT3 is here, all is well"--that's a huge disservice to him and to all the teams. Georgetown will play itself right out of major college athletics in the next decade if it fails to act upon the infrastructure needs for its teams. Licensing needs to be a visible priority for Georgetown, and not just for a few months in the winter.

1. Market the football jerseys. A lot of people will never see a Georgetown game in person, but why not have them wear the jersey? Ebay is full of Georgetown jersey knockoffs, some in black and gold (presumably from some importer that didn't check on the school colors.)

2. Market the lacrosse jerseys. This is a growth sport nationwide--why not have a lot of junior high and high schoolers wearing the colors to their school or a game? And market crew, too. Years ago, I was at a conference where someone sported a "Hoya Crew" cap. I asked him when he had rowed. He wasn't even from GU, he just liked the look of the cap.

3. Market closer to home. When was the last time the fan base was actively marketed to buy licensed products? But if you visit the bookstore web site or the atheltics web site, most of the items are either non-clothing (e.g., license plate holders) or simply out of date merchandise. I remember going to the bookstore last year and seeing 2003-era Mike Sweetney jerseys in the place, and not a single Bowman, Owens, or Cook jersey in sight. And can someone please stop the bookstore from marketing Kurt-shirt rip-offs?

Please, please let's make this a priority before Georgetown simply falls off the licensing map altogether.

P.S. Chevy Chase Bank just gave $20 million to Maryland athletics. Remember that the next time the announcers ask you to waive your CCB cards at MCI Center.

[GIGAFAN99]

vegasrain said:

I could be wrong, but I am fairly certain we were #1 in CLC sales for a few years in the mid-80's, and maybe even when AI was on campus. I do not necessarily believe it is ourely football driven. Yes, football puts many schools higher on the list, but I doubt that UNC cracks the Top 5 due to its gridiron performances.

While NCAA Football is admittedly "corporate", basketball drives more financially for the NCAA as a whole. On Coach's show this week, Gary Williams stated that 80% of the NCAA's operating budget comes from Men's Basketball. So, we shouldn't sell MBB short.

I understand that the CLC's role is to ensure legal revenues for university apparel, etc., which help strengthen school budgets. I also know that we receive a check from CLC every year, based on licensed sales. When we were winning conference & national championships, we were very high (if not #1) on the sales list.

I seem to recall that the only TEAM of any level that we trailed for one particular year was the Oakland Raiders.

That might have been true 20 years ago and I've always heard that rumor on this board. No idea if it's true but if it was, sweet.

But many of the major football teams weren't major basketball players back then either. And UNC is a gigantic institution that represents an entire state and is good at tons of sports (including football). That's the biggest factor I think. Not only do many of these schools have a big football following but also they represent entire states and massive alumni bases. So of course that generates sales numbers.

But we're third amongst teams that do not play 1-A football. And with mustache-man gone from the Zags, we'll be back at #1 or #2 next year like we are every year. I think that's pretty good for a private school with one recognizable team nationally and a real testament to the brand JT built. How many logos are as recognizable as ours?

My final thought is with young Ewing's number choice I think we can expect a good year for sales. I can't believe anyone wouldn't want him to have that number. It's free hype.

Edit: I like some of DFWs suggestions and there's room for improvement with marketing of course but let's be reasonable on the importance of this ranking. These numbers are based on pure volume and it's a whole new ballgame for licensing. We can get better but the fall from #1 was hardly removed from environmental factors. Gonzaga's "leapfrog" occurs after years of top 5 rankings and an extremely popular and recognizable player. It's not like they're #4, they're #50 and I'd bet they're not there next year. Also, we can't be blind to the fact that JT is an icon in the black community and the 1980s Hoyas weren't just "good" and that's why we sold jerseys. If that were the case Duke would at least be top ten wouldn't you think? But JT was a trailblazer and his teams had a strong urban following by the nature of being so much more than just a basketball coach. Georgetown basketball was identifiable as a rallying point for alumni and as a symbol of strength and resilience of an entire race at one point (I actually don't think I'm overstating that but stop me if so). That can't be re-created by selling lacrosse jerseys.

[FromTheBeginning]

Georgetown's marketing sucks. You can watch a lacrosse game on CSTV, get all pumped up, go on the website and not be able to buy a lacrosse jersey. You can't find one the bookstore or Yates. The best looking lacrosse tee shirt I could find on campus last year was cream colored with black lettering - what is that all about?
You can't find football jerseys or up-to-date basketball jerseys
on the website. All you have to do is go to the website of any of the major basketball schools we want to consider ourselves equal to and you realize how bad our situation is.
Any kid who watches a Hoya game on TV should have easy access to a way to purchase a jersey, a teeshirt, a hat, but our website sucks and you can't find anything in stores. You can't find anything on the Jordan website.
Yes, we were #1 back in the 80's - both on the court and in merchandise sales. You could go into any sporting goods chain store and find a selection of hats, shirts, jackets - now you're lucky if you find one hat. You would see jackets everywhere. There was a store in that mall at Wisconson and M that sold nothing but Gergetown stuff. And this was before the ease of internet shopping. As we hopefully continue our return to where GU basketball needs to be - it is essential that we be able to take advantage of "opportunity revenue" streams created by that kid in NYC, LA, Dallas, Chicago or anywhere USA - the impulse buyer who might, for only a few hours after a TV game, be willing to plunk down 20 bucks for a hat or 50 for a jersey. For every lost sale, there is one less person out there putting the item and the GU name in front of other potential buyers.
I'm sure there are much brighter marketing minds than mine out there in the university community, both among the students and alumni. It is imperative that the University use this resource to
both market it's products and seek input into reviewing the design and selection of the merchandise offered.

[Gold Hoya]

Are we really going to talk about Georgetown being #1 in licensing revenue in the late '80s and early '90s without even mentioning street gangs? I can't say I've ever seen the effect quantified, but growing up near Chicago I was certainly aware that a prominent street gang dressed in Hoyas gear.

www.chitown.com/bigshoulders/gngcolor.html

[guru]

excellent point on the reasons behind our surge in merchandising popularity in the 80s/90s. Most (not all, but most) of the schools that rank highly on that list are far bigger than Georgetown. In fact, I'd say our ranking is just about right where most would expect it to be. Seriously, how much of an appetite is there out there for Georgetown football jerseys? I can see the frustration that they are not available, but c'mon - it's not like those things would be flying off the shelves anywhere but at reunions. There is room for improvement in this area, don't get me wrong, but I'm not sure a marketing push behind Georgetown merchandise would end up bringing all that much more money in. And I can't see many alumni being too happy if the colors became associated with gang life again...

[RBHoya]

I think people would buy GU football jerseys if they were in greater circulation. Blue, gray, and like it or not, black, are popular colors for men's apparel. If the jersey looks really cool, people will buy it. There are some people who buy sports apparel because they support the particular team, and there are some that just buy what looks nice on them. I'll bet UNC sold a lot of football jerseys in addition to all of their basketball gear, and not so much because people support UNC football (though of course some do), but just because people dig the baby blue and white look. The same applies to a lot of other sports jerseys.... success on the field or court is obviously a huge factor, but there is a whole other group that purchases this kind of stuff based solely on appearance, not team quality or alumni affiliation. If done properly, Georgetown football jerseys could do just fine in this crowd, IMO.

[DFW HOYA]

The gang color discussion is a non-issue and Georgetown is largely powerless to do anything about it anyway.

To Guru's point, yes, there was a marketing push in the 1980's to position Georgetown merchandise and it paid off, literally.

Check a quote from the AP story: "After the Longhorns beat USC in the Rose Bowl, the school's 450 licensees sold everything from key chains to mini football helmets to a Waterford crystal football." 450 licensees.. Georgetown needs to get its brand out in more areas so that it becomes so visible one doesn't associate it with gangs.

Did anyone see the Georgetown apparel sold on the bookstore web site? So much for selection...

www.bkstr.com/CategoryDisplay/10001-10029-11006-1?demoKey=d

[Gold Hoya]

DFW, that's exactly why gang colors ARE an issue. For most people in the country (non-Catholic, not familiar with top academic institutions), Georgetown is basketball, and for a time, many people DID associate the brand with gangs. Incidentally, I think this has basically passed; right now, Georgetown hats do not appear at "Lids" stores outside the DC area (not even at the Philly airport) while Texas, Duke, and many others are Lids mainstays.

Ultimately, even though we have different diagnoses, both of us propose the same cure: Georgetown needs to be active in spreading a positive brand image.

[StPetersburgHoya (Inactive)]

Gold - Its a good thing you wrote the word active in bold. There are a number of people who have an indirect impact on building the Georgetown brand from the AD's office to Hoya Blue - but I don't think there is any one person or office that is charged specifically with brand management - its a very important position because McDonough is already over-worked and trying to replace staff - a number of people there do a lot - but much of it is smaller picture - selling season tickets, setting up promotions, web-site design, donor liasons - all of these people have an indirect impact on brand management but their looking at the trees and not the forest - to a certain extent this is something that an AD would do, but its more of a full time job - I don't know if we have the resources to hire or outsource brand management of Georgetown athletics - but it would seem like an investment that would eventually pay for itself.

[AustinHoya03]

fromthebeginning said:

You can watch a lacrosse game on CSTV, get all pumped up, go on the website and not be able to buy a lacrosse jersey.

Hell, I was in the bookstore last month looking for lax shorts and the bookstore didn't even have those. How many pairs of lax shorts could we sell to prep school kids throughout the Mid-Atlantic?

I think the one of DFW's points I liked best was marketing close to home. This path has been taken with success by other private schools and some smaller state schools. Seems like finishing the MSF will/would be a good first step in boosting local attendance.

[JimmyHoya]

Crimeny.

Untill Urick gets us to at least another Final Four and we actually do something besides beating up on St. John's and letting the elite teams rip us up, we'll never have that great a following.

Lacrosse shirts...okay, but jerseys? Y'all are grasping. Lax jersey's are straight up goofy looking, and nobody collects them like they do basketball, football, soccer, etc. jerseys.

I think people are fooling themselves if they have any aspirations of us returning to even top 30 status on this list. It's simply not going to happen unless JT3 suddenly starts breaking down racial barriers and becaomes the poor urbanites' savior. The school wasn't selling itself--the TEAM wasn't even selling itself--it was John Thompson, Jr.

[Frank Black]

I enjoyed the gang website. I like the fact that in gangland, 'Hoyas' stands for "Hoover's On Your A$$". Awesome. Damn FBI! Now the truth can be told: The only reason I'm wearing my Georgetown t-shirt is to express my disdain for J. Edgar Hoover who, with his band of G Men, is on my a$$.