hoyazeke
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Post by hoyazeke on Sept 7, 2021 8:19:33 GMT -5
How big do you think MV7 was? They are the same size.. right around 6ft and 180lbs... You must be thinking about Aaron Brooks. Another NN kid in that era who was a pro. If I'm not mistaken, Vick was a legit 6' and played around 215. Allen is, maybe 5'11" and couldn't sniff 180. The NBA doesn't fudge measurements but you are correct that Vick bulked during college and the NFL. AI didn't put on much weight until after retirement. The debate is about high school careers and they were about the same size during their high school careers.
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hoyainla
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Bubbachuck
Sept 7, 2021 10:32:44 GMT -5
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Post by hoyainla on Sept 7, 2021 10:32:44 GMT -5
Curry played for Hampton, AI play for Bethel just as much talent as Warwick No. I know who Chuck played for. I was just giving reference to the talent difference between Warwick's Vick teams and Bethel's Chuck teams. Bethel was a power on the peninsula until about 5yrs ago. Warwick had 2 good teams in the 90s and really none since.... Vick's teams and in the early 90s Antonio Banks teams were good. The only reason Warwick was good in the late 90s was because Ferguson closed and we got Vick and Butta (he went to Norfolk St). I know we love AI but most on this board can't debate 90s peninsula football with me. Once again Chuck was great but MV7 was next level. Kinda like Barry Sanders to Eric Dickerson. Both were great but Barry was on another level. Comparing Vick to AI and just talking about QB is like trying to compare Vlad Jr to Ohtani and saying Vlad is better because he’s a better hitter and ignoring that Ohtani also pitches. Vick played QB. Bubba did it ALL! Which would you have rather had on your team?
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paranoia2
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Post by paranoia2 on Sept 7, 2021 10:39:23 GMT -5
I happened to get field passes for an Eagles vs. Jets NFL game some years back. Walking on the sidelines during warmups was amazing.
Vick would take a few steps back flick his wrist & the ball exploded out like a howitzer. I swear I could hear it whistling. On the other half of the field Mark Sanchez would take a few determined steps and fire with his body behind it & it didn’t even come close to Vick’s velocity.
If football was Iverson’s true love I wonder just how good he could have been. He certainly was among the most skilled NBA players. As it has been pointed out here by myself and others if AI was 6’6” he would have given MJ a run for GOAT.
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hoyazeke
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Bubbachuck
Sept 7, 2021 10:43:34 GMT -5
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Post by hoyazeke on Sept 7, 2021 10:43:34 GMT -5
You don't think Mike could've played D? He was too valuable to his team to risk it. I'm not saying Chuck wasn't also but if you lose Chuck Bethel is still a 6-7 win team if Warwick loses Mike they are a 2 win team. He is so much better at QB than Chuck I would definitely sacrifice the picks that he would've gotten at safety....
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hoyainla
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Post by hoyainla on Sept 7, 2021 13:42:40 GMT -5
You don't think Mike could've played D? He was too valuable to his team to risk it. I'm not saying Chuck wasn't also but if you lose Chuck Bethel is still a 6-7 win team if Warwick loses Mike they are a 2 win team. He is so much better at QB than Chuck I would definitely sacrifice the picks that he would've gotten at safety.... Bubba led Bethel to the title in 1992 and they went 6-4 in 1993. Warwick won just as many games if not more the few years after Mike left. Mike threw for 1600 yards as a senior. Bubba threw for 1400 as a JUNIOR. Mike ran for 1050 yards and 18 TDs in his high school career. Bubba ran for 780 and 14 TDs as a JUNIOR. Oh he returned 5 kicks and had 8 picks that year as well. If you want to say Mike was a better passer and traditional QB alright. Get out of here with that better player stuff and he surely wasn't a better athlete. You must've went to Warwick or Hampton.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2021 13:56:38 GMT -5
I happened to get field passes for an Eagles vs. Jets NFL game some years back. Walking on the sidelines during warmups was amazing. Vick would take a few steps back flick his wrist & the ball exploded out like a howitzer. I swear I could hear it whistling. On the other half of the field Mark Sanchez would take a few determined steps and fire with his body behind it & it didn’t even come close to Vick’s velocity. If football was Iverson’s true love I wonder just how good he could have been. He certainly was among the most skilled NBA players. As it has been pointed out here by myself and others if AI was 6’6” he would have given MJ a run for GOAT. I was told that Iverson, when he played for the 6'ers, he would go on the football field and throw the football 75 yards down the field effortlessly.
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hoyazeke
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Bubbachuck
Sept 7, 2021 14:27:02 GMT -5
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Post by hoyazeke on Sept 7, 2021 14:27:02 GMT -5
You don't think Mike could've played D? He was too valuable to his team to risk it. I'm not saying Chuck wasn't also but if you lose Chuck Bethel is still a 6-7 win team if Warwick loses Mike they are a 2 win team. He is so much better at QB than Chuck I would definitely sacrifice the picks that he would've gotten at safety.... Bubba led Bethel to the title in 1992 and they went 6-4 in 1993. Warwick won just as many games if not more the few years after Mike left. Mike threw for 1600 yards as a senior. Bubba threw for 1400 as a JUNIOR. Mike ran for 1050 yards and 18 TDs in his high school career. Bubba ran for 780 and 14 TDs as a JUNIOR. Oh he returned 5 kicks and had 8 picks that year as well. If you want to say Mike was a better passer and traditional QB alright. Get out of here with that better player stuff and he surely wasn't a better athlete. You must've went to Warwick or Hampton. Bubba led bethel to state c'ships in football and bball. You can't throw stats at me. Yes I'm Warwick class of '93. Warwick stayed competitive only because Marcus followed Mike. Bethel was loaded with D1 talent and as I said earlier Warwick was Mike and the miracles. If Mike could switch places with Chuck or Curry he is VAs greatest football player ever. If Chuck goes the football route he's a 10yr vet at CB or safety.
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hoyainla
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Post by hoyainla on Sept 7, 2021 15:33:02 GMT -5
Bubba led Bethel to the title in 1992 and they went 6-4 in 1993. Warwick won just as many games if not more the few years after Mike left. Mike threw for 1600 yards as a senior. Bubba threw for 1400 as a JUNIOR. Mike ran for 1050 yards and 18 TDs in his high school career. Bubba ran for 780 and 14 TDs as a JUNIOR. Oh he returned 5 kicks and had 8 picks that year as well. If you want to say Mike was a better passer and traditional QB alright. Get out of here with that better player stuff and he surely wasn't a better athlete. You must've went to Warwick or Hampton. Bubba led bethel to state c'ships in football and bball. You can't throw stats at me. Yes I'm Warwick class of '93. Warwick stayed competitive only because Marcus followed Mike. Bethel was loaded with D1 talent and as I said earlier Warwick was Mike and the miracles. If Mike could switch places with Chuck or Curry he is VAs greatest football player ever. If Chuck goes the football route he's a 10yr vet at CB or safety. I knew you had to be Warwick or Hampton. Your judgement is clouded. You will likely find yourself on an island on this one unless surrounded by Warwick people. Bubba was clear the better football player and it wasn't close.
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hoyas315
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Post by hoyas315 on Sept 7, 2021 16:32:31 GMT -5
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rockhoya
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Sept 7, 2021 16:39:54 GMT -5
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Post by rockhoya on Sept 7, 2021 16:39:54 GMT -5
Bubba led bethel to state c'ships in football and bball. You can't throw stats at me. Yes I'm Warwick class of '93. Warwick stayed competitive only because Marcus followed Mike. Bethel was loaded with D1 talent and as I said earlier Warwick was Mike and the miracles. If Mike could switch places with Chuck or Curry he is VAs greatest football player ever. If Chuck goes the football route he's a 10yr vet at CB or safety. I knew you had to be Warwick or Hampton. Your judgement is clouded. You will likely find yourself on an island on this one unless surrounded by Warwick people. Bubba was clear the better football player and it wasn't close. You’re moving the goalposts and misunderstanding what he’s saying. Even the logic you tried to apply was pretty flawed. Besides all that, no, he’s not on an island because he’s right about the programs and their level of talent/balance at the time.
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hoyainla
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Post by hoyainla on Sept 7, 2021 16:51:51 GMT -5
I knew you had to be Warwick or Hampton. Your judgement is clouded. You will likely find yourself on an island on this one unless surrounded by Warwick people. Bubba was clear the better football player and it wasn't close. You’re moving the goalposts and misunderstanding what he’s saying. Even the logic you tried to apply was pretty flawed. Besides all that, no, he’s not on an island because he’s right about the programs and their level of talent/balance at the time. Now that you are on his side I'm even more confident in my side. I moved no goalposts. He seems to be arguing Vick is the better NFL style QB which he was. Bubba was the better football player. Ask anyone who watched them play that didn't go to Warwick and they will tell you. The stats and records back it up. It's not close.
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hoyazeke
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Sept 7, 2021 19:18:24 GMT -5
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Post by hoyazeke on Sept 7, 2021 19:18:24 GMT -5
You’re moving the goalposts and misunderstanding what he’s saying. Even the logic you tried to apply was pretty flawed. Besides all that, no, he’s not on an island because he’s right about the programs and their level of talent/balance at the time. Now that you are on his side I'm even more confident in my side. I moved no goalposts. He seems to be arguing Vick is the better NFL style QB which he was. Bubba was the better football player. Ask anyone who watched them play that didn't go to Warwick and they will tell you. The stats and records back it up. It's not close. I'm arguing that Mike was the better football player and as Rock stated (maybe I didn't state clearly enough) the level of talent surrounding you allows you to skew the stats. I thought my last sentence would have cleared my position. There's a reason Chuck choose bball over football. You see highlights of Chuck level football players every 5-10yrs. You see highlights of MV7 level football players every 20-25yrs....
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hoyas315
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Post by hoyas315 on Sept 9, 2021 11:06:50 GMT -5
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rockhoya
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Bubbachuck
Sept 9, 2021 12:32:31 GMT -5
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Post by rockhoya on Sept 9, 2021 12:32:31 GMT -5
You’re moving the goalposts and misunderstanding what he’s saying. Even the logic you tried to apply was pretty flawed. Besides all that, no, he’s not on an island because he’s right about the programs and their level of talent/balance at the time. Now that you are on his side I'm even more confident in my side. I moved no goalposts. He seems to be arguing Vick is the better NFL style QB which he was. Bubba was the better football player. Ask anyone who watched them play that didn't go to Warwick and they will tell you. The stats and records back it up. It's not close. I just asked someone who didn’t go to Warwick (even though it’s unfair to automatically imply bias by association about someone you don’t even know, but you’ll miss that irony too I’m sure) and they actually said your interpretation was incorrect as well 🤷🏽♂️
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Post by HamptonHoya on Sept 11, 2021 7:42:19 GMT -5
It just so happens that someone interviewed Chris Webber recently and the asked him who was the best athlete he ever saw. How timely is this? thespun.com/nba/philadelphia-76ers/chris-webber-names-best-nba-athlete-he-ever-played-with-allen-iverson-76ersI have always been proud of the 757 and the Peninsula District because of it's relatively small size produced some amazing athletes. Iverson won back to back championships, football (1992) and basketball (1993). Curry won football (1995, 1996 and 1997) and basketball (1998). Vick didn't win championships in high school (last playing season 1997 or 1998), it wasn't due to his lack of talent or effort, but you need talent around you (which we have all witnessed). That didn't stop Vick from being a huge recruit. www.dailypress.com/news/dp-xpm-20040926-2004-09-26-0409230365-story.htmlAs an aside, our area has always supported high school sports. During Iverson's basketball season, his teammate was Tony Rutland (who went on to having a great career at Wake Forest playing alongside Tim Duncan). Their rival was Damon Bacote of Hampton (who went on to play at Richmond and Alabama). The first game was oversold, fire department came out, turned people away almost had our own Palace Malay. Ultimately they played at the Coliseum in front of 8,000 (for a high school game!). www.dailypress.com/757teamz/dp-spt_hamptonbethelcoliseum_01jan31-story.htmlSorry, you guys had me strolling down memory lane. I am looking forward to this year's Hoya squad having people talk about it for years to come.
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Post by Lethal_Interjection on Sept 12, 2021 7:56:02 GMT -5
Ha, my wife went to school (Kecoughtan) with AI's wife
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hoyas315
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Bubbachuck
Sept 12, 2021 9:52:15 GMT -5
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Post by hoyas315 on Sept 12, 2021 9:52:15 GMT -5
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Post by HamptonHoya on Sept 12, 2021 15:33:35 GMT -5
I am amazed by the number of people on the board with ties to the 757.
I am glad I wàs able to witness some incredible athletes before they were household names. You never know if an athlete is neighborhood good or high school good or D1 good or professional good. 3 guys were raised 20 miles of each other and were number 1 picks in their respective sports in 6 years (Joe Smith 1995, Iverson 1996 and Vick 2001).
Yeah, I am counting all of 757. Going all the way back to Lawrence Taylor (although we were all 804 then).
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Post by hoyavafan1 on Sept 13, 2021 22:15:03 GMT -5
Kecoughtan Warriors 82’ graduate here. 👍🏿👍🏿👍🏿
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Post by HamptonHoya on Sept 14, 2021 5:10:37 GMT -5
Bethel Bruin class of 1985 here.
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