prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by prhoya on Jan 30, 2020 11:16:16 GMT -5
I want!
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madgesiq92
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by madgesiq92 on Jan 30, 2020 17:16:59 GMT -5
A kid who believed the hype that he was a one and done might not have made the classroom a “priority” at a school like Kentucky — I would place the over under at the number of credits he has at An Andrew Gaze level of 1. My best guess is he’s done w college hoops.
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madhoya
Bulldog (over 250 posts)
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Post by madhoya on Jan 31, 2020 20:10:51 GMT -5
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trillesthoya
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Member is Online
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Post by trillesthoya on Jan 31, 2020 20:13:53 GMT -5
For the lazy... Whitney is supposedly prefers going pro than transferring at this point. I don't see how this is a good idea at all for him. I don't know his personal situation, but he showed very little this year at Kentucky. If he's lucky enough to slip into the second round he's going to spend the entire year in the G-league getting crushed by guys stronger and faster than the ones he faced at Kentucky. A year to develop in college wherever it might be and showcase his talents as an offensive focal point would definitely be better for him. Hope the best for him regardless.
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HoyaDr
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 616
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Post by HoyaDr on Jan 31, 2020 20:18:18 GMT -5
For the lazy... Whitney is supposedly prefers going pro than transferring at this point. I don't see how this is a good idea at all for him. I don't know his personal situation, but he showed very little this year at Kentucky. If he's lucky enough to slip into the second round he's going to spend the entire year in the G-league getting crushed by guys stronger and faster than the ones he faced at Kentucky. A year to develop in college wherever it might be and showcase his talents as an offensive focal point would definitely be better for him. Hope the best for him regardless. Even more a reason that we need to land MAM. He is a program changer (for a program like ours).
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Post by Ranch Dressing on Jan 31, 2020 20:33:14 GMT -5
If that's where his head is at, probably best we go in a different direction.
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DanMcQ
Moderator
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Post by DanMcQ on Feb 1, 2020 8:57:38 GMT -5
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jwp91
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 5,999
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Post by jwp91 on Feb 1, 2020 11:25:59 GMT -5
If that's where his head is at, probably best we go in a different direction. Definitely a pass...no matter how talented.
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kbones17
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,186
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Post by kbones17 on Feb 1, 2020 13:56:57 GMT -5
Pass. His head is already in pro ball.
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kbones17
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,186
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Post by kbones17 on Mar 22, 2020 12:18:56 GMT -5
Alonzo Gaffney leaving OSU after one (forgettable) season. I couldn’t find a Gaffney thread; can’t remember if one was started. Pretty wild that if we had gotten both Whitney and Gaffney we would have been expecting to make the final four. As it turns out, both have almost no impact on the floor (albeit on good teams) and bounce from college at first chance.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Mar 22, 2020 12:41:54 GMT -5
Alonzo Gaffney leaving OSU after one (forgettable) season. I couldn’t find a Gaffney thread; can’t remember if one was started. Pretty wild that if we had gotten both Whitney and Gaffney we would have been expecting to make the final four. As it turns out, both have almost no impact on the floor (albeit on good teams) and bounce from college at first chance. And he's expected to go pro...
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daveg023
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by daveg023 on Mar 26, 2020 7:04:52 GMT -5
Alonzo Gaffney leaving OSU after one (forgettable) season. I couldn’t find a Gaffney thread; can’t remember if one was started. Pretty wild that if we had gotten both Whitney and Gaffney we would have been expecting to make the final four. As it turns out, both have almost no impact on the floor (albeit on good teams) and bounce from college at first chance. And he's expected to go pro... To me this just reinforces how much a crapshoot recruiting is and how meaningless rankings are after the Top 10. It’s a fun exercise to go back and look at prior year recruiting rankings. The one constant is that pretty much the consensus Top 10 are all in the NBA at this point, while guys ranked in the 20s (some five star guys mind you) are just as likely to be anonymous as guys at the end of the Top 100. I think there remains to be a huge gap between the Top 10 and everyone else and after that point a guy ranked 22 isn’t really that much a better prospect than a guy ranked 122. I’d argue there probably is another large gap after you get past 200 or so. Yet we (myself included) get wrapped up in the rank, the stars, etc because we know no better at the time. Sure the chances of success in the 22 ranked player are statistically better than the lower ranked guy, but I think if we continue to shop in the 50-150 range we’ll be ok with one big caveat - we must continue to develop them once they get here.
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RBHoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,124
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Post by RBHoya on Mar 26, 2020 11:43:01 GMT -5
And he's expected to go pro... To me this just reinforces how much a crapshoot recruiting is and how meaningless rankings are after the Top 10. It’s a fun exercise to go back and look at prior year recruiting rankings. The one constant is that pretty much the consensus Top 10 are all in the NBA at this point, while guys ranked in the 20s (some five star guys mind you) are just as likely to be anonymous as guys at the end of the Top 100. I think there remains to be a huge gap between the Top 10 and everyone else and after that point a guy ranked 22 isn’t really that much a better prospect than a guy ranked 122. I’d argue there probably is another large gap after you get past 200 or so. Yet we (myself included) get wrapped up in the rank, the stars, etc because we know no better at the time. Sure the chances of success in the 22 ranked player are statistically better than the lower ranked guy, but I think if we continue to shop in the 50-150 range we’ll be ok with one big caveat - we must continue to develop them once they get here. To further this point, look at this year's First Team All Americans: Obi Toppin--Not Ranked on Rivals coming out of high school Luka Garza--Ranked 111th in his class coming out of high school Markus Howard--ranked 73rd in his class coming out of high school Myles Powell--ranked 105 in his class coming out of high school Payton Prichard--ranked 49th in his class coming out of high school We can recruit in this range. If you look at the UVA team that won it all most recently, most of their players were in the 50-125ish range too. I think their highest rated player was Kyle Guy who was ranked around 40th in the country. The two most recent Villanova teams were similarly built. There is plenty of evidence that you don't need to recruit 5 star All Americans to be national contenders or even to rack up individual accolades. Even our own most recent all-american types in Otto and Jeff were not 5 star guys out of high school. It's totally possible to do big things without being in the one-and-done race and without dropping bags to players or their handlers. The keys are really: 1) Choosing the RIGHT players--this year's college AAs and the recent UVA/Nova champion teams show you can be great with mostly guys in the 50-150 range, but there are also plenty of guys in that range who never amount to much. Need to have a great eye for potential regardless of a player's ranking. 2) Developing players over their tenure. None of these guys were AA as freshmen, but their rate of improvement during their college years dramatically outpaced their peers'. 3) Coaching. Guys like Tony Bennett and Jay Wright are good coaches who put talented players in position to win. They've demonstrated that you can win it all without a team of McDonalds All Americans, but it's also important to have your team prepared for battle, to make good in-game adjustments and to adapt your style to suit the strengths of your players, never becoming too beholden to a particular philosophy or dogma. Sure 5 star players are nice every once in a while, and if they're augmenting a strong core they can help push you over the top. But they're in no way a necessity. We can be successful recruiting in the range we're already in, just have to continue trying to find the right guys and getting the absolute most out of them.
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prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 23,271
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Post by prhoya on Mar 26, 2020 12:55:44 GMT -5
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Bigs"R"Us
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Post by Bigs"R"Us on Mar 26, 2020 13:14:40 GMT -5
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dchoya72
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by dchoya72 on Mar 26, 2020 16:25:31 GMT -5
Yeah!! Lots of talent-- a boat load.
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Omega
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 556
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Post by Omega on Mar 26, 2020 16:25:44 GMT -5
To me this just reinforces how much a crapshoot recruiting is and how meaningless rankings are after the Top 10. It’s a fun exercise to go back and look at prior year recruiting rankings. The one constant is that pretty much the consensus Top 10 are all in the NBA at this point, while guys ranked in the 20s (some five star guys mind you) are just as likely to be anonymous as guys at the end of the Top 100. I think there remains to be a huge gap between the Top 10 and everyone else and after that point a guy ranked 22 isn’t really that much a better prospect than a guy ranked 122. I’d argue there probably is another large gap after you get past 200 or so. Yet we (myself included) get wrapped up in the rank, the stars, etc because we know no better at the time. Sure the chances of success in the 22 ranked player are statistically better than the lower ranked guy, but I think if we continue to shop in the 50-150 range we’ll be ok with one big caveat - we must continue to develop them once they get here. To further this point, look at this year's First Team All Americans: Obi Toppin--Not Ranked on Rivals coming out of high school Luka Garza--Ranked 111th in his class coming out of high school Markus Howard--ranked 73rd in his class coming out of high school Myles Powell--ranked 105 in his class coming out of high school Payton Prichard--ranked 49th in his class coming out of high school We can recruit in this range. If you look at the UVA team that won it all most recently, most of their players were in the 50-125ish range too. I think their highest rated player was Kyle Guy who was ranked around 40th in the country. The two most recent Villanova teams were similarly built. There is plenty of evidence that you don't need to recruit 5 star All Americans to be national contenders or even to rack up individual accolades. Even our own most recent all-american types in Otto and Jeff were not 5 star guys out of high school. It's totally possible to do big things without being in the one-and-done race and without dropping bags to players or their handlers. The keys are really: 1) Choosing the RIGHT players--this year's college AAs and the recent UVA/Nova champion teams show you can be great with mostly guys in the 50-150 range, but there are also plenty of guys in that range who never amount to much. Need to have a great eye for potential regardless of a player's ranking. 2) Developing players over their tenure. None of these guys were AA as freshmen, but their rate of improvement during their college years dramatically outpaced their peers'. 3) Coaching. Guys like Tony Bennett and Jay Wright are good coaches who put talented players in position to win. They've demonstrated that you can win it all without a team of McDonalds All Americans, but it's also important to have your team prepared for battle, to make good in-game adjustments and to adapt your style to suit the strengths of your players, never becoming too beholden to a particular philosophy or dogma. Sure 5 star players are nice every once in a while, and if they're augmenting a strong core they can help push you over the top. But they're in no way a necessity. We can be successful recruiting in the range we're already in, just have to continue trying to find the right guys and getting the absolute most out of them. Just curious, what year in college are the all Americans? What were the years for the players on the Nova and UVA teams?
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RBHoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,124
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Post by RBHoya on Mar 26, 2020 17:56:17 GMT -5
To further this point, look at this year's First Team All Americans: Obi Toppin--Not Ranked on Rivals coming out of high school Luka Garza--Ranked 111th in his class coming out of high school Markus Howard--ranked 73rd in his class coming out of high school Myles Powell--ranked 105 in his class coming out of high school Payton Prichard--ranked 49th in his class coming out of high school We can recruit in this range. If you look at the UVA team that won it all most recently, most of their players were in the 50-125ish range too. I think their highest rated player was Kyle Guy who was ranked around 40th in the country. The two most recent Villanova teams were similarly built. There is plenty of evidence that you don't need to recruit 5 star All Americans to be national contenders or even to rack up individual accolades. Even our own most recent all-american types in Otto and Jeff were not 5 star guys out of high school. It's totally possible to do big things without being in the one-and-done race and without dropping bags to players or their handlers. The keys are really: 1) Choosing the RIGHT players--this year's college AAs and the recent UVA/Nova champion teams show you can be great with mostly guys in the 50-150 range, but there are also plenty of guys in that range who never amount to much. Need to have a great eye for potential regardless of a player's ranking. 2) Developing players over their tenure. None of these guys were AA as freshmen, but their rate of improvement during their college years dramatically outpaced their peers'. 3) Coaching. Guys like Tony Bennett and Jay Wright are good coaches who put talented players in position to win. They've demonstrated that you can win it all without a team of McDonalds All Americans, but it's also important to have your team prepared for battle, to make good in-game adjustments and to adapt your style to suit the strengths of your players, never becoming too beholden to a particular philosophy or dogma. Sure 5 star players are nice every once in a while, and if they're augmenting a strong core they can help push you over the top. But they're in no way a necessity. We can be successful recruiting in the range we're already in, just have to continue trying to find the right guys and getting the absolute most out of them. Just curious, what year in college are the all Americans? What were the years for the players on the Nova and UVA teams? This year's AA's were 3 seniors, 1 junior and 1 sophomore. Not many contributing seniors on last year's UVA Team. Here's the roster: virginiasports.com/sports/mens-basketball/roster/2018-19The 2016 Nova team that won it was more of a mix, a couple of key seniors, best player was a junior Josh Hart, and a couple of younger guys (that are now in the NBA) in the rotation. Roster: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015%E2%80%9316_Villanova_Wildcats_men%27s_basketball_teamThe 2018 Nova team didn't have any seniors in the rotation either, but did have some good juniors and RS juniors that were pretty experienced. Roster here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017%E2%80%9318_Villanova_Wildcats_men%27s_basketball_team
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Omega
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 556
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Post by Omega on Mar 27, 2020 19:41:00 GMT -5
Thanks for doing due diligence. The Hoyas would have been set up very similar. Before the defections, many predicted the Hoyas to be in the field of 64. Next year they would have had a senior Blair, Alexander, and Picket, junior Josh, Mac and Akinjo, sophomore Gardner, and the big boys.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2020 22:43:08 GMT -5
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