Hoyas - Seton Hall 2/4/17 Discussion

[DanMcQ]

Clean up those turnovers.

[HometownHoya]

Seton Hall is in the same place as we are. Win a few games and their season has turned around. We need to come into the game with energy and keep the strong start we saw tonight against Depaul. Just need to keep up the smart passes and hit the boards.

Every team from now on will try to take charges and get fouls on Peak...he's got to be ready for that and not barrel into the center of the paint (even though he can convert those situations).

[FrazierFanatic]

Better have 3 days of rebounding drills before the Hall.

[Filo]

Think Delgado goes for triple digits in rebounds?

[calhoya]

Jan 31, 2017 23:40:20 GMT -5 FrazierFanatic said:

Better have 3 days of rebounding drills before the Hall.

Add in some serious practice at the FT line

[mapei]

Jan 31, 2017 23:37:35 GMT -5 HometownHoya said:

Every team from now on will try to take charges and get fouls on Peak...he's got to be ready for that and not barrel into the center of the paint (even though he can convert those situations).

I totally agree. It's gotten where I cringe every time he drives into traffic, which just as often as not ends in a foul, turnover or miss. Yet when it works it can be game-winning, as it was last night. Imagine how good he could be if he learned to recognize when the lane just isn't there, and pull up or dish.

[FrazierFanatic]

Feb 1, 2017 10:40:58 GMT -5 mapei said:

Jan 31, 2017 23:37:35 GMT -5 HometownHoya said:

Every team from now on will try to take charges and get fouls on Peak...he's got to be ready for that and not barrel into the center of the paint (even though he can convert those situations).

I totally agree. It's gotten where I cringe every time he drives into traffic, which just as often as not ends in a foul, turnover or miss. Yet when it works it can be game-winning, as it was last night. Imagine how good he could be if he learned to recognize when the lane just isn't there, and pull up or dish.

Exactly. Granted, it can be difficult to read given the inconsistency of refereeing the block/charge call - but jump-stopping for the 10 footer if you can realize the defense is moving to set up and take the charge keeps you in the game, and is usually a pretty uncontested shot.

And keep working on the slide move as you go up, LJ has gotten better at it, but at times goes straight in.

[TBird41]

Feb 1, 2017 10:40:58 GMT -5 mapei said:

Jan 31, 2017 23:37:35 GMT -5 HometownHoya said:

Every team from now on will try to take charges and get fouls on Peak...he's got to be ready for that and not barrel into the center of the paint (even though he can convert those situations).

I totally agree. It's gotten where I cringe every time he drives into traffic, which just as often as not ends in a foul, turnover or miss. Yet when it works it can be game-winning, as it was last night. Imagine how good he could be if he learned to recognize when the lane just isn't there, and pull up or dish.

Dave Lietao must be a basketball genius to be the first coach to figure out that Peak tends to drive hard to the basket and might be susceptible to defenders trying to take a charge. Seriously--why do you think that other teams weren't aware that Peak drives aggressively to the basket?

Let's not let overrate one game where Peak (and/or the refs) had some questionable decision making. He uses 24.6% of the Hoyas possessions and has an assist rate of 20.4%, which is roughly what Markel Starks' assist rate was in 2013. Prior to last night, Peak hadn't had more than 3 turnovers in a game since St. John's, and he's averaging fewer than 3 turnovers per game. He's shooting 50% on 2PT field goals (I don't have a break-down b/w his shots at the rim / 2PT jumpers, but I'd bet he isn't shooting 50% on jumpers). He's also averaging fewer than 3 personal fouls per game (3.1 per 40 min) and draws almost six fouls per 40 minutes. Peak has been fantastic at getting the rim, finishing and/or drawing a foul. He might be the best offensive player on the Hoyas, especially if he can get his 3 pt shot working again (both he and Pryor have 2.0 offensive win shares, though Pryor's ORtg is higher--116.7 to 110.5).

[FrazierFanatic]

Well it is not just one game. LJ is good for at least one charge a game. Given his tendency to commit one or two over aggressive fouls on defense per game, even one charge can force him to the bench for extended minutes.

[lda05816]

Really hope Brad can go in this one. We need his bulk to throw up against Delgado and Sanogo. And even if he doesn't help stop them on the boards, we can at least utilize his 5 fouls. There are only 3 teams worse at FT shooting in the country than Seton Hall, so have to put the big guys on the line instead of giving easy layups if they are destroying us on the offensive glass.

I like our chances here because their FTA/FGA ratio is almost identical to ours and we are a much better FT shooing team. Attack their bigs early and try to get them in foul trouble. If we can just not get totally dominated on the glass, I think we win this one.

[blueandgray]

Seton Hall scares me.

[TBird41]

Feb 1, 2017 12:57:40 GMT -5 FrazierFanatic said:

Well it is not just one game. LJ is good for at least one charge a game. Given his tendency to commit one or two over aggressive fouls on defense per game, even one charge can force him to the bench for extended minutes.

Does anyone know where we can find stats on offensive fouls? I don't think this is right, but I'm not going to go look at all the old play-by-play.

Honestly, I'm surprised people are saying this--Peak's ability to stay out of foul trouble has been one of the best things about the season--he's played 82.6% of the Hoyas minutes, which is the most of any Hoya, and the fifth highest percentage of any Big East player. He's played 80.7% of minutes in conference, which is still the most of any Hoya and good for 13th highest in conference, and that's even with a greater weight being given to the Marquette game, where he got hurt and only played 22 minutes.

For comparison's sake, Peak only played 61.6% of available minutes last year, so there's definitely been a big improvement.

[hoyainspirit]

Feb 1, 2017 12:57:40 GMT -5 FrazierFanatic said:

Well it is not just one game. LJ is good for at least one charge a game. Given his tendency to commit one or two over aggressive fouls on defense per game, even one charge can force him to the bench for extended minutes.

That's his game, Frazier. It's going to happen. But I totally agree that he could be even more effective on his drives if he developed the ability to sometimes pull up or shoot the Vee floater.

[iheartdurenbros]

He had trouble during the Providence home game, one that we would all like to forget. That game he played just under 30 minutes -- about the same as last night's game. Overall it's a big improvement from last year.

I thought that call at the end of the second half was a bad call that, as others have pointed out, made the game a tough one for the Hoyas. Our offense doesn't flow well without him on the floor. I'll take his aggressiveness any day, and some of those charge calls are 50/50 calls. It's the cheap (often frustration) fouls that he needs to stop altogether. And, he had a couple of those last night.

[hoyasaxa2003]

Last year, Peak committed 5.7 fouls per 40 minutes, and 5.5 in Big East play. This year, those numbers are 3.1 and 3.5. So, he's certainly cut down his fouling a lot this year. I think it's mostly a reduction of unnecessary/ticky-tack fouls committed away from the ball or away from the basket. It does feel to me like he has gotten more offensive fouls this year than last, but I have no idea if that is accurate or not. To my knowledge, none of the stat sites keep offensive foul stats, though I'd be curious to see them.

[FrazierFanatic]

Good point 2003 - he had 2 cheap ones last night in addition to the 2 charges. We can live with an offensive foul, even in most games, if he does not combine it with the other fouls to nail him to the bench.

[FrostbackHoya]

Feb 1, 2017 16:17:20 GMT -5 hoyasaxa2003 said:

Last year, Peak committed 5.7 fouls per 50 minutes, and 5.5 in Big East play. This year, those numbers are 3.1 and 3.5. So, he's certainly cut down his fouling a lot this year. I think it's mostly a reduction of unnecessary/ticky-tack fouls committed away from the ball or away from the basket. It does feel to me like he has gotten more offensive fouls this year than last, but I have no idea if that is accurate or not. To my knowledge, none of the stat sites keep offensive foul stats, though I'd be curious to see them.

Don't take this as snark, but this is a new metric to me. Given that we play 40mn games, why would anyone smooth averages to 50mns? Why not 40mn?

[hoyasaxa2003]

Feb 1, 2017 16:46:36 GMT -5 FrostbackHoya said:

Feb 1, 2017 16:17:20 GMT -5 hoyasaxa2003 said:

Last year, Peak committed 5.7 fouls per 50 minutes, and 5.5 in Big East play. This year, those numbers are 3.1 and 3.5. So, he's certainly cut down his fouling a lot this year. I think it's mostly a reduction of unnecessary/ticky-tack fouls committed away from the ball or away from the basket. It does feel to me like he has gotten more offensive fouls this year than last, but I have no idea if that is accurate or not. To my knowledge, none of the stat sites keep offensive foul stats, though I'd be curious to see them.

Don't take this as snark, but this is a new metric to me. Given that we play 40mn games, why would anyone smooth averages to 50mns? Why not 40mn?

That was a typo. The status are per 40 minutes, not 50. I'll fix the post above to avoid confusion.

[hoyasaxa2003]

Feb 1, 2017 16:31:56 GMT -5 FrazierFanatic said:

Good point 2003 - he had 2 cheap ones last night in addition to the 2 charges. We can live with an offensive foul, even in most games, if he does not combine it with the other fouls to nail him to the bench.

Team-wide, we give up way too many unnecessary fouls, the worst being far from the basket. A lot of times when we make a bad turnover or get beat badly our reaction is to reach and foul. Now, in some small set of circumstances it might make sense (for example, to avoid an easy layup for the other team), but otherwise they should be easy avoided with some discipline.

The offensive fouls called against Peak last night were fair calls. The second one seemed a little cheap at first glance, but on replay, it's clear he rammed into the guy's right shoulder and the defender was set.

[triplehoya09]

Are the 5+ fouls / 40 min. accurate too?