EtomicB
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by EtomicB on Apr 15, 2016 8:27:43 GMT -5
I am glad that they don't follow the pattern that some schools do now where a kid gets his scholarship pulled because he does not perform up to expectations. No matter how well he played last season, Tre made a commitment to Georgetown when he decided to play for the Hoyas and the school should show some loyalty and give him the chance to compete for minutes next year. That doesn't mean you have to give him minutes if he doesn't earn them but he should have that scholarship for as long as he wants to be a Hoya. You can't kill Duke, and similar schools, for pulling scholarships from kids because they found a better option and then think it is Ok to do the same thing. If you make a mistake on a recruit, then you simply don't play him very much, but you need to show the same loyalty to those players you want the kids to show to the school. This is one of the the main reasons most kids leave though Boston, this taking away scholarships theory doesn't happen very much imo.. Pitino is the only coach I can think of who does it regularly.. Take Bolden as an example, I doubt JT3 "took" his scholarship from him but I do believe he let him know that PT would be very scarce for him so he left.. Same thing for Domingo a year later.. Do you really think Duke took Thornton's scholarship away from him? Not a chance, the team would be better with him imo..
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bostonfan
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by bostonfan on Apr 15, 2016 8:49:50 GMT -5
I am glad that they don't follow the pattern that some schools do now where a kid gets his scholarship pulled because he does not perform up to expectations. No matter how well he played last season, Tre made a commitment to Georgetown when he decided to play for the Hoyas and the school should show some loyalty and give him the chance to compete for minutes next year. That doesn't mean you have to give him minutes if he doesn't earn them but he should have that scholarship for as long as he wants to be a Hoya. You can't kill Duke, and similar schools, for pulling scholarships from kids because they found a better option and then think it is Ok to do the same thing. If you make a mistake on a recruit, then you simply don't play him very much, but you need to show the same loyalty to those players you want the kids to show to the school. This is one of the the main reasons most kids leave though Boston, this taking away scholarships theory doesn't happen very much imo.. Pitino is the only coach I can think of who does it regularly.. Take Bolden as an example, I doubt JT3 "took" his scholarship from him but I do believe he let him know that PT would be very scarce for him so he left.. Same thing for Domingo a year later.. Do you really think Duke took Thornton's scholarship away from him? Not a chance, the team would be better with him imo.. I don't disagree that kids transfer when they can see that they may be losing playing time to another player, but I just feel that should be the players decision. Not a coach pushing the kid out. Not sure how often that happens but you do hear it. I am not sure about the exact dynamic that takes place and what exactly is said, but if the coach tells a player he is going to have to compete for his playing time and the player is not up for that challenge and decides to transfer then that is on the player, not the coach. Honestly I think every coach should tell every player they are all competing for playing time every year and they should do that when they are recruiting the players so they understand the situation before they arrive. I don't think any players should be guaranteed playing time until they earn it. Maybe I am delusional about they way recruiting works these days but I would think you want kids who show up ready to earn their time by outplaying the other kids. The sense you get from some situations at other schools is that coaches make promises to kids about playing time to get kids to commit and then don't follow through on that commitment as soon as a better player comes along.
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Post by michaelgrahmstylie on Apr 15, 2016 12:03:38 GMT -5
This is one of the the main reasons most kids leave though Boston, this taking away scholarships theory doesn't happen very much imo.. Pitino is the only coach I can think of who does it regularly.. Take Bolden as an example, I doubt JT3 "took" his scholarship from him but I do believe he let him know that PT would be very scarce for him so he left.. Same thing for Domingo a year later.. Do you really think Duke took Thornton's scholarship away from him? Not a chance, the team would be better with him imo.. I don't disagree that kids transfer when they can see that they may be losing playing time to another player, but I just feel that should be the players decision. Not a coach pushing the kid out. Not sure how often that happens but you do hear it. I am not sure about the exact dynamic that takes place and what exactly is said, but if the coach tells a player he is going to have to compete for his playing time and the player is not up for that challenge and decides to transfer then that is on the player, not the coach. Honestly I think every coach should tell every player they are all competing for playing time every year and they should do that when they are recruiting the players so they understand the situation before they arrive. I don't think any players should be guaranteed playing time until they earn it. Maybe I am delusional about they way recruiting works these days but I would think you want kids who show up ready to earn their time by outplaying the other kids. The sense you get from some situations at other schools is that coaches make promises to kids about playing time to get kids to commit and then don't follow through on that commitment as soon as a better player comes along. Thus the situation with all of the transfers
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eagle54
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,471
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Post by eagle54 on Apr 15, 2016 22:50:05 GMT -5
I don't disagree that kids transfer when they can see that they may be losing playing time to another player, but I just feel that should be the players decision. Not a coach pushing the kid out. Not sure how often that happens but you do hear it. I am not sure about the exact dynamic that takes place and what exactly is said, but if the coach tells a player he is going to have to compete for his playing time and the player is not up for that challenge and decides to transfer then that is on the player, not the coach. Honestly I think every coach should tell every player they are all competing for playing time every year and they should do that when they are recruiting the players so they understand the situation before they arrive. I don't think any players should be guaranteed playing time until they earn it. Maybe I am delusional about they way recruiting works these days but I would think you want kids who show up ready to earn their time by outplaying the other kids. The sense you get from some situations at other schools is that coaches make promises to kids about playing time to get kids to commit and then don't follow through on that commitment as soon as a better player comes along. Thus the situation with all of the transfers The moral high ground this thread is trying to take on scholarships and honoring those with an under performing player is commendable. However, the reality is our players are here to play basketball first and foremost, as they are in most high profile programs. They want to get an education as an added benefit but I think playing the "student-athlete" angle against the schools that are doing well in D-I and acting like we wouldn't do that is naive. Just another excuse for what we have. Kids's come to play basketball on a scholarship and the operative word is play. When it becomes apparent they can't play they are counseled that this program won't work for them and they realize they need to go somewhere else under the assumption they are competitors and want to play. The holier than thou attitude of this board acting that we don't do this against these other heathen programs is ridiculous. It's all a part of competing and something that needs to be managed.
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Post by michaelgrahmstylie on Apr 23, 2016 9:28:24 GMT -5
This poster said...
Really Really Happy for the kid.... In an era where kids are changing schools for the smallest of reasons you have a kid like Hayes who was stapled to the bench for 3 years, didn't complain, kept working, and kept being a great teammate.
Losing a Family memeber is incredibly tough but it's clear his father has done an excellent job raising this young man. It's a really good feeling knowing he got another chance to do his thing.
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drquigley
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by drquigley on Apr 23, 2016 11:02:04 GMT -5
This poster said... Really Really Happy for the kid.... In an era where kids are changing schools for the smallest of reasons you have a kid like Hayes who was stapled to the bench for 3 years, didn't complain, kept working, and kept being a great teammate. Losing a Family memeber is incredibly tough but it's clear his father has done an excellent job raising this young man. It's a really good feeling knowing he got another chance to do his thing. Tre Mourning (and dad?) must be doing some serious soul searching. Does he stay and maybe get 5-10 minutes a game or transfer to a school where he can showcase his talent?
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kchoya
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Enter your message here...
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Post by kchoya on Apr 23, 2016 11:25:30 GMT -5
This poster said... Really Really Happy for the kid.... In an era where kids are changing schools for the smallest of reasons you have a kid like Hayes who was stapled to the bench for 3 years, didn't complain, kept working, and kept being a great teammate. Losing a Family memeber is incredibly tough but it's clear his father has done an excellent job raising this young man. It's a really good feeling knowing he got another chance to do his thing. Tre Mourning (and dad?) must be doing some serious soul searching. Does he stay and maybe get 5-10 minutes a game or transfer to a school where he can showcase his talent? I doubt they're doing some "soul searching." Where do you come up with this crap?
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Apr 23, 2016 11:40:52 GMT -5
If playing time was all its about, Trey Mourning would have never come to Georgetown. He's a smart kid who seems to do well academically.
Even before Hayes was coming back, Mourning wasn't primed to get a ton of playing time anyway, with Agau likely taking some time too.
Overall, I think Hayes coming back is a good thing as long as JT3 doesn't allow it to stunt Govan's growth.
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rockhoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by rockhoya on Apr 23, 2016 12:24:30 GMT -5
This poster said... Really Really Happy for the kid.... In an era where kids are changing schools for the smallest of reasons you have a kid like Hayes who was stapled to the bench for 3 years, didn't complain, kept working, and kept being a great teammate. Losing a Family memeber is incredibly tough but it's clear his father has done an excellent job raising this young man. It's a really good feeling knowing he got another chance to do his thing. Tre Mourning (and dad?) must be doing some serious soul searching. Does he stay and maybe get 5-10 minutes a game or transfer to a school where he can showcase his talent? And we wonder why kids are always looking for the first excuse to transfer....
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71hoya
Bulldog (over 250 posts)
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Post by 71hoya on Apr 23, 2016 13:12:18 GMT -5
If playing time was all its about, Trey Mourning would have never come to Georgetown. He's a smart kid who seems to do well academically. Even before Hayes was coming back, Mourning wasn't primed to get a ton of playing time anyway, with Agau likely taking some time too. Overall, I think Hayes coming back is a good thing as long as JT3 doesn't allow it to stunt Govan's growth. ...Or go back to his old offense with Hayes at the top of the key and horrible defense.
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dreamhoya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by dreamhoya on Apr 23, 2016 13:27:52 GMT -5
If playing time was all its about, Trey Mourning would have never come to Georgetown. He's a smart kid who seems to do well academically. Even before Hayes was coming back, Mourning wasn't primed to get a ton of playing time anyway, with Agau likely taking some time too. Overall, I think Hayes coming back is a good thing as long as JT3 doesn't allow it to stunt Govan's growth. Mourning SHOULD get more time. He's a diamond.
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dreamhoya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by dreamhoya on Apr 23, 2016 13:41:29 GMT -5
Again, who would want to leave? Most of the guys were getting minutes
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Apr 23, 2016 18:54:45 GMT -5
If playing time was all its about, Trey Mourning would have never come to Georgetown. He's a smart kid who seems to do well academically. Even before Hayes was coming back, Mourning wasn't primed to get a ton of playing time anyway, with Agau likely taking some time too. Overall, I think Hayes coming back is a good thing as long as JT3 doesn't allow it to stunt Govan's growth. Mourning SHOULD get more time. He's a diamond. Maybe. It depends a lot on how well others play. Mourning hadn't yet shown he's a "diamond." He needs to prove that. People have a tendency to oversell our talent in the off season.
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dreamhoya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by dreamhoya on Apr 23, 2016 19:12:01 GMT -5
Mourning SHOULD get more time. He's a diamond. Maybe. It depends a lot on how well others play. Mourning hadn't yet shown he's a "diamond." He needs to prove that. People have a tendency to oversell our talent in the off season. he wouldn't be a diamond then. "People"... I'm not overselling. It's what i believe. But, we'll see. same responses when i pointed out several other players who were good by senior year. we'll see.
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Post by michaelgrahmstylie on Apr 23, 2016 21:21:48 GMT -5
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drquigley
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by drquigley on Apr 25, 2016 10:20:48 GMT -5
Tre Mourning (and dad?) must be doing some serious soul searching. Does he stay and maybe get 5-10 minutes a game or transfer to a school where he can showcase his talent? I doubt they're doing some "soul searching." Where do you come up with this crap? You really know how to push my buttons. The point is the Mournings have a close tie to GU. I'm sure that factored into the decision for Tre to come here. I'm also sure Tre and his Dad thought that by his junior year Tre would have a good shot a serious PT at center. With Hayes returning that thinking has to change significantly. "soul searching" means does Tre, and possibly his dad, remain loyal to GU and have Tre remain even though he will have less PT to showcase his talents or does he take his game elsewhere? Maybe that doesn't seem like a big deal to you but I would think that it could be a tough decision for the Mourning family.
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DanMcQ
Moderator
Posts: 30,471
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Post by DanMcQ on Apr 25, 2016 10:56:28 GMT -5
Just for reference, Trey Mourning's father is on the Georgetown Board of Directors: www.georgetown.edu/about/board-of-directorsI'm fairly sure that factored into his decision to attend the school. As for playing time, I doubt any of the players use this forum as an indication of their future playing time.
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drquigley
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by drquigley on Apr 25, 2016 13:01:52 GMT -5
Just for reference, Trey Mourning's father is on the Georgetown Board of Directors: www.georgetown.edu/about/board-of-directorsI'm fairly sure that factored into his decision to attend the school. As for playing time, I doubt any of the players use this forum as an indication of their future playing time. More reason to consider the return of Hayes as serious concern for the Mournings. This has to come as a surprise to them. Granted they don't look at this board when making decisions about Trey's future but they have to realize that last year he was 3rd off the bench last year and unless Govan or Hayes are injured he will be 3rd off the bench again. So yes they have to balance any decision to transfer against their loyalty to GU.
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Post by HometownHoya on Apr 25, 2016 14:14:59 GMT -5
Just for reference, Trey Mourning's father is on the Georgetown Board of Directors: www.georgetown.edu/about/board-of-directorsI'm fairly sure that factored into his decision to attend the school. As for playing time, I doubt any of the players use this forum as an indication of their future playing time. More reason to consider the return of Hayes as serious concern for the Mournings. This has to come as a surprise to them. Granted they don't look at this board when making decisions about Trey's future but they have to realize that last year he was 3rd off the bench last year and unless Govan or Hayes are injured he will be 3rd off the bench again. So yes they have to balance any decision to transfer against their loyalty to GU. I'm sure the Mourning family were also informed that a player could come any time and fight for minutes. If this weren't Bradley Hayes but instead Harry Giles (Scout #1, 6'10" 220lb PF), I'm sure the Mourning family would be just as prepared. If it were Hopkins earning a 5th year (last year), the Mourning family would just be prepared. This is how sports (past JV) work, the coaches gets the best players (anyway they can by the rules), they compete, minutes are earned. The Mourning family knows how to compete and understands a lot can happen as far as the other 14 guys on the roster. Trey may very well end up transferring someday but I highly doubt it's because a guy (who is probably a friend) is staying for another year. If anything, he could be looking at Hayes as a model for how to go from the lowest project on the roster to a guy that the program utilized loopholes to get to stay another year (because they see his worth).
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Apr 25, 2016 14:55:39 GMT -5
Just for reference, Trey Mourning's father is on the Georgetown Board of Directors: www.georgetown.edu/about/board-of-directorsI'm fairly sure that factored into his decision to attend the school. As for playing time, I doubt any of the players use this forum as an indication of their future playing time. More reason to consider the return of Hayes as serious concern for the Mournings. This has to come as a surprise to them. Granted they don't look at this board when making decisions about Trey's future but they have to realize that last year he was 3rd off the bench last year and unless Govan or Hayes are injured he will be 3rd off the bench again. So yes they have to balance any decision to transfer against their loyalty to GU. Certainly possible. Just as possible - Zo looks Trey in the eye and tells him to work so hard and improve so much that you force yourself into the line up.
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