EasyEd
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 7,272
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Post by EasyEd on May 6, 2005 15:21:45 GMT -5
I can't believe we can't let Esherick have the possibility of a new job without trashing him again and again. For over a year many on this board have trashed him at every opportunity. I, for one, wish him well and would like to see us give him a new chance. Maybe our bitterness says something about us, not him.
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Post by jerseyhoya34 on May 6, 2005 15:26:07 GMT -5
a) Regarding RT and Esh. I don't know, but I see no reason to pile on either. They obviously had disagreements, and RT obviously expressed his disagreement to those other than Esh. Your call on whether he was disloyal to Esh or loyal to his ultimate superior -- the University. It's not like Esh was infalliable, here. b) Compare recruiting classes? Okay, I will. Esh recruited Jeff and Tyler without RT. With Rt, our previous was Ray, Sead and Matt. Hmmm. Who cares, anyway? On letter a, you will NEVER catch me claiming that Esherick was infallible. I'm sure you realize that by now. In terms of comparing recruiting classes, Esherick's first without RT included Matt Causey (committed under RT/Esh), Ray Reed (committed/signed after RT left), and Sead (committed/signed after RT left). The class originally included Darian Townes and Cheyenne Moore, but they obviously headed elsewhere after RT left. The result was one of the worst classes in quite a few years. As for the most recent recruiting class, Esh deserves some credit, but I would not underestimate the role of the assistants (JJ/CD) in helping him out. Incidentally, I have no problem with coming down on the side of RT in this debate. He received much of the credit from Mike for his development, and I think RT did a better job of relating to our key players, whether it helped the program or not in the end. The continued failure of the program after RT left indicated to me that assistant coaching was not a significant or even close to the most significant contributor to the program's short tterm failure. President DeGioia did a good job of identifying it.
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the_way
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
The Illest
Posts: 5,419
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Post by the_way on May 6, 2005 15:31:09 GMT -5
Again, guys this is all freakin hearsay. This he-said, she-said crap is bogus. Unless we heard these words uttered personally from Esh's mouth, we don't know what has been said. I wish Esh the best.
Causey mainly came because of RT. Causey had said in a Washington Times article that his mom just loved Ronnie Thompson. Plus it was an awkward situation. If Ronnie was screwing up, what does Esh say. Esh is loyal to Ronnie's father, JT2, who is still involved with the program. IF they had their differences, that had to be an awkard situation, and it had to affect the team.
Esh's problem was a clumination of things. As you saw during basketball games, his coaching was mediocre at best. Also, to be a coach or even a good one, you have to be your own man. Your own person. Esh's strength as an assistant led partly to his downfall as a head coach: his loyalty. He tried to blanket what JT had been doing after being given the head coaching job. The problem was, the program was suffering the last 2 years before JT stepped down. Plus, JT was on cruise control in terms of coaching after the 1988 Olympics, and it initially started after the Ewing era was over in 1985. Esh took on that same role. But the problem wash, he wasn't JT. And he hadn't accomplished the enourmous amount of success nor did he make a team into a national power like JT did. Esh kept the same assistants. An outside the 2000-2001 season, you saw the same mediocre results as you saw in the JT2 final waning years. Esh then finally tried to become his own man during his last season, which was too late, by hiring his own hand-picked assistants, and improving recruiting (Jeff Green, Tyler Crawford, Aboya).
Whatever Esh does, I wish him nothing but the best. He is a Hoya, and always will be a Hoya.
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Post by jerseyhoya34 on May 6, 2005 15:36:13 GMT -5
I can't believe we can't let Esherick have the possibility of a new job without trashing him again and again. For over a year many on this board have trashed him at every opportunity. I, for one, wish him well and would like to see us give him a new chance. Maybe our bitterness says something about us, not him. Ed, I think most on the board, including myself, want him to have a second chance. I don't think his continued unemployment in formal coaching helps us insofar as this stupid subject comes up every other week, and it doesn't help him because he can't move on either, unfortunately. At the same time, the blame is very much shared between Esh and people like myself who have been more critical of his involvement in the program. When he chirped in the papers about how he resented the criticisms about winning/losing specifically, I believe that he crossed the line and attacked the fan base to some degree. When he criticized our University's President, he crossed another line. I believe he deserves criticism on that basis alone. I think it may be fair to call some of this bitterness, but, at the same time, what else is it? If someone were to ask me whether they should hire CE to coach CBB (which would never happen), I'd have to say that honesty and Hoya loyalty would not produce the same answer from me.
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DanMcQ
Moderator
Posts: 30,510
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Post by DanMcQ on May 6, 2005 16:00:14 GMT -5
I can't believe we can't let Esherick have the possibility of a new job without trashing him again and again. For over a year many on this board have trashed him at every opportunity. I, for one, wish him well and would like to see us give him a new chance. Maybe our bitterness says something about us, not him. Ed, this is basically a case of mass Irish Alzheimer's: in the end, all we can remember are the grudges.
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aggypryd
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,418
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Post by aggypryd on May 6, 2005 16:19:26 GMT -5
I don't think there was an attemp to directly compare Esherick to JT - Craig just seemed to think that he wasn't given a full chance to see what his own players could do ( the lament of every coach fired within the first 4 or 5 years, I suspect). I could see if he were coming in from another university and tried to implement his system. But he had been coaching and operating under the same system for years... I'm disappointed that the Hoyas couldn't do it with a Georgetown guy...but if Georgetown wanted to stay competitive and not jeopardize the programs future, they had to make a move...
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lichoya68
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
OK YOUNGINS ARE HERE AND ARE VERY VERY GOOD cant wait GO HOYAS
Posts: 17,438
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Post by lichoya68 on May 6, 2005 17:18:12 GMT -5
i wish esh well we need to remember despite what elso we feel hes a hoya ,, an alum and spent most of his life working with our bball team.. so lets wish him well ok lets move on and hopefullly he can move on and remember his many good years here as a hoya. go hoyas best to esh
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lichoya68
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
OK YOUNGINS ARE HERE AND ARE VERY VERY GOOD cant wait GO HOYAS
Posts: 17,438
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Post by lichoya68 on May 6, 2005 17:19:50 GMT -5
ps i was one of the forty thousand hoyas who saw him hit the shot vs gw that nite wowowoo
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JimmyHoya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Hoya fan, est. 1986
Posts: 1,867
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Post by JimmyHoya on May 6, 2005 22:53:04 GMT -5
For some reason I have a feeling this thread will erupt into at least 4-5 pages. Nothing gets this board going like Esherick.
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prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 23,267
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Post by prhoya on May 7, 2005 0:56:10 GMT -5
Esh...the cure for a slow board!!!
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dreamhoya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,259
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Post by dreamhoya on May 7, 2005 11:26:43 GMT -5
I am very fond of the Thompson family esp. Ronnie and John's very, very special person of a mother. That being said, i think Ronnie's an Aires, so...if you know anything about astrology...they're extremely driven and may be cut-throat at times.
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SaxaCD
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,401
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Post by SaxaCD on May 7, 2005 12:14:07 GMT -5
Woohoo! 3 pages and counting...
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Post by jerseyhoya34 on May 7, 2005 12:18:17 GMT -5
bump
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hoyabinx
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,043
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Post by hoyabinx on May 7, 2005 13:46:32 GMT -5
That is great for Esh. I hope everything works out well for him. He spent about 25 years of his life as a dedicated Hoya and I respect him very much for it.
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