why not play hayes more ?

[canissaxa]

Nov 23, 2015 21:26:01 GMT -5 SFHoya99 said:

It's not the worst question in the world. I wouldn't be so ... certain ... about it, but Hayes is the only guy on our team who has gathered defensive rebounds, which would have been nice. Yes, he can be a bit slow on D but his low post play gives an interesting dynamic and maybe he grabs a few of those rebounds that ended up in Amile Jefferson's hands?

Wise and very generous--there's a reason SF is my favorite poster here.

[joey0403p]

It is a legit question. You can't be certain obviously, but we saved him in the first half when he picked up the fouls, but saved him for what?

He wasn't a "revolving door" or whatever someone said.

Morning was playing well. As was govam. But Hayes has a couple inches on them. Maybe he gets one of those rebounds.


Just saying its a legit question.

[professorhoya]

Nov 24, 2015 0:02:53 GMT -5 joey0403p said:

It is a legit question. You can't be certain obviously, but we saved him in the first half when he picked up the fouls, but saved him for what?

He wasn't a "revolving door" or whatever someone said.

Morning was playing well. As was govam. But Hayes has a couple inches on them. Maybe he gets one of those rebounds.


Just saying its a legit question.

I dunno, calling the coach stupid and clueless and the hoyatalk posters idiots doesn't seem legit to me. Could have easily placed it in the Duke thread or the Bradley Hayes thread instead of making a new thread.

[skyhoya]

coach makes his mind up on things and he just continue to do the same thing. Hayes is not his man. He did the same thing when Tyler Crawford got hurt, he forgot he was on the bench when Tyler returned.

[kchoya]

Nov 24, 2015 8:58:01 GMT -5 skyhoya said:

coach makes his mind up on things and he just continue to do the same thing. Hayes is not his man. He did the same thing when Tyler Crawford got hurt, he forgot he was on the bench when Tyler returned.

Hayes is not his man? Have you watched the first four games?

[ColumbiaHeightsHoya]

I think it is a function of match-ups and how Hayes is playing. If he is bringing it early on then he plays a lot. I also think with Plumlee getting few minutes due to fouls, that limited Hayes minutes. Hayes is a bad match-up with Jefferson, Ingram & Jeter. He was a great match-up against Stone, Dodd & Civosky. I wouldn't read too much into it.

[This Just In]

When you lose, in game decisions should be question. A possession here and there is the difference between a win or loss. Down the final stretch of the game, several posters pointed out how Duke was getting rebounds that could have been rebounded by a Hoya.

Duke 31 rebounds vs Gtwon 27 rebounds


The last 5 minutes of the game Amile Jefferson grabbed 4 rebounds, 2 of which were offensive rebounds in a 4 second span which lead to 2 points by Duke. If Gtown could have gotten one of those boards then that is 1 extra possession that the Hoyas have in a game that ended in a 2 point loss.

[CTHoya08]

Nov 24, 2015 8:58:01 GMT -5 skyhoya said:

coach makes his mind up on things and he just continue to do the same thing. Hayes is not his man. He did the same thing when Tyler Crawford got hurt, he forgot he was on the bench when Tyler returned.

Tyler Crawford started the first game of the season as a junior and didn't perform particularly well. (The following Monday, Father Schall was teasing him in class about not being able to hit the broad side of a barn.) He came down with mono and was out for months. In the meantime, that team developed into a powerhouse. Whose minutes should he have taken? I'm not saying that one game truly is a sufficient sample size to write off Crawford, but maybe a guy who got limited burn on a Final Four team isn't the best example for "JTIII is stubborn and refuses to play the guys who aren't his favorites"?

It's certainly possible that Hayes could have grabbed an important rebound or two down the stretch, but it's not like he was tearing it up in the Duke game and JTIII mysteriously benched him at crunch time.

[Deleted]

There was a play at the end of the game where Plumlee grabbed a board after he literally shoved Jessie to the side to get around him. One of Graysons late drives he siff armed a defender on his way to the basket not the first time. Duke players especially Amile were moving on damn near every screen also.. You could point to a plethora of things in a one point loss that could have possibly effected the outcome..

It matters not though they beat us and we have to get better...

[rockhoya]

Nov 23, 2015 19:47:44 GMT -5 jctnhoya4ever said:

Did you not watch the maryland game? Hayes was killing on the inside, if not for him we would have got blew out that game.he had like 18pts 10 rebounds. This board does not no basketball. A bunch of educated idiots. To hell with you.

Lol and against Duke he wasn't good, were you not watching that?

[rockhoya]

Nov 24, 2015 10:23:54 GMT -5 This Just In said:

When you lose, in game decisions should be question. A possession here and there is the difference between a win or loss. Down the final stretch of the game, several posters pointed out how Duke was getting rebounds that could have been rebounded by a Hoya.

Duke 31 rebounds vs Gtwon 27 rebounds


The last 5 minutes of the game Amile Jefferson grabbed 4 rebounds, 2 of which were offensive rebounds in a 4 second span which lead to 2 points by Duke. If Gtown could have gotten one of those boards then that is 1 extra possession that the Hoyas have in a game that ended in a 2 point loss.

....and you're implying Hayes could've gotten us extra rebounds? Just because he has an inch or two on Govan? Hmmmm seems like it should've been pretty simple for coach then!

[Filo]

Love this thread. Broad smile reading some of these comments. Hoyatalk, you always entertain!

[FrazierFanatic]

Nov 24, 2015 10:23:54 GMT -5 This Just In said:

When you lose, in game decisions should be question. A possession here and there is the difference between a win or loss. Down the final stretch of the game, several posters pointed out how Duke was getting rebounds that could have been rebounded by a Hoya.

Duke 31 rebounds vs Gtwon 27 rebounds


The last 5 minutes of the game Amile Jefferson grabbed 4 rebounds, 2 of which were offensive rebounds in a 4 second span which lead to 2 points by Duke. If Gtown could have gotten one of those boards then that is 1 extra possession that the Hoyas have in a game that ended in a 2 point loss.

Bradley played 10 minutes and pulled down zero rebounds. Zero. Jessie played 17 minutes and had 4 boards. I apologize for bringing facts into this discussion.

[calhoya]

Nov 24, 2015 12:00:13 GMT -5 FrazierFanatic said:

Nov 24, 2015 10:23:54 GMT -5 This Just In said:

When you lose, in game decisions should be question. A possession here and there is the difference between a win or loss. Down the final stretch of the game, several posters pointed out how Duke was getting rebounds that could have been rebounded by a Hoya.

Duke 31 rebounds vs Gtwon 27 rebounds


The last 5 minutes of the game Amile Jefferson grabbed 4 rebounds, 2 of which were offensive rebounds in a 4 second span which lead to 2 points by Duke. If Gtown could have gotten one of those boards then that is 1 extra possession that the Hoyas have in a game that ended in a 2 point loss.

Bradley played 10 minutes and pulled down zero rebounds. Zero. Jessie played 17 minutes and had 4 boards. I apologize for bringing facts into this discussion.

I do believe that Hayes playing time will be dictated by match-ups. After two strong games to start the season, he was largely ineffective in his 24 minutes of playing against Wisconsin and Duke. He had collectively 2 rebounds, 4 fouls, 5 turnovers and 6 points. He is a great story and I root for him, but I do not think that his ceiling at this point is equal or near that of Govan and Mourning. He does not have the same touch as Govan and has been less reliable at the foul line late in games. I hope and expect that he continues to play a lot and contribute, but for the first time in my memory, the Hoyas are using their bench and it means anyone could sit if ineffective. Even DSR has been pulled from games when his performance was off. This should not be a negative discussion about a player who deserves time and has earned the respect of the program for his work ethic and team play. It simply is a reflection of the depth of this team this year.

[FrazierFanatic]

I hope you did not take my post as a shot at B. I absolutely love the fact that he has stayed in the program, been a great teammate, worked hard and is now getting his chance and some outstanding results.

I was really just trying to make the same point that you were - with the depth and options we now have, the guys on the floor at crunch time will be the guys who are getting it done that night.

[calhoya]

Nov 24, 2015 12:25:03 GMT -5 FrazierFanatic said:

I hope you did not take my post as a shot at B. I absolutely love the fact that he has stayed in the program, been a great teammate, worked hard and is now getting his chance and some outstanding results.

I was really just trying to make the same point that you were - with the depth and options we now have, the guys on the floor at crunch time will be the guys who are getting it done that night.

I did not assume that you were taking a shot and hope that I did not create that impression. I actually intended to supplement your comments by pointing out that he also struggled in the Wisconsin game. I hope that JT III continues to play the kids that are producing. It is a pleasure to watch the game knowing that if someone is having an off night or simply cannot match up with an opponent there might be an option on the bench. This will only get better when Tre and White are healthy and ready to go.

[FrazierFanatic]

The full strength Hoyas in March would be an exciting prospect.

[bmartin]

Mourning played well in the first half when both Hayes and Govan had two fouls.
Hayes did little of note in the first 6+ minutes of the 2nd half during a 21-7 Duke run. Plumlee outscored and outrebounded him.
Govan played better for a while but then committed two turnovers, and JTIII went with Mourning for 4+ minutes and then went back to Govan except for a couple of defense/offense subs with Mourning to save Govan's fouls when we were intentionally fouling.
Nothing Hayes had done previously in the game suggests that he would have played better than Mourning or Govan.

[EtomicB]

Nov 24, 2015 12:00:13 GMT -5 FrazierFanatic said:

Nov 24, 2015 10:23:54 GMT -5 This Just In said:

When you lose, in game decisions should be question. A possession here and there is the difference between a win or loss. Down the final stretch of the game, several posters pointed out how Duke was getting rebounds that could have been rebounded by a Hoya.

Duke 31 rebounds vs Gtwon 27 rebounds


The last 5 minutes of the game Amile Jefferson grabbed 4 rebounds, 2 of which were offensive rebounds in a 4 second span which lead to 2 points by Duke. If Gtown could have gotten one of those boards then that is 1 extra possession that the Hoyas have in a game that ended in a 2 point loss.

Bradley played 10 minutes and pulled down zero rebounds. Zero. Jessie played 17 minutes and had 4 boards. I apologize for bringing facts into this discussion.

Not that this matters at all but I re-watched the start of the game because I was sure I saw Hayes get a rebound early on..

It turns out the very 1st Duke miss(a layup by Jefferson) was pulled down by Hayes but the official scorer gave it to Kaleb Johnson who wasn't even on the floor at the time..

Hayes also pulled down a missed tap in by Matt Jones @ the 17:30 mark of the 1st half, they gave that board to LJ..

I stopped watching there but in fairness he did have at least 2 rebounds in the game fwiw..

[AlexanderClaude]

Not gonna lie, I'm excited to have Govan in at the end of games for his free throw shooting, that is a luxury most teams would want..