rockhoya
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Post by rockhoya on Mar 25, 2015 14:41:07 GMT -5
Isn't that a different result, then? I guess you could consider it different results if you discount beating #14 Belmont in 2012. Is your goal to beat a double digit seed? No, but it also goes beyond what number sits beside the team name. We should know this by now....
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drquigley
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Post by drquigley on Mar 25, 2015 14:43:11 GMT -5
I hate to say this but I think the "boring" you are talking about is really the new BE. Playing/Beating Butler or Creighton snd (someday) Xavier will never be as exciting as playing/beating Syracuse, UCONN, or Louisville. Not just because of the stature of those programs but because of the crowds they drew and the excitement they, and those crowds, generated. I usually attend 5 home games a year. This year we won all 5 games (4 in the BE). The Butler game was great and the ending I will always remember. But man, just walking into Verizon for a Syracuse or UCONN game was electric. I'm just afraid that we are going to have to get our biggest thrills from our OOC games. Look, I like the new BE and am glad to play every team home and home. But we are going to have to generate our excitement in this league. I think the next few years when we are looking at 5-6 loss seasons and definite runs at the BE title we will generate a lot of excitement. Plus if our Frosh (Peak especially) develop into NBA caliber players that will also help. But I think what we are all feeling is nostalgia for what once was.
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NCHoya
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Post by NCHoya on Mar 25, 2015 14:43:43 GMT -5
Courageous thread Cam, but very true and left unspoken until now.
Agree with the general consensus about the season being boring and predictable. We beat all the teams we should, but lost to most good teams we played as well. We basically knew the team's ceiling and that is unusual in the III era. I never really believed we could beat anyone on any given night. Also, there is a lot to be said for just a lack of top-end talent. We had been a Top 10 team at some point for 7 straight years, that means we were watching some great basketball and talent. This team was a Top 30 team.
As for the roster, the chemistry on the court was not clear. DSR playing point clearly took away some of the "fun" in his game. Josh Smith was basically a one year player, and his disappearing acts were not enjoyable at all. The foul rates of Smith/Hopkins really made it tough to watch at times. We played ugly and I really do not enjoy that type of play, even when effective. The fact that when Tre entered the game it felt to me like a breath of fresh air made me realize just how stale things had gotten.
Also, for the second year in a row, we did not run the offense, and for me, that takes away some of the entertainment value. I like to see the back cuts and the interior passing. I am hoping to see that come back with the versatile team that is returning.
And the ugly truth is the Big East is no longer an exciting conference. We went from playing in the most dominant and dynamic basketball conference to one that more closely resembles the A10 than the ACC. We used to play numerous games a season against Top 25 teams. I still need to get used to this new reality - it is not as easy as I thought it would be.
Finally, I do not like FS1, and would prefer to be on ESPN. Sorry, but ESPN is clearly passionate about college basketball and it shows in the production. FS1 gives us the money, but it is not in the same ballpark as ESPN.
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NCHoya
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Post by NCHoya on Mar 25, 2015 14:51:09 GMT -5
I hate to say this but I think the "boring" you are talking about is really the new BE. Playing/Beating Butler or Creighton snd (someday) Xavier will never be as exciting as playing/beating Syracuse, UCONN, or Louisville. Not just because of the stature of those programs but because of the crowds they drew and the excitement they, and those crowds, generated. I usually attend 5 home games a year. This year we won all 5 games (4 in the BE). The Butler game was great and the ending I will always remember. But man, just walking into Verizon for a Syracuse or UCONN game was electric. I'm just afraid that we are going to have to get our biggest thrills from our OOC games. Look, I like the new BE and am glad to play every team home and home. But we are going to have to generate our excitement in this league. I think the next few years when we are looking at 5-6 loss seasons and definite runs at the BE title we will generate a lot of excitement. Plus if our Frosh (Peak especially) develop into NBA caliber players that will also help. But I think what we are all feeling is nostalgia for what once was. Agree completely, I would also say having Nova be so dominant (with a boring roster as well) hurt the excitement level. No other team had any realistic chance to win the conference, playing for second is never fun.
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sweetness
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 834
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Post by sweetness on Mar 25, 2015 15:38:46 GMT -5
I agree with the points above - the season was uneventful, and the style of play was boring at best and really tough to watch at worst. This was one of those years where I frankly wasn't all that excited to watch the games, other than seeing how the freshmen were improving.
Having said that, I am really looking forward to next year's team. Also I am not as down on the schedule/conference as others.
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richfame
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,266
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Post by richfame on Mar 25, 2015 16:08:34 GMT -5
Courageous thread Cam, but very true and left unspoken until now. Agree with the general consensus about the season being boring and predictable. We beat all the teams we should, but lost to most good teams we played as well. We basically knew the team's ceiling and that is unusual in the III era. I never really believed we could beat anyone on any given night. Also, there is a lot to be said for just a lack of top-end talent. We had been a Top 10 team at some point for 7 straight years, that means we were watching some great basketball and talent. This team was a Top 30 team. As for the roster, the chemistry on the court was not clear. DSR playing point clearly took away some of the "fun" in his game. Josh Smith was basically a one year player, and his disappearing acts were not enjoyable at all. The foul rates of Smith/Hopkins really made it tough to watch at times. We played ugly and I really do not enjoy that type of play, even when effective. The fact that when Tre entered the game it felt to me like a breath of fresh air made me realize just how stale things had gotten. Also, for the second year in a row, we did not run the offense, and for me, that takes away some of the entertainment value. I like to see the back cuts and the interior passing. I am hoping to see that come back with the versatile team that is returning. And the ugly truth is the Big East is no longer an exciting conference. We went from playing in the most dominant and dynamic basketball conference to one that more closely resembles the A10 than the ACC. We used to play numerous games a season against Top 25 teams. I still need to get used to this new reality - it is not as easy as I thought it would be. Finally, I do not like FS1, and would prefer to be on ESPN. Sorry, but ESPN is clearly passionate about college basketball and it shows in the production. FS1 gives us the money, but it is not in the same ballpark as ESPN. But FS1 has Jill Arrington.
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richfame
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,266
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Post by richfame on Mar 25, 2015 16:13:01 GMT -5
Two points
1. As mentioned above no UCONN and no Syracuse. Although I think a Calhoun less UCONN would become a bore as well.
2. Big memories are made in the NCAA tournament. If we make a huge run and get to the elite 8 this thread would not exist.
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mfk24
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Post by mfk24 on Mar 25, 2015 19:15:14 GMT -5
Two points 1. As mentioned above no UCONN and no Syracuse. Although I think a Calhoun less UCONN would become a bore as well. 2. Big memories are made in the NCAA tournament. If we make a huge run and get to the elite 8 this thread would not exist. #2 is partly true. I was a sophmore during the final 4 year and while that was a great post season run, as far as big memories, nothing beats being in the Verizon Center for the Duke win, or the Freeman Uconn game or the Hibbert 3 game.
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hoya95
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Post by hoya95 on Mar 25, 2015 20:01:01 GMT -5
How exciting was the regular season in college basketball anywhere this year? Outside of Kentucky trying to go undefeated (and most of those games were pretty unwatchable), what grabbed anyone's attention this season? Boring is in the eye of the beholder. But this year we rebounded from being a poor team to having a good, but not great, year. The pain of Saturday aside, the Big East as a whole improved significantly in Year 2 and should keep getting better. Even the losses on Saturday were close. Nobody got outclassed. And next year, we have a chance to be very good with a schedule that includes Syracuse, UConn, Wisconsin or Duke or both, and probably Maryland in the Gavitt tip-off games. If that doesn't wake up the Georgetown fan base, I don't know realistically what can do it. It'd be nice to grab Kentucky's talent each year, but that's not happening.
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rockhoya
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Post by rockhoya on Mar 25, 2015 20:13:13 GMT -5
How exciting was the regular season in college basketball anywhere this year? Outside of Kentucky trying to go undefeated (and most of those games were pretty unwatchable), what grabbed anyone's attention this season? Boring is in the eye of the beholder. But this year we rebounded from being a poor team to having a good, but not great, year. The pain of Saturday aside, the Big East as a whole improved significantly in Year 2 and should keep getting better. Even the losses on Saturday were close. Nobody got outclassed. And next year, we have a chance to be very good with a schedule that includes Syracuse, UConn, Wisconsin or Duke or both, and probably Maryland in the Gavitt tip-off games. If that doesn't wake up the Georgetown fan base, I don't know realistically what can do it. It'd be nice to grab Kentucky's talent each year, but that's not happening. Great point
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tashoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by tashoya on Mar 25, 2015 20:15:58 GMT -5
If by boring you mean we didn't have a guy expelled from team for conduct violations and another disqualified for academics then, yeah, total yawner.
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calhoya
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Post by calhoya on Mar 25, 2015 21:39:20 GMT -5
Lots to complain about after every season, but why go there. Frustrating to watch the team struggle to incorporate Smith, see long scoreless stretches of futility, missed free throws, needless fouls and careless turnovers. Plenty for the fans to complain about, but boring is not a word I would use. There was never a game I was sure they would win-- or lose. The freshmen were maddeningly inconsistent but always brought hope of that breakout moment. Hopkins added a defensive presence that has been missing. DSR unselfish to a fault at times and Trawick with so many "No, No, No Yes!" moments on the court. Rooting for Bowen to take the leap and justify coming back for another year. Hoping that Reggie would regain his shot and disprove the naysayers. Returning to the tournament in March. Plenty of moments to second-guess the coach and the officials. Lots of adjectives come to mind about this year but not boring. I am already eager for Kenner.
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whatmaroon
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Post by whatmaroon on Mar 26, 2015 7:04:32 GMT -5
Was this the most exciting season? Absolutely not, for reasons already enumerated in this thread. But it was a big improvement from 2013-14, so I was content with it.
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JB5
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Post by JB5 on Mar 26, 2015 7:54:13 GMT -5
Whatever the level of boringness during the season, it is still way better than the offseason. Even if I would have preferred a few more wins, this year's team did a great job, finshing 2 in the Big East and representing the University.
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Big Dog
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Post by Big Dog on Mar 26, 2015 10:17:49 GMT -5
The year was boring. The games were generally ugly. Our opponents in the new conference were boring. The new ACC is boring. Not having any marquee wins was boring. Verizon Center home games were generally a snooze fest. The DC local media, much less the national media, never cared what was going on, etc.
Honestly the 3 most exciting moments occurred in November: LJ Peak's debut, the Florida buzzer beater win, and the Wisconsin narrow less. The year never got that exciting again.
I agree that being boring may be the new normal until we've appreciably downgraded our expectations for excitement because of the new conference.
Although I do hate Xavier now with the passion of 1,000 suns. So there's that.
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EasyEd
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Post by EasyEd on Mar 26, 2015 10:23:36 GMT -5
I thought "I'm bored" was only spoken by teenagers. Guess I was right.
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CAHoya07
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Post by CAHoya07 on Mar 26, 2015 17:48:17 GMT -5
Good, not great season. An improvement over 2013-14 for sure. I thought the ceiling for this team was Sweet 16, and we fell a little short. At least we avoided a first round upset again. We seem to continually get half the NCAA Tournament monkey off our back (one win in 2012, then back on the back after the 2013 disaster, then one win again in 2015 after a one-year absence).
I thought there were plenty of exciting moments from the season - Copeland's arrival with the game-winner vs. Butler, the home blowout of #4 Villanova when we were on fire most of the game, and I think the road victory at Butler is extremely underrated. Overall though, I think this team just could not quite get over the hump. Every time we got into the top 25, we would lose and fall out. We avoided bad losses, but we could not sustain momentum, which made me realize this team had a definite ceiling this year. I think it was a combination of the youth and inconsistency of the freshmen and lack of senior leadership - Hopkins and Smith had their moments, good and bad, but were not leaders. I loved Trawick's fire but I couldn't say he was a leader either.
If we had beaten Utah, I think everybody would say that we finally got over the hump, and we would have a much more flowery outlook. But we didn't. As a result, the program is basically in the same spot that we were prior to the season (definitely not worse but only a bit better, I think) - generally good regular seasons, make the NCAA Tournament almost every year, yet at best fall short and at worst grossly underachieve once we get there. We need a season that is a game-changer, that turns this program back around. 2006 was a game-changer, as was 2007. I thought 2013 would be, but the Gulf Coast loss basically erased the regular season in a lot of people's minds. Since 2008, unfortunately, a lot of people see the program as experiencing a slow, steady decline.
Whether 2015 was the start of a Hoya revival or more of the same underachievement remains to be seen. Because of our NCAA Tournament failures over the past eight seasons (that's two full recruiting classes), every season will be Sweet 16 or bust until we get back there. To many, the regular season matters little, and that's a lot of pressure come March. Plenty to be optimistic about though for next season - DSR's senior year, the Fab 4 freshmen will hopefully make the sophomore leap, biggest question mark is frontcourt but hopefully Govan, Derrickson, and eventually Agau will be ready to play right away (and hopefully Hayes can show more signs of life). As far as excitement goes though, there should be plenty of it on our schedule - a continually improving slate of Big East teams, Syracuse at home, UConn on road, 2K Classic, and hopefully more. Hopefully that will help improve attendance (especially on the student side) and help get get our fans back closer to those great 2006-08 seasons and home game atmospheres.
Lastly, like Georgetown, the Big East was definitely improved from last season, but it's still obviously not where we want it to be yet. 6 teams in the NCAA Tournament is great, but a 5-5 record so far with only Xavier left and facing a likely defeat to Arizona is not great. Obviously Villanova losing to NC State in the 2nd round was terrible, as they were our flagship team this year (and had an amazing regular season ruined). If Georgetown and Villanova want to be the banner teams of a strong Big East (which I think is best for the league), both will need to improve tournament performance. Neither has done much of anything in the Big Dance since our 2007 and their 2009 Final Four. Outside of that, Providence's opening round loss to Dayton was very disappointing, I thought they could make a run. They lose Henton but hopefully Dunn will help them be more of a force next year. I hope Seton Hall does not implode, because despite their collapse they have a lot of talent on that team. More or less everything else that happened in the Big East this season was not very surprising to me. Like Georgetown, a good, but ultimately not great season. Hopefully the future is better for both, as well as others (Marquette seems well-positions to take some strides forward next season). A few solid Big East recruiting classes coming in - according to ESPN's 2015 class rankings, Marquette #9, Villanova #19, and Georgetown #23. Hopefully the Big East makes another step forward next season, but we will see (also, it looks like St. John's will be pretty bad next year with what they lose).
All in all, we need a game changer, and I don't know what that is. I still think JT3 is a good coach, and he's not going anywhere. If we don't make the Sweet 16 next year, it will be hard to say that this program isn't seriously stagnating. The fact that this thread title exists (and many agree with it) means we need to get excited again, need to get inspired - the players, the fans, the coaches, the entire program. Here's hoping it happens. 2015-16 could be a very great season, but there is no doubt it is an extremely important season for Georgetown and the Big East. Hoya Saxa.
P.S. While I think sometimes they are unrealistic, I do like that our fans do have high expectations for our team.
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bamahoya11
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Post by bamahoya11 on Mar 26, 2015 19:35:49 GMT -5
Reading this thread really helped me process the weird feeling of emptiness that I felt walking out of the Moda Center last Saturday. At the time, I was still in shock that the season was over but something also just made me feel like that was the most fitting end our season could have--an expected loss to a slightly better team that was close for 38 minutes.
In a lot of ways, this season was boring in that we had to settle for incremental improvements in a season where we all (probably not realistically) hoped for so much more. Make no mistake that this was a big improvement to me over the last two seasons in that the team met pretty much every major expectation. We had four key freshmen make major contributions, went from a losing league record to 12-6 and 2d this year, and kept all our guys eligible. We made the tournament, won a game, and showed some mental toughness along the way. During the regular season we managed a top 5-10 home win (Villanova) and a top 25 road win (Butler). But, all along, I kept thinking they were capable of so much more. They just never really put it all together.
I do agree that with our struggles in March that I probably put way too much into how we do in the tournament. Every year that we leave in the first round, it just leaves a bad taste that I know can't be extinguished for at least another year. Ultimately, I think we are now back where we were in 2012, with a team that met expectations and with the promise to do more going forward. Although I want immediate gratification and this year didn't deliver that in a big way, I think the next 3-5 years could be a really fun ride.
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Mar 26, 2015 19:39:34 GMT -5
The Gamechangers are talent and luck.
If we continue with Top 25 talent, we need to get a little lucky in the tourney.
Or, we can recruit/develop players above that level, or they can play together above that level and not get unlucky, that'll be it, too.
If the 2014 and 2015 classes develop, and if 2016 is a strong class as well, we're going to have a deeper team than ever. That may be enough.
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SaxaCD
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Post by SaxaCD on Mar 26, 2015 21:55:34 GMT -5
Reading this thread really helped me process the weird feeling of emptiness that I felt walking out of the Moda Center last Saturday. At the time, I was still in shock that the season was over but something also just made me feel like that was the most fitting end our season could have--an expected loss to a slightly better team that was close for 38 minutes. In a lot of ways, this season was boring in that we had to settle for incremental improvements in a season where we all (probably not realistically) hoped for so much more. Make no mistake that this was a big improvement to me over the last two seasons in that the team met pretty much every major expectation. We had four key freshmen make major contributions, went from a losing league record to 12-6 and 2d this year, and kept all our guys eligible. We made the tournament, won a game, and showed some mental toughness along the way. During the regular season we managed a top 5-10 home win (Villanova) and a top 25 road win (Butler). But, all along, I kept thinking they were capable of so much more. They just never really put it all together. I do agree that with our struggles in March that I probably put way too much into how we do in the tournament. Every year that we leave in the first round, it just leaves a bad taste that I know can't be extinguished for at least another year. Ultimately, I think we are now back where we were in 2012, with a team that met expectations and with the promise to do more going forward. Although I want immediate gratification and this year didn't deliver that in a big way, I think the next 3-5 years could be a really fun ride. I think this year was a "base building" year, and as such it was a success. No head-scratching losses to terrible teams, some frustrating close losses to very good teams, a lot of experience for a talented freshman class. If our recruiting had stopped, I would be worried, but as it is, I'm very encouraged. Talented guys will come in learning from other very talented players, and there should be excellent quality depth, something that JT3 teams have not always had. We won an NCAA game, could very well have gone further in a different bracket (I felt that Utah matchup really played to some of our weaknesses, and we still acquitted ourselves well). Then again, I love watching the Hoyas, and so no season is boring to me. Maddening, curse-inducing, elating, exhausting, yes. Boring? Never!
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