prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Dec 19, 2014 14:51:51 GMT -5
Hopkins, Bowen and Trawick are great examples of what four year guys should be. Hop and Trawick got a lot of minutes early in their careers because of circumstances so it is understandable that they have stuck with the program and worked on their strengths. Bowen is the one I really admire in this group because he stuck with it when he easily could have transferred after either his sophomore year or redshirt sophomore year. In this day and age of transfers, it is great to see these guys stick with it and they will all be part of the solution to get this team past the first weekend of the NCAA tournament. Are you calling for an exemption on the No-360-Dunk Rule for Bowen? (ducks!!!)
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dense
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Post by dense on Dec 20, 2014 8:56:40 GMT -5
I am simply amazed at how underappreciated Hopkins is. He's our best rebounder, best interior defender, best shot blocker, and best passer from the high post leading to easy back door buckets. I have a feeling we aren't going to appreciate these things until we don't have them next year. The only thing I would dismiss is "best passer from the high post." Big whoop. III always has a big man play that part every year. Problem is that those who do, including Hopkins this season, are typically useless the majority of the time they are in the high post. Only when a backdoor opportunity arises do they help the team being out that far from the basket. When no such backdoor opportunity comes about though they are pretty much useless out on top as they hold onto the ball and wait for a teammate to cut. To this point this is why I can't wait for Mourning to develop.
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jwp91
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Post by jwp91 on Dec 20, 2014 14:35:57 GMT -5
Ok. I am a huge Hoya fan. I love following the team...win or lose.
I am going to be contrarian. I don't think this team is going to be very good. They have tremendous potential, but....
DSR is not himself. He is not finding his rhythm while as be the primary ball handler. Our free throw shooting is poor....and many of our players are slashers who will be getting fouled frequently. Our 3 point percentage is lousy. We refuse to increase the tempo of the game by running or pressing using our depth to our advantage. We are overly reliant on freshman. Our bigs are flawed. One can't play defense outside of the lane and the other is setting all-time records for missing uncontested lay-ups. Our bigs attract fouls like flies to sh**. Eye contact seems sufficent for a foul to be called.
We are going to have some good wins and a bunch of disappointing losses. I am afraid that those expecting greatness are going to lose their minds with frustration.
Unless we fix a bunch of the items above, I don't think we have any chance of Sweet 16.
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njhoya78
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Post by njhoya78 on Dec 20, 2014 14:45:48 GMT -5
Let's get past the first weekend before talking about the Sweet Sixteen. There's a long way to go yet.
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NCHoya
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Post by NCHoya on Dec 20, 2014 14:56:29 GMT -5
Ok. I am a huge Hoya fan. I love following the team...win or lose. I am going to be contrarian. I don't think this team is going to be very good. They have tremendous potential, but.... DSR is not himself. He is not finding his rhythm while as be the primary ball handler. Our free throw shooting is poor....and many of our players are slashers who will be getting fouled frequently. Our 3 point percentage is lousy. We refuse to increase the tempo of the game by running or pressing using our depth to our advantage. We are overly reliant on freshman. Our bigs are flawed. One can't play defense outside of the lane and the other is setting all-time records for missing uncontested lay-ups. Our bigs attract fouls like flies to sh**. Eye contact seems sufficent for a foul to be called. We are going to have some good wins and a bunch of disappointing losses. I am afraid that those expecting greatness are going to lose their minds with frustration. Unless we fix a bunch of the items above, I don't think we have any chance of Sweet 16. I was never expecting a Sweet 16 for this team, I was hoping, but definitely not expecting. I agree with most of the flaws you point out, but there are many positives too. This team has more options on offense than prior Hoyas teams. Definitely a team that generates more points outside the half court. Minus the foul problems, I am not as big a critic of our big men. Hopkins has a nice defined role and Smith has played well. I believe the FTs will get better as guys get more comfortable and the stakes get higher, concentration will go up. My biggest concern is DSR. If he does not get back to playing at a high level, this team will not be successful. To win close games, you need a go to guy, we all took that for granted as a given with DSR. I am not believing what I am seeing right now from him.
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jwp91
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Post by jwp91 on Dec 20, 2014 15:37:08 GMT -5
A couple of responses...
I didn't expect this team to be a Sweet 16 team, but a team described as "very, very good" should have a chance. I am no longer seeing that chance.
I am not a critic of the big men as much as a I recognize they have limitations that can't be ignored.
I agree there are positives....but we also can't ignore the shortcomings as if they don't exist.
Having said, I continue to be a huge fan and will likely watch every game this season. I just think we have enough of a sample to make some reasonable assessments.
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mfk24
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Post by mfk24 on Dec 20, 2014 15:57:58 GMT -5
Ok. I am a huge Hoya fan. I love following the team...win or lose. I am going to be contrarian. I don't think this team is going to be very good. They have tremendous potential, but.... DSR is not himself. He is not finding his rhythm while as be the primary ball handler. Our free throw shooting is poor....and many of our players are slashers who will be getting fouled frequently. Our 3 point percentage is lousy. We refuse to increase the tempo of the game by running or pressing using our depth to our advantage. We are overly reliant on freshman. Our bigs are flawed. One can't play defense outside of the lane and the other is setting all-time records for missing uncontested lay-ups. Our bigs attract fouls like flies to sh**. Eye contact seems sufficent for a foul to be called. We are going to have some good wins and a bunch of disappointing losses. I am afraid that those expecting greatness are going to lose their minds with frustration. Unless we fix a bunch of the items above, I don't think we have any chance of Sweet 16. I think our free throw shooting is improving. We only missed 1 down the stretch of the Charlotte game and that sealed the win. I think the biggest question marks are DSR and 3 point shooting. DSR playing like he did last year and I think we have all the other necessary pieces. Hopefully a few days with family will get DSR's mind right and he'll be ready for conference play.
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hoyainspirit
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Post by hoyainspirit on Dec 20, 2014 16:16:29 GMT -5
Our free throw shooting is poor....and many of our players are slashers who will be getting fouled frequently. Our 3 point percentage is lousy. We refuse to increase the tempo of the game by running or pressing using our depth to our advantage. We were 6-17 from 3, 35.3%. Not great, but far from lousy. Though I don't know for certain, this seemed to be a high possession game. 23-30 from the line, 76.7% as a team is excellent. Peak went 7-7, DSR 4-4. White went 0-2, but he has been money from the line this yr.
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hoyasaxa2003
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Dec 20, 2014 16:26:04 GMT -5
This team takes way too many long twos. I don't think there are statistics on that out there, but I counted at least 5-6 today by a variety of players (DSR took several and White took one). Our three point shooting is awful, but at least we get three points when they go in. My guess is our shooting percentage on the long twos is no better, yet you only get 2 points when they go in. It needs to stop (or they need to be taken as threes). The most frustrating are the DSR shot-fakes from three, and he steps into the line and takes a long two. Those are awful shots we should not be taking with any amount of frequency, especially since the threes often are better looks anyway.
Second, Smith needs to get the ball more often. There are too many possessions where we don't get it into him, and that's not a good thing. I know it can be tough when they are packing in the zone (especially since we cannot get threes), but this needs to be a high priority because it's potentially really great on offense. We aren't taking enough advantage of the double-teams he draws.
Right now, our half-court offense is very weak. Implementing these two changes would go far in helping it out.
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jwp91
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Post by jwp91 on Dec 20, 2014 16:30:34 GMT -5
Season to date, we shoot 34.5% from 3.....8th of 10 in the Big East through the easy part of the schedule.
We shoot 68.4% from the free throw line....also 8th of 10 in the BIg East.
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tashoya
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Post by tashoya on Dec 20, 2014 19:50:07 GMT -5
DSR hopefully won't need to be "the man" in the way that he was last year if the freshmen continue to develop. That's a positive. That said, his slump will end. Every player has limitations. Some can be covered and some cannot. It remains to be seen which we'll have.
As an aside, "huge fans" don't "likely" watch the games.
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njhoya78
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Post by njhoya78 on Dec 20, 2014 21:52:04 GMT -5
Every college team (well, maybe except for Kentucky) has flaws, perhaps even glaring. The winner in any individual college game is going to be the team that can best cope with and camouflage its flaws while successfully exploiting the flaws of the other team. This is not an earth-shattering revelation.
Does this Hoya team have flaws? Absolutely. But so does Duke, and Villanova, and so on and so on. Are there fifty teams that can beat Georgetown? Absolutely. Can Georgetown beat any team in the Top 25? If we don't consider the pro team suiting up in Lexington, absolutely. It all depends, on a game-by-game basis, on which team's flaws are being exposed and exploited more easily.
This team is not perfect. It will be, however, one of the more enjoyable and, occasionally frustrating, seasons in a long time. Let's enjoy the ride.
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tashoya
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Post by tashoya on Dec 20, 2014 23:13:04 GMT -5
Every college team (well, maybe except for Kentucky) has flaws, perhaps even glaring. The winner in any individual college game is going to be the team that can best cope with and camouflage its flaws while successfully exploiting the flaws of the other team. This is not an earth-shattering revelation. Does this Hoya team have flaws? Absolutely. But so does Duke, and Villanova, and so on and so on. Are there fifty teams that can beat Georgetown? Absolutely. Can Georgetown beat any team in the Top 25? If we don't consider the pro team suiting up in Lexington, absolutely. It all depends, on a game-by-game basis, on which team's flaws are being exposed and exploited more easily. This team is not perfect. It will be, however, one of the more enjoyable and, occasionally frustrating, seasons in a long time. Let's enjoy the ride. Fair points. Learning to deal with pressure D is going to be key for this team. And playing better D is going to be big (3's, rotations, switching, pick and rolls). Watching that Cuse/Nova game, Nova is going to win on defense which, at times, they do very well. They are not a good offensive team. Our Hoyas, right now, are better offensively than that squad. But their D, when they turn up the pressure, can be really good. We've been better defensively than last year but there are a bunch of atrocious switches at times that are really hurting us. Peak looks like he's coming around on that a bit. Isaac, hopefully, will be next. On a happier note, Cuse is now 0-2 in their very limited BE schedule. And, yeah, blame it on the refs ya morons. It's a little simpler than that. The Orange kinda suck this year. And that, my fellow Hoyas, is a glorious thing. Jimmy B was likely on the phone with LeMoyne right after the game to check their preseason availability for next year. Oh wait. The Cuse lost to them the last time they played.
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mfk24
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Post by mfk24 on Dec 20, 2014 23:30:37 GMT -5
DSR hopefully won't need to be "the man" in the way that he was last year if the freshmen continue to develop. That's a positive. That said, his slump will end. Every player has limitations. Some can be covered and some cannot. It remains to be seen which we'll have. As an aside, "huge fans" don't "likely" watch the games. What's especially perplexing thought is that not being "the man" should've helped him and it seems to be hurting. Arguably he had significantly more pressure to score the basketball last year because he was one of only 2 or 3 offensive options. Now we can throw several different line-ups out there where all 5 guys can score the ball. In theory that should make it easier for him to get free, and not have to work quite as hard because the defense can't just lock in on him. I get that his role is different being the primary ball handler and initiating the offense, but what hasn't changed is that he's the guy with the ball in his hands late in the shot clock, and he needs to find his rhythm again. Could be the different between a very successful season or coming close but falling short.
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Dec 20, 2014 23:33:40 GMT -5
It's funny, I saw this game as strong evidence that this team can be very, very good, and most of the flaws we exhibited today are completely fixable. The team was dominating Charlotte for much of the game, controlling the boards against a good rebounding team (47% of O boards, 72% of D boards), valuing the ball except for a small stretch of the game (13% TO Rate!), and getting a bunch of easy baskets. We weren't shooting well from three but we ended up strong from the line (77%) and were running and feeding the big man. When Charlotte made runs, what went wrong? During the 7-0 run at the half, we turned the ball over a bunch and gave up an offensive board on a missed FT. But that was a small stretch and he lead was soon back up to 14+ again. So how about the big comeback? Well, a few things drove it: - Hot 3pt Shooting by the Opponent, helping out by
- Continual help on driving players, leading open three point shooters
- Partially caused by both big men being in foul trouble
- Really Editedty transition D
- An amazing about of missed shots.
1. Happens 2. & 4. Seem easily fixable 3. & 5. Still a concern But that's not too bad when you can fix half your issues. Those other two concerns ARE a worry, and the shooting is a really, really big one, but man, there was a lot to like out of the Hoyas today as well.
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tashoya
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Post by tashoya on Dec 21, 2014 0:21:04 GMT -5
DSR hopefully won't need to be "the man" in the way that he was last year if the freshmen continue to develop. That's a positive. That said, his slump will end. Every player has limitations. Some can be covered and some cannot. It remains to be seen which we'll have. As an aside, "huge fans" don't "likely" watch the games. What's especially perplexing thought is that not being "the man" should've helped him and it seems to be hurting. Arguably he had significantly more pressure to score the basketball last year because he was one of only 2 or 3 offensive options. Now we can throw several different line-ups out there where all 5 guys can score the ball. In theory that should make it easier for him to get free, and not have to work quite as hard because the defense can't just lock in on him. I get that his role is different being the primary ball handler and initiating the offense, but what hasn't changed is that he's the guy with the ball in his hands late in the shot clock, and he needs to find his rhythm again. Could be the different between a very successful season or coming close but falling short. It's a perception thing as far as I can tell. He's the "best" player on the team and now he's supposed to run the point so it's not just that he's supposed to score the most, he's supposed to be the facilitator too. He played off the ball more today (early on) than he has in any game this year so far. He was clearly told to look to get his offense going and, for a brief period, it looked like it was working. Peak and Trawick were bringing the ball up with DSR on the floor on repeated offensive sets. That has happened in the past but it looked like a plan today, not just who happened to be open and near the time line.
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tashoya
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Post by tashoya on Dec 21, 2014 0:35:38 GMT -5
It's funny, I saw this game as strong evidence that this team can be very, very good, and most of the flaws we exhibited today are completely fixable. The team was dominating Charlotte for much of the game, controlling the boards against a good rebounding team (47% of O boards, 72% of D boards), valuing the ball except for a small stretch of the game (13% TO Rate!), and getting a bunch of easy baskets. We weren't shooting well from three but we ended up strong from the line (77%) and were running and feeding the big man. When Charlotte made runs, what went wrong? During the 7-0 run at the half, we turned the ball over a bunch and gave up an offensive board on a missed FT. But that was a small stretch and he lead was soon back up to 14+ again. So how about the big comeback? Well, a few things drove it: [/li] [li]Hot 3pt Shooting by the Opponent, helping out by[/li] [li]Continual help on driving players, leading open three point shooters[/li] [li]Partially caused by both big men being in foul trouble[/li] [li]Really Editedty transition D[/li] [li]An amazing about of missed shots.[/li] [/ol] 1. Happens 2. & 4. Seem easily fixable 3. & 5. Still a concern But that's not too bad when you can fix half your issues. Those other two concerns ARE a worry, and the shooting is a really, really big one, but man, there was a lot to like out of the Hoyas today as well.[/quote] Good points as usual. I thought similarly about the run outs and the poor rotations in terms of them being fixable. And Peak, in particular, has already come a good way in his defensive intensity and switching. Today was odd with some of the lineups that were put out there. If anything, those that harp on a longer bench and JT3 being rigid with his "guys" pretty much have no leg to stand on any longer. Some are still clinging to that branch by throwing Hayes in the mix but that argument gets weaker with the minutes that Hayes gets. I wish that weren't the case because we could use that depth if that depth were remotely reliable. I have seen very little to think that it is. I hope Bradley puts it together at some point but I'm not hopeful. There's a big opportunity for him and, to his credit, he's clearly done work in the gym and on the road but it hasn't clicked for him yet on the basketball side of things. Though, to be fair, he's looking to do the right things at times. I see him actively looking for a guy to pin when a shot goes up. If he can do that effectively, that skill alone is one this team needs. His teammates, apparently, don't trust him on offense and that's a problem with which we're familiar. He's had position at times against much smaller guys making the post pass pretty easy to make. Yet the pass isn't made. I doubt that's coincidental. For all of the posters that talk about giving him minutes, in my mind, he's a junior and needs to take minutes by earning them in practice and in the time he does get. You get a pass as a frosh and, to a degree, as a soph. Those passes are gone. It's earning time. One uncontested rebound in emergency minutes doesn't get it done. Assist on a play. Make a block. Deny a post pass. Cause a problem for a guard driving the lane. He's got the body and the mobility. He just needs to get the basketball skills to match his physical improvements. And, speaking of physical improvements, a tip of the cap to Reggie for dropping some bad weight. It has clearly helped his mobility. He's still a bit jumpy on defense but he's better than he was last year by a fair margin. He'll never be fast but his agility is better.
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EasyEd
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Post by EasyEd on Dec 21, 2014 7:58:58 GMT -5
When they are good, they are very, very good; and when they are bad, they are ....
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Post by HoyaSinceBirth on Dec 21, 2014 8:39:36 GMT -5
Season to date, we shoot 34.5% from 3.....8th of 10 in the Big East through the easy part of the schedule. We shoot 68.4% from the free throw line....also 8th of 10 in the BIg East. Small sample sizes still. We're now 6th in FT% ahead of St. John's, Seton Hall, Butler, and Providence. For 3pt% we're ahead of Providence, Butler, St. John's, and only 0.4% behind Nova for 6th place. Nova's only at 35% while we're at 34.6%. Yes Seton Hall, DePaul, Creighton, Xavier, Marquette all have great %'s from 3, but if you look more closely Xavier has played terrible competition and is still losing games. They are a terrible defensive team. Creighton absolutely lives and dies by the 3 and like Xavier is a terrible defensive team. DePaul also terrible defensively who cares if they've hit a decent % from 3. Marquette rarely takes 3pters 223rd in 3ptA/FGA, 228th in % of their pts off of 3pters. There are no complete teams in the BE outside of Nova. St. John's and Butler have great defenses but poor offense. Xavier, Creighton have Great offenses but poor defenses. Providence is Mediocre at both. DePaul and Marquette are bad at both. The only other 2 teams who are good at Both are Us and Seton Hall.
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jwp91
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Post by jwp91 on Dec 21, 2014 8:48:36 GMT -5
Season to date, we shoot 34.5% from 3.....8th of 10 in the Big East through the easy part of the schedule. We shoot 68.4% from the free throw line....also 8th of 10 in the BIg East. Small sample sizes still. It may have been 25 years since Statistics with Winkler, but I am confident that 1/3 of the population is a sufficient sample size to begin drawing some conclusions.
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