blueandgray
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,743
|
Post by blueandgray on Nov 28, 2014 17:51:59 GMT -5
It matters if Butler ends up tanking the rest of the year. Northeastern mattered. I think Butler will be better this year, but they are by no means a lock for the NCAAs even after a great weekend in the Bahamas. You can certainly cost yourself a bid in November, but only going by my eye test (which isn't a lot), I don't think the Butler loss will be crippling to a tournament resume in the long run. Butler beat UNC and Georgetown! They are a top 25 right now. At worst they are a bubble team come tourney time....far from the NU loss.
|
|
EtomicB
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 14,818
Member is Online
|
Post by EtomicB on Nov 28, 2014 17:54:00 GMT -5
Not this argument again.. I agree LJ was bad today but he's a freshman he needs time.. I already know what Jabril is as a player and he has a role on the team, same goes for Hop and Aaron.. However I now want to see what the youngsters can be in more featured roles.. All I meant was that nobody - including Trawick, Bowen, Hopkins AND Peak - should now get minutes if they don't produce. Of course LJ is a frosh and we can expect inconsistency - but we need production to earn minutes, not just potential. I do think Peak will develop and can be a big factor. But in big games, we need big play. I hear you Frazier but my point is I'd like to see them get the 1st crack at the minutes during the rest of the ooc schedule.. I'm all for seeing DSR, LJ, White, Copeland & Smith be the base for the next game with Bril, Hop, AB & Tre filling in..
|
|
blueandgray
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,743
|
Post by blueandgray on Nov 28, 2014 18:03:55 GMT -5
Bril was not very good. Hop's bad moments outweighed his good. Peak was a negative. A number of guys were not "OK to good". But hopefully everyone steps it up at practice and we just get better and better. Trawick was ok and Hopkins was ok for Hopkins. I wouldn't say either really cost us, and certainly not peak who barely played. None of them were terrible, compared to what you can expect for them. Bowen, on the other had, cost us nearly 20 points on things that aren't even excusable for freshman. Bowen made lazy passes, had two turnovers, short armed a 5 foot shot, missed a backdoor lay up, missed a fast break lay up and shot 25% from the line.
|
|
njhoya78
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 7,760
|
Post by njhoya78 on Nov 28, 2014 18:21:33 GMT -5
Trawick was ok and Hopkins was ok for Hopkins. I wouldn't say either really cost us, and certainly not peak who barely played. None of them were terrible, compared to what you can expect for them. Bowen, on the other had, cost us nearly 20 points on things that aren't even excusable for freshman. Bowen made lazy passes, had two turnovers, short armed a 5 foot shot, missed a backdoor lay up, missed a fast break lay up and shot 25% from the line. Aside from that he was great!
|
|
|
Post by michaelgrahmstylie on Nov 28, 2014 18:24:39 GMT -5
Really a bad loss for a team trying to gain credibility. Butler is not a good team. The Hoyas need to find another consistent outside threat. Also need a third big because this team cannot count on Smith and Hopkins staying on the floor through the entire game. Criticized them for averaging 68% on free throws and they responded with just over 50%. The officials stink but they did cause the Hoyas to sleepwalk through this game. Butle is an excellent team. We ran into a buzz saw twice in the last two days. I will agree with you that we need to be looking at two or three bigs for next year. We are running out of time with Josh and his development. Hops is a forward.
|
|
prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 23,239
|
Post by prhoya on Nov 28, 2014 18:39:58 GMT -5
Really a bad loss for a team trying to gain credibility. Butler is not a good team. The Hoyas need to find another consistent outside threat. Also need a third big because this team cannot count on Smith and Hopkins staying on the floor through the entire game. Criticized them for averaging 68% on free throws and they responded with just over 50%. The officials stink but they did cause the Hoyas to sleepwalk through this game. Butle is an excellent team. We ran into a buzz saw twice in the last two days. I will agree with you that we need to be looking at two or three bigs for next year. We are running out of time with Josh and his development. Hops is a forward. Not sure what you mean, but Josh and Hops are done after this year. It's Hayes and the lack of pt he gets that we should he worried about for this and next year. I don't understand it. Throw him into the fire already. He gets to play the most difficult part of last season and yet cannot get off the bench vs the cupcakes. I get that JT3 needed to give Josh as much pt to get back to the game after the layoff, but Hops doesn't need the rest of the pt against the cupcakes. Hops will be Hops. Against Towson, I want to see Josh play 20 mins or less and Hayes take the difference for as long as he lasts. Also, make Cameron shoot it. He's turning into Domingo.
|
|
|
Post by michaelgrahmstylie on Nov 28, 2014 18:46:43 GMT -5
Guys, hold your horses a bit. We played two very good teams in two days--three games in three days. The take-away should be that we got really good exposure to playing at a high level. adversity, if it doesn't break you it makes you better. We just got a whole lot better. I am not going to go nit picking about individual players, except to say that I was happy to see that Copeland proved that he can be a force on both ends.
|
|
|
Post by FrazierFanatic on Nov 28, 2014 18:51:01 GMT -5
Trawick was ok and Hopkins was ok for Hopkins. I wouldn't say either really cost us, and certainly not peak who barely played. None of them were terrible, compared to what you can expect for them. Bowen, on the other had, cost us nearly 20 points on things that aren't even excusable for freshman. Bowen made lazy passes, had two turnovers, short armed a 5 foot shot, missed a backdoor lay up, missed a fast break lay up and shot 25% from the line. Believe me I am not overlooking Bowen's bad game. Just disputing that every other guy played "OK to good". Trawick was not OK, and peak was pretty bad when he was in
|
|
EtomicB
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 14,818
Member is Online
|
Post by EtomicB on Nov 28, 2014 18:58:52 GMT -5
Guys, hold your horses a bit. We played two very good teams in two days--three games in three days. The take-away should be that we got really good exposure to playing at a high level. adversity, if it doesn't break you it makes you better. We just got a whole lot better. I am not going to go nit picking about individual players, except to say that I was happy to see that Copeland proved that he can be a force on both ends. Did the team play at a high level? Exactly how did the team get a "whole" lot better Grahms? I see a lot of the same tendencies/issues I've seen for years
|
|
sleepy
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,079
|
Post by sleepy on Nov 28, 2014 19:15:40 GMT -5
Bowen made lazy passes, had two turnovers, short armed a 5 foot shot, missed a backdoor lay up, missed a fast break lay up and shot 25% from the line. Believe me I am not overlooking Bowen's bad game. Just disputing that every other guy played "OK to good". Trawick was not OK, and peak was pretty bad when he was in I still disagree, they were both nonfactors, but not complete disasters. I don't think one of them not playing would have effected the game either way, can't say the same for Bowen. Really it's III's fault for playing him so much when he was clearly off.
|
|
|
Post by michaelgrahmstylie on Nov 28, 2014 19:17:31 GMT -5
Butle is an excellent team. We ran into a buzz saw twice in the last two days. I will agree with you that we need to be looking at two or three bigs for next year. We are running out of time with Josh and his development. Hops is a forward. Not sure what you mean, but Josh and Hops are done after this year. It's Hayes and the lack of pt he gets that we should he worried about for this and next year. I don't understand it. Throw him into the fire already. He gets to play the most difficult part of last season and yet cannot get off the bench vs the cupcakes. I get that JT3 needed to give Josh as much pt to get back to the game after the layoff, but Hops doesn't need the rest of the pt against the cupcakes. Hops will be Hops. Against Towson, I want to see Josh play 20 mins or less and Hayes take the difference for as long as he lasts. Also, make Cameron shoot it. He's turning into Domingo. I know that both Hops and Josh are done aftr this year. What I was saying is that I would be going after two-three bigs. The problem is we need to bringing in more players as developed as Peak, Copeland, and White.
|
|
|
Post by michaelgrahmstylie on Nov 28, 2014 19:20:19 GMT -5
Guys, hold your horses a bit. We played two very good teams in two days--three games in three days. The take-away should be that we got really good exposure to playing at a high level. adversity, if it doesn't break you it makes you better. We just got a whole lot better. I am not going to go nit picking about individual players, except to say that I was happy to see that Copeland proved that he can be a force on both ends. Did the team play at a high level? Exactly how did the team get a "whole" lot better Grahms? I see a lot of the same tendencies/issues I've seen for years Simple. Playin at the level they played at over the last couple of days, instead of playing all low-level teams like the first three wins. Our guys now know what they have to work on going into the start of Big East play.
|
|
|
Post by michaelgrahmstylie on Nov 28, 2014 19:21:45 GMT -5
"high level" means that they were playing really good teams in Wisconsin and Butler.
|
|
DanMcQ
Moderator
Posts: 30,464
|
Post by DanMcQ on Nov 28, 2014 19:25:00 GMT -5
three games in three days. Actually it was worse: 3 games in roughly 37 hours.
|
|
|
Post by daytonahoya31 on Nov 28, 2014 19:25:34 GMT -5
Not sure what you mean, but Josh and Hops are done after this year. It's Hayes and the lack of pt he gets that we should he worried about for this and next year. I don't understand it. Throw him into the fire already. He gets to play the most difficult part of last season and yet cannot get off the bench vs the cupcakes. I get that JT3 needed to give Josh as much pt to get back to the game after the layoff, but Hops doesn't need the rest of the pt against the cupcakes. Hops will be Hops. Against Towson, I want to see Josh play 20 mins or less and Hayes take the difference for as long as he lasts. Also, make Cameron shoot it. He's turning into Domingo. I know that both Hops and Josh are done aftr this year. What I was saying is that I would be going after two-three bigs. The problem is we need to bringing in more players as developed as Peak, Copeland, and White. We have two HS all-american four star bigs coming in. Does that suffice?
|
|
|
Post by daytonahoya31 on Nov 28, 2014 19:26:49 GMT -5
Guys, hold your horses a bit. We played two very good teams in two days--three games in three days. The take-away should be that we got really good exposure to playing at a high level. adversity, if it doesn't break you it makes you better. We just got a whole lot better. I am not going to go nit picking about individual players, except to say that I was happy to see that Copeland proved that he can be a force on both ends. Did the team play at a high level? Exactly how did the team get a "whole" lot better Grahms? I see a lot of the same tendencies/issues I've seen for years Yes. The team played at an extremely high level against the No. 2 team in the country.
|
|
|
Post by FrazierFanatic on Nov 28, 2014 19:39:11 GMT -5
Believe me I am not overlooking Bowen's bad game. Just disputing that every other guy played "OK to good". Trawick was not OK, and peak was pretty bad when he was in I still disagree, they were both nonfactors, but not complete disasters. I don't think one of them not playing would have effected the game either way, can't say the same for Bowen. Really it's III's fault for playing him so much when he was clearly off. Peak was 0-4 with 0 assists and 2 turnovers and failed to close out on at least 2 three-pointers. Bowen was worse overall, but he did have some points and boards; to claim that Peak was a non-factor is inaccurate.
|
|
sleepy
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,079
|
Post by sleepy on Nov 28, 2014 19:49:43 GMT -5
I still disagree, they were both nonfactors, but not complete disasters. I don't think one of them not playing would have effected the game either way, can't say the same for Bowen. Really it's III's fault for playing him so much when he was clearly off. Peak was 0-4 with 0 assists and 2 turnovers and failed to close out on at least 2 three-pointers. Bowen was worse overall, but he did have some points and boards; to claim that Peak was a non-factor is inaccurate. I guess we will have to agree to disagree.
|
|
EtomicB
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 14,818
Member is Online
|
Post by EtomicB on Nov 28, 2014 19:55:16 GMT -5
Did the team play at a high level? Exactly how did the team get a "whole" lot better Grahms? I see a lot of the same tendencies/issues I've seen for years Yes. The team played at an extremely high level against the No. 2 team in the country. They definitely played well against Wisconsin but with 15 to's and only 7 assists I can't go along with the extremely high level description..
|
|
|
Post by professorhoya on Nov 28, 2014 20:02:06 GMT -5
Yes. The team played at an extremely high level against the No. 2 team in the country. They definitely played well against Wisconsin but with 15 to's and only 7 assists I can't go along with the extremely high level description.. Wisconsin just spanked Oklahoma (who have a very good team). Limiting preseason national player of the year Kaminsky to 6 pts on 1-8 shooting and only 4 rebounds is playing at an extremely high level.
|
|