hoyaloya
Century (over 100 posts)
Posts: 156
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Post by hoyaloya on Nov 17, 2014 19:00:52 GMT -5
The November 17, 2014 issue of National Review includes an article Empty Integrity, written by Jonah Goldberg. He points out that in the traditional view “a person with integrity is someone ‘who desires to do what is morally good in all of his decisions’.” He continues “something in the culture has changed.” In the past, “The hero clung to a definition of ‘good’ that was outside himself, and therefore something he had to reach for.” But, “Not anymore. Now everyone reaches inward for his own vision of integrity.” Goldberg illustrates his point by reference to recent movies and TV shows exemplifying the modern view which “takes the idea that we must apply reason to nature and our consciences in order to discover what is moral and replaces it with the idea that if it feels right, just do it, baby.” In the modern definition, “‘integrity’ can be understood only as a firm commitment to one’s own principles - because one’s own principles are the only legitimate principles.” He concludes “no society in the history of Western civilization has so energetically and deliberately torn down its classical ideal and replaced it with do-it-yourself morality.” One of the movie examples he cites is The Girl Next Door, where a teenage boy, Matthew, falls in love with a porn star. In a speech contest for a college scholarship, he is expected to talk about “moral fiber” but his experience with his neighbor has turned him into a porn mogul. In his speech, he renounces “always telling the truth, doing good deeds…” and notes “…maybe the stuff you do… isn’t so clean. You know what? It doesn’t matter, because… you know that the juice is worth the squeeze.” Goldberg then observes about the movie: “You’ll be delighted to know that, in the end, young porn mogul Matthew gets into Georgetown. Which isn’t much of a stretch, actually.” [Emphasis added.] There was a time when the bolded observation would have been not a “stretch” but inconceivable. Times, and Georgetown, have changed. Sad. Richard M. Coleman Georgetown AB ’57; LL.M. ‘61
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nathanhm
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,041
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Post by nathanhm on Nov 17, 2014 19:16:07 GMT -5
The November 17, 2014 issue of National Review includes an article Empty Integrity, written by Jonah Goldberg. He points out that in the traditional view “a person with integrity is someone ‘who desires to do what is morally good in all of his decisions’.” He continues “something in the culture has changed.” In the past, “The hero clung to a definition of ‘good’ that was outside himself, and therefore something he had to reach for.” But, “Not anymore. Now everyone reaches inward for his own vision of integrity.” Goldberg illustrates his point by reference to recent movies and TV shows exemplifying the modern view which “takes the idea that we must apply reason to nature and our consciences in order to discover what is moral and replaces it with the idea that if it feels right, just do it, baby.” In the modern definition, “‘integrity’ can be understood only as a firm commitment to one’s own principles - because one’s own principles are the only legitimate principles.” He concludes “no society in the history of Western civilization has so energetically and deliberately torn down its classical ideal and replaced it with do-it-yourself morality.” One of the movie examples he cites is The Girl Next Door, where a teenage boy, Matthew, falls in love with a porn star. In a speech contest for a college scholarship, he is expected to talk about “moral fiber” but his experience with his neighbor has turned him into a porn mogul. In his speech, he renounces “always telling the truth, doing good deeds…” and notes “…maybe the stuff you do… isn’t so clean. You know what? It doesn’t matter, because… you know that the juice is worth the squeeze.” Goldberg then observes about the movie: “You’ll be delighted to know that, in the end, young porn mogul Matthew gets into Georgetown. Which isn’t much of a stretch, actually.” [Emphasis added.] There was a time when the bolded observation would have been not a “stretch” but inconceivable. Times, and Georgetown, have changed. Sad. Richard M. Coleman Georgetown AB ’57; LL.M. ‘61 Is there a point in here somewhere? Are you really mad a fictional character got into a fictional Georgetown and he wasn't a nice guy?
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ksf42001
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
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Post by ksf42001 on Nov 17, 2014 21:19:25 GMT -5
If you're using an Elisha Cuthbert movie to make your argument, it probably isn't the greatest argument to begin with. The fact that a throwaway 2004 teen comedy used Georgetown as an aspirational school to attend is actually quite a compliment. What movies in 1957 used Georgetown in the same way? There were obviously dozens, since the school was a much finer/respected institution back then...
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SFHoya99
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 17,663
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Post by SFHoya99 on Nov 17, 2014 21:25:58 GMT -5
Is the National Review really using a 10-year old loose remake of Risky Business as a sign of the end of the world or the decline of morals? That's awesome. Jonah Goldberg must be locked in a time capsule or something. Never mind that he got pretty much all the details of the plot wrong, and that Risky Business is much racier -- but that somehow a movie 10 years old is his indicator! The National Review! Timely!
On the other hand, Girl Next Door is a wildly underrated movie. The launch of Raylan Givens' career, peak Elisha Cuthbert and Emile Hirsh, who did a really nice job. Tackles judgement of others, complacency in one's life and the value of sacrificing for others. And did I mention peak Elisha Cuthbert?
And a fun fact: my Dad loves this movie. He was born in 1950. My dad's awesome.
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TC
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 9,428
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Post by TC on Nov 17, 2014 21:29:12 GMT -5
Can we discuss how Goldberg is factually wrong and how it would be easier for a young white porn mogul to make it into Georgetown in 1957 than the global, nationally ranked University of today?
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Post by strummer8526 on Nov 17, 2014 21:42:45 GMT -5
Sure, but to provide a counterpoint: Fox Mulder is seen wearing Georgetown shirts, and his approach to the expenditure of government resources turns almost entirely on blind faith and wild speculation, so...there's that.
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SFHoya99
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by SFHoya99 on Nov 17, 2014 21:47:26 GMT -5
If you're going to pick on a 10+ year old movie that focuses on a character with no moral compass that goes to Georgetown, shouldn't this have been about Election? Or St. Elmo's Fire?
Then again, since it's the National Review, I'm shocked it isn't about College Road Trip. For, er, reasons.
And again, Girl Next Door had peak Elisha Cuthbert. These are gifts that should not be forgotten.
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SaxaCD
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,401
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Post by SaxaCD on Nov 17, 2014 22:15:52 GMT -5
If you're going to pick on a 10+ year old movie that focuses on a character with no moral compass that goes to Georgetown, shouldn't this have been about Election? Or St. Elmo's Fire? Then again, since it's the National Review, I'm shocked it isn't about College Road Trip. For, er, reasons. And again, Girl Next Door had peak Elisha Cuthbert. These are gifts that should not be forgotten. In fairness to the author, he never said he didn't like the movie or that he didn't appreciate peak Elisha Cuthbert. And I commend him for that.
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prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by prhoya on Nov 17, 2014 22:39:12 GMT -5
Not the same by "24"
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tashoya
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Post by tashoya on Nov 17, 2014 22:54:14 GMT -5
Richard M. Coleman Georgetown AB ’57; LL.M. ‘61,
Thank you for what is the most unintentionally hilarious post I've read in a while. FWIW, in a way, the character did exhibit integrity by fighting and standing up for a person that was shunned by others for her profession. Which, by the way, he wasn't psyched about either. However, he looked past her previous job (it was also made clear that Cuthbert's character was actively trying to distance herself from her past and regretted the career choice) and cared for the person she actually was. Is there a lack of integrity in that? I know you didn't see the movie and, from your excerpt, it sounds like the author of the piece didn't either. I wonder what Animal House says about college, morality, and integrity back in your day that I couldn't have cared less about because I was just in it for the laughs. Getting back to the point, thank you for the chuckle.
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SaxaCD
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by SaxaCD on Nov 17, 2014 23:00:29 GMT -5
I thought that movie coincided with her 24 stint, is that not so?
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SFHoya99
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 17,663
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Post by SFHoya99 on Nov 17, 2014 23:03:31 GMT -5
Yeah, she started on 24 first. After the cougar storyline, she was a minor character, and that was all before Girl Next Door.
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prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by prhoya on Nov 17, 2014 23:05:01 GMT -5
It's an award-winner. "O.K., people, let's makes some..."
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quickplay
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
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Post by quickplay on Nov 18, 2014 7:44:25 GMT -5
Jonah Goldberg, of Liberal Fascism fame? Who literally tried to rewrite the entire Nazi movement as left-wing/progressive to further fan the hatred of contemporary conservatives?
If I had an idiotic, 'get off my lawn' rant I'd probably use his words too.
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pertinax
Century (over 100 posts)
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Post by pertinax on Nov 18, 2014 8:35:05 GMT -5
Richard Coleman once asked whether Logic was still a required course on the Hilltop. The fatuous and irrelevant ripostes to his latest comment are evidence that it is not.
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TC
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by TC on Nov 18, 2014 9:48:16 GMT -5
Richard Coleman once asked whether Logic was still a required course on the Hilltop. The fatuous and irrelevant ripostes to his latest comment are evidence that it is not. Elisha Cuthbert has gained some weight but I don't think she is fatuous.
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prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 23,158
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Post by prhoya on Nov 18, 2014 10:03:40 GMT -5
Richard Coleman once asked whether Logic was still a required course on the Hilltop. The fatuous and irrelevant ripostes to his latest comment are evidence that it is not. Tripod?
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ksf42001
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 901
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Post by ksf42001 on Nov 18, 2014 10:35:40 GMT -5
Are we certain pertinax is who he says he is and not just a 12 year old kid messing with us? Pertinax sometimes (always?) acts like how a preteen would perceive a stodgy condescending private school alum would act.
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quickplay
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 733
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Post by quickplay on Nov 18, 2014 10:51:29 GMT -5
Richard Coleman once asked whether Logic was still a required course on the Hilltop. The fatuous and irrelevant ripostes to his latest comment are evidence that it is not. Please pertinax, do explain the thoughtful dialogue that the post was intended to begin. What would be the appropriate and serious response to yet again a vague whine about declining morals and intellect at Georgetown? Obviously nobody could ever match the intellectual might of you two, but maybe constantly lobbing insults at anyone under 50 isn't the best way to get anything besides 'fatuous and irrelevant ripostes.' Seriously, comments from your high horse are a lot less authoritative when the initial point of discussion is garbage.
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FLHoya
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Proud Member of Generation Burton
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Post by FLHoya on Nov 18, 2014 13:26:21 GMT -5
Richard Coleman once asked whether Logic was still a required course on the Hilltop. The fatuous and irrelevant ripostes to his latest comment are evidence that it is not. I got nothin'. Enjoy some Filter lyrics! Awake on my airplane Awake on my airplane My skin is bear My skin is theirs Awake on my airplane Awake on my airplane My skin is bare My skin is theirs I feel like a newborn And I feel like a newborn Awake on my airplane Awake on my airplane I feel so real [Chorus:] Could you take my picture 'Cuz I won't remember Could you take my picture 'Cuz I won't remember Could you take my picture 'Cuz I won't remember Yeah I don't believe in I don't believe in In your sanctity Your privacy I don't believe in I don't believe in Sanctity A hypocrisy Could everyone agree that No one should be left alone Could everyone agree that They should not be left alone yeah And I feel like a newborn And I feel like a newborn Kicking and screaming [Chorus] Hey dad what do you think about your son now Ah hey dad what do you think about your son now [Chorus (4 times)]
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