prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Jul 23, 2014 13:32:34 GMT -5
I am an infrequent poster, but went to Kenner this past weekend, as I have for the past 10 years or so. I definitely agree that LJ Peak is not necessarily getting the buzz I would expect. His athleticism blew me away, particularly his quick and explosive elevation. He can score in every way imaginable - he is a flat out scoring machine. I was most surprised about his shot - he got hot and was knocking down deep 3s like it was nothing. Couldn't be more excited about this guy. The great thing is I also loved what I saw from Copeland, Campbell, and White. Campbell in particular surprised me relative to rankings/expectations. Copeland is another long, athletic stud, and White is a very cerebral player who is perfect for our offense. I think they all should be in the rotation immediately. I also saw nice flashes from Mourning, but athletically he still has a ways to go I think. Thanks. Yeah, Peak can shoot; as mentioned elsewhere, i don't think he's streaky based on the fact that his FG%s were usually pretty good in school. heck, last year DSR was streaky. Maybe streaky at 3pt line, but guy can play. Something like this?
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Post by BubbleVisionBiff on Jul 23, 2014 14:30:41 GMT -5
It's gonna be great when, after posterizing people a few times, the D hangs back and he gets the ball on a dribble hand off at the top of the key and starts raining. Is it November yet?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2014 15:14:17 GMT -5
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on Jul 23, 2014 16:37:36 GMT -5
I am an infrequent poster, but went to Kenner this past weekend, as I have for the past 10 years or so. I definitely agree that LJ Peak is not necessarily getting the buzz I would expect. His athleticism blew me away, particularly his quick and explosive elevation. He can score in every way imaginable - he is a flat out scoring machine. I was most surprised about his shot - he got hot and was knocking down deep 3s like it was nothing. Couldn't be more excited about this guy. The great thing is I also loved what I saw from Copeland, Campbell, and White. Campbell in particular surprised me relative to rankings/expectations. Copeland is another long, athletic stud, and White is a very cerebral player who is perfect for our offense. I think they all should be in the rotation immediately. I also saw nice flashes from Mourning, but athletically he still has a ways to go I think. Thanks. Yeah, Peak can shoot; as mentioned elsewhere, i don't think he's streaky based on the fact that his FG%s were usually pretty good in school. I'm sure he is a little streaky on that front. I recall when Billy Packer was calling a national game between Gtown and Memphis and Iverson started off HOT, hitting multiple jumpers early on. Packer said Iverson was similar to Jordan in that when his jumper is falling you are completely at his mercy because he has everything else already going for him in terms of ability. While not elevating LJ to the likes of AI or that earlier version of Jordan, he fits that mold because he has the athleticism, explosiveness and speed to get around opponents and get to the hoop as well as finish when he gets there. His outside shooting at the early stage of his development is still his greatest weakness. But on days in which that outside shot is clicking, well, how do you guard him?
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Post by professorhoya on Jul 23, 2014 20:46:56 GMT -5
Thanks. Yeah, Peak can shoot; as mentioned elsewhere, i don't think he's streaky based on the fact that his FG%s were usually pretty good in school. I'm sure he is a little streaky on that front. I recall when Billy Packer was calling a national game between Gtown and Memphis and Iverson started off HOT, hitting multiple jumpers early on. Packer said Iverson was similar to Jordan in that when his jumper is falling you are completely at his mercy because he has everything else already going for him in terms of ability. While not elevating LJ to the likes of AI or that earlier version of Jordan, he fits that mold because he has the athleticism, explosiveness and speed to get around opponents and get to the hoop as well as finish when he gets there. His outside shooting at the early stage of his development is still his greatest weakness. But on days in which that outside shot is clicking, well, how do you guard him? How does Peak's athleticism compare with Trawick?
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on Jul 24, 2014 5:54:11 GMT -5
I'm sure he is a little streaky on that front. I recall when Billy Packer was calling a national game between Gtown and Memphis and Iverson started off HOT, hitting multiple jumpers early on. Packer said Iverson was similar to Jordan in that when his jumper is falling you are completely at his mercy because he has everything else already going for him in terms of ability. While not elevating LJ to the likes of AI or that earlier version of Jordan, he fits that mold because he has the athleticism, explosiveness and speed to get around opponents and get to the hoop as well as finish when he gets there. His outside shooting at the early stage of his development is still his greatest weakness. But on days in which that outside shot is clicking, well, how do you guard him? How does Peak's athleticism compare with Trawick? From all I've seen Peak is a level or two above. It isn't just the leaping ability and how far one can fly, it is also about the explosion and the quickness of the leap. Jabril is a hell of an athlete but he didn't even start dunking on a regular basis while in a Gtown uniform until the second half of last season. This isn't the result of the offense as much as it is Jabril has to gather himself a bit more than the elite leapers do. Take Bowen for instance. That guy takes your breath away by how he can suddenly explode for liftoff. He goes from run to flight in a seamless fashion that it all seems like one fluid motion. Jabril has hops but often you can see him almost switch from his run phase to a "prepare for takeoff" phase and then his body leaves the ground. There is a reason why their former teammate Starks refers to Bowen as one of the best athletes in the world but not Jabril. Personally I believe Bowen is a better athlete than Patrick Ewing Jr. And getting back to Peak I feel he is above Bowen too in the athleticism department. Stronger, faster, better (cue music). Perhaps even a quicker first step, perhaps even more explosive off the bounce. And when you add an almost NBA body/frame to that package that makes for a potentially highly effective weapon. Jabril may be growing more comfortable with his athletic abilities based upon KL reports, but as good as that sounds he may still be only the fourth best athlete on the team next season behind Bowen, Peak and Copeland.
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deacon
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Post by deacon on Jul 24, 2014 14:01:02 GMT -5
I actually think 'Bril has been the best athlete on this team since he got here and is still top dog with Bowen and Peak in second and third.
Just my $0.02
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rockhoya
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Post by rockhoya on Jul 24, 2014 14:07:13 GMT -5
I actually think 'Bril has been the best athlete on this team since he got here and is still top dog with Bowen and Peak in second and third. Just my $0.02 I respect that, but don't really understand it. Can you elaborate a little more on why you think Jabril is a better athlete than Aaron or Peak?
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blueandgray
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Post by blueandgray on Jul 24, 2014 14:28:02 GMT -5
I actually think 'Bril has been the best athlete on this team since he got here and is still top dog with Bowen and Peak in second and third. Just my $0.02 I respect that, but don't really understand it. Can you elaborate a little more on why you think Jabril is a better athlete than Aaron or Peak? Bryce Cotton says hello.
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rockhoya
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Post by rockhoya on Jul 24, 2014 14:35:03 GMT -5
I respect that, but don't really understand it. Can you elaborate a little more on why you think Jabril is a better athlete than Aaron or Peak? Bryce Cotton says hello. Was that meant for me? I'm confused
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on Jul 24, 2014 14:56:13 GMT -5
I actually think 'Bril has been the best athlete on this team since he got here and is still top dog with Bowen and Peak in second and third. Just my $0.02 Disagree. For now I'll table any further Peak and Copeland talk until they suit up for a college game, but how do you place Trawick (full disclosure: my fave player on the team) over Bowen? Perhaps it comes down to how you describe athleticism. If you include hand-eye cordination and stamina maybe you have a point. But if it is merely run/jump then Bowen wins tha title. Consider that Bowen has played far, far less time than Jabril during the past three seasons and yet has more memorable "wow" moments exhibited through his athletic ability. He picked up the nickname Air Bowen for a reason. Both that Ben Standig ( ) guy and Gene Wang, who both covered the Hoyas for local media services, would tweet about Bowen providing at least one spectacular play per game. And Bowen can knock your socks off on that front both in the fullcourt and the halfcourt too. Recall the ridiculous first-step which led to one bounce down the baseline before he dunked like Jordan against Texas at MSG a couple of seasons back? Or the in-the-air-twisting putback for the deciding basket against Lousiville? How about the putback dunk off a miss against Oregon during that game played in Korea? Better yet the drive down the middle for the quick two-handed flush against taller Seminoles in the NIT? Those are all great plays in the halfcourt. Meanwhile for most of his GU career Jabril was too often missing lightly contested baskets on fastbreak opportunities or halfcourt drives, particularly because he was trying for layups instead of taking it strong. Even when he started finishing better midway through last season, his favorite basket was still the layup even though he should have been trying to throw it down more (suggesting he needs a clear staright path with a nice running start to do so). Look, it is no shame to not be as elite an athlete as Bowen. Trawick has other strengths that Bowen lacks anyway. But as far as the eye-test is concerned Bowen has the edge when it comes to athleticism.
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jwp91
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Post by jwp91 on Jul 24, 2014 14:58:20 GMT -5
To my eyes, Bowen is a stronger athlete than Trawick who is also an excellent athlete. Bowen takes off and just doesn't come down. If he had game to match his athleticism, he would be incredible.
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on Jul 24, 2014 15:02:24 GMT -5
I respect that, but don't really understand it. Can you elaborate a little more on why you think Jabril is a better athlete than Aaron or Peak? Bryce Cotton says hello. Are you saying that Jabril did a better defensive job on Cotton and thus he is a better athlete? If so a counter would be that Joseph Toumou often ended up playing better and more sound defense than his teammate AI. But Toumou was not in the same zip code as far as athleticism is concerned.
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rockhoya
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Post by rockhoya on Jul 24, 2014 15:35:02 GMT -5
Are you saying that Jabril did a better defensive job on Cotton and thus he is a better athlete? If so a counter would be that Joseph Toumou often ended up playing better and more sound defense than his teammate AI. But Toumou was not in the same zip code as far as athleticism is concerned. Exactly. I've played against both of them, albeit not in an organized setting, but they were both on the same team and I had the chance to guard both of them. Aaron is a more threatening athlete, imo. The reason why Jabril has to gather is because he's more mechanical and predictable.
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sleepy
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Post by sleepy on Jul 24, 2014 15:49:43 GMT -5
Not to speak for B&G but it was clear what he meant. I remember clearly Bowen by himself allowing Cotton to get off late in the first half of the 2nd PC game. It had so little to do with Athleticsm but with an extreme lack of basic defensive skills knowledge of what his teamates were doing, and amental lapse regarding who you were guarding. Simply put being a great athlete does not make you even a good college basketball player. You need at least a modicom of basic basketball skills.
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rockhoya
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Post by rockhoya on Jul 24, 2014 17:32:42 GMT -5
Not to speak for B&G but it was clear what he meant. I remember clearly Bowen by himself allowing Cotton to get off late in the first half of the 2nd PC game. It had so little to do with Athleticsm but with an extreme lack of basic defensive skills knowledge of what his teamates were doing, and amental lapse regarding who you were guarding. Simply put being a great athlete does not make you even a good college basketball player. You need at least a modicom of basic basketball skills. I don't want to speak for the op but I don't think anyone was trying to associate athleticism and the ability to play basketball. I could be wrong though
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sleepy
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Post by sleepy on Jul 24, 2014 18:43:11 GMT -5
Rock point taken and understood. Perhaps i was reacting to MCI characterzation of athleticsm all excellent and valid points he made. AB clearly has the wow factor at times. Does that make him an Elite athlete at this level. I'm not so sure.He has some tremendous physiological skills no doubt i might question his ability to change directions his hips and turn his lack of lateral quickness but that may be more skill related. AI was a freak of an athlete almost off the charts I believe at any sport he chose he may have well reached the same level of excellence. Discounting AI, Eric Smith was a tremendous college athlete certainly at a different level than AB. Perhaps i just feel that a great Athlete should have the abilty to develop those weaker skills that are integral part of the sport you play to much higher level than i have seen from AB in the 3 plus years he has played. Hope he proves me wrong.
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on Jul 24, 2014 18:49:53 GMT -5
Not to speak for B&G but it was clear what he meant. I remember clearly Bowen by himself allowing Cotton to get off late in the first half of the 2nd PC game. It had so little to do with Athleticsm but with an extreme lack of basic defensive skills knowledge of what his teamates were doing, and amental lapse regarding who you were guarding. Simply put being a great athlete does not make you even a good college basketball player. You need at least a modicom of basic basketball skills. I decided not to speak for him in order to ensure I wouldn't peg him to a point of view he didn't have. That being said I nonetheless covered that interpretation by making the same point you just did in my previous point: being a great athlete does not equal being a great defender. Toumou was a poor athlete compared to Iverson but he had a much better defensive stance and understood how to bother the man he was guarding. Iverson relied on his speed, agility, athleticism and long arms to make up for his often lazy defensive play. He would go for the steal rather than try to stay in front of his man. Must have been tempting for him to go after steals since he was so good at it but in the end it was mostly porous defense. Just like today Bowman is the better athlete but Trawick, despite his foul troubles last season, is the better defender.
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tashoya
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Post by tashoya on Jul 24, 2014 18:51:02 GMT -5
None of the guys on the team are ridiculous enough athletes such that their athleticism can substitute for a lot of hours of work on the fundamentals. Only a guy like AI could get away with that at a high level. There aren't many guys like AI. Isn't it fun that we can have this discussion though? That hasn't been the case for a while.
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sleepy
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Post by sleepy on Jul 24, 2014 20:05:14 GMT -5
None of the guys on the team are ridiculous enough athletes such that their athleticism can substitute for a lot of hours of work on the fundamentals. Only a guy like AI could get away with that at a high level. There aren't many guys like AI. Isn't it fun that we can have this discussion though? That hasn't been the case for a while. Could not agree more with every point you made.
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