Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 28, 2014 15:36:57 GMT -5
For next year - the odds of us adding a PG that is better than Tre Campbell at this point in the recruiting cycle are pretty slim. While the crop of available centers for next year is probably pretty slim too - If the idea is to add another recruit for next year who can help immediately, a center still seems to be clearly a greater need given the other centers we will have to choose from on the current roster. It is quite possible that by the time we get to february next year, a lot of the halfcourt offense will be running through Paul White at the high post. If you have not watched him yet, there are a couple of full games on-line, they are worth checking out. He is a very good passer, with a particular emphasis on making really quick, often aggressive decisions when he gets the ball. He shoots the foul line jumper very well, and at a long 6'9 he feeds the post over the defender extremely effectively. He can also put the ball on the floor and hit a mid lane floater from the high post. Once white gets comfortable with the speed/physicality of the college game (which may take some time), he is going to be a very good fit for our half court offense. In many ways, White may be the best fit for JTIII's offensive vision of anyone who has suited up for him at Georgetown. He really does remind you of Kyle Anderson - except he is taller, a bit more athletic, a better shooter (than a freshman Anderson - Kyle has shot real well this year), moves his feet on defense a bit better. Not as gifted a passer, but still very good; not as strong as sophomore anderson, not as good a rebounder. Remember how excited everyone was for Anderson as a potential hoya? We just may be getting a very similar talent in White. You can find a good guard now or in the offseason especially once transfer season starts. Ideal situation it would be a kid like UNLV just landed named Cody Dooling. He’s a good facilitator, Senior transfer from USF. You get him for a year and then he’s gone doesn’t hurt your scholly situation really. If things stay as is I would look hard at running Paul in a KA role if I was 3… real hard
|
|
|
Post by hoyadestroya87 on Feb 28, 2014 15:37:38 GMT -5
D. Graham Brewster A = PG A. DeLaRosa CTK = C
|
|
gujake
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 831
|
Post by gujake on Feb 28, 2014 16:36:50 GMT -5
Jabril and Tre are alternatives as PGs next year (and are going to do a better job playing PG next year than the current crew of centers is going to do playing center next year), and we can break the press with a team approach using Peak/White/Copeland, similar to what we did with Otto and w/ Monroe. Not to mention that we don't have to run our offense through our PG--we can run it through a wing like we did with Otto (and technically through a big, but hey, let's not do that next year). And the reason a big is the most important add for next year is that bigs (1) tend to develop more slowly; and (2) are more likely to get in foul trouble (especially the group of bigs, including Smith, that we currently have). Consequently, if we only had one schollie, I'd rather see it used on a big next year than a PG, especially b/c it means we'll have a sophomore center in 2015 rather than a freshman for the year we are most likely going to be in the best position to make a run at a national title (I mean, if we get Ivan Rabb in 2015, sure, we don't need a center as much in 2014, but is that something we want to count on?). Hayes is our only big guy on the roster in 2015, and that's the kind of hole that prevents a roster that's stacked at every other position from being a great team. Yeah, this. I would love to get both, but I think C is a much more pressing need. Two years ago Jason Clark started at PG and played half of the PG minutes and we were a #3 seed. I don't think it's ideal, but playing a combo at PG in our offense is fine.
|
|
|
Post by FrazierFanatic on Feb 28, 2014 16:49:18 GMT -5
One small problem, YaBoy: you say that Tre can't be expected to contribute as a freshman, but you are advocating recruiting a PG for next year - who couldn't be expected to contribute as a freshman! Now if we are considering getting a transfer PG, you may be right about priority.
|
|
|
Post by FrazierFanatic on Feb 28, 2014 16:50:04 GMT -5
Sorry - I didn't see your follow-up discussing transfers.
|
|
EtomicB
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 14,934
|
Post by EtomicB on Feb 28, 2014 18:01:16 GMT -5
zagsblog.com/articles/7-footer-nba-prospect-ristic-is-arizonas-to-lose/“He’s a legit 7-footer with a great frame and really long arms,” Jonathan Givony of DraftExpress.com told SNY.tv.
“He’s as skilled a big man as you’ll find. He can score with either hand in the post, is an excellent passer, and can step outside and shoot from the perimeter as well. He’s consistently been considered one of the top prospects in the 1995 international class, which is one of the most talented we’ve seen in quite some time. He’s been really well-coached and should be able to contribute significantly from day one. He needs to continue to fill out his frame and improve his ability to deal with contact and physical play as he makes the jump to competing against higher level competition, but he’s a definite NBA prospect long-term.”Why isn't the staff flipping boulders like 'Zona is? Not trying to be an @ss but any program can recruit top 50 kids, that's why I'm not going crazy about them offering Grandsatff.. Don't get me wrong I'd take him in a second but he's an obvious choice, why aren't kids like Ristic visiting G'town or on the staff's radar?
|
|
chep3
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,314
|
Post by chep3 on Feb 28, 2014 18:08:36 GMT -5
It may not be best for the team, but it's best for DSR to play point. If he wants to have any shot at making the league, he needs to play with the ball in his hands and show that he can do something else at an elite level other than score. If we do right by him, we should at least give him the shot to play some point.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 28, 2014 18:19:58 GMT -5
zagsblog.com/articles/7-footer-nba-prospect-ristic-is-arizonas-to-lose/“He’s a legit 7-footer with a great frame and really long arms,” Jonathan Givony of DraftExpress.com told SNY.tv.
“He’s as skilled a big man as you’ll find. He can score with either hand in the post, is an excellent passer, and can step outside and shoot from the perimeter as well. He’s consistently been considered one of the top prospects in the 1995 international class, which is one of the most talented we’ve seen in quite some time. He’s been really well-coached and should be able to contribute significantly from day one. He needs to continue to fill out his frame and improve his ability to deal with contact and physical play as he makes the jump to competing against higher level competition, but he’s a definite NBA prospect long-term.”Why isn't the staff flipping boulders like 'Zona is? Not trying to be an @ss but any program can recruit top 50 kids, that's why I'm not going crazy about them offering Grandsatff.. Don't get me wrong I'd take him in a second but he's an obvious choice, why aren't kids like Ristic visiting G'town or on the staff's radar? Arizona practically brought him over to the States so they could sign him...
|
|
EtomicB
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 14,934
|
Post by EtomicB on Feb 28, 2014 18:50:17 GMT -5
zagsblog.com/articles/7-footer-nba-prospect-ristic-is-arizonas-to-lose/“He’s a legit 7-footer with a great frame and really long arms,” Jonathan Givony of DraftExpress.com told SNY.tv.
“He’s as skilled a big man as you’ll find. He can score with either hand in the post, is an excellent passer, and can step outside and shoot from the perimeter as well. He’s consistently been considered one of the top prospects in the 1995 international class, which is one of the most talented we’ve seen in quite some time. He’s been really well-coached and should be able to contribute significantly from day one. He needs to continue to fill out his frame and improve his ability to deal with contact and physical play as he makes the jump to competing against higher level competition, but he’s a definite NBA prospect long-term.”Why isn't the staff flipping boulders like 'Zona is? Not trying to be an @ss but any program can recruit top 50 kids, that's why I'm not going crazy about them offering Grandsatff.. Don't get me wrong I'd take him in a second but he's an obvious choice, why aren't kids like Ristic visiting G'town or on the staff's radar? Arizona practically brought him over to the States so they could sign him... No doubt Yaboy and I understand that the recruiting budget is huge @ Arizona.. It's just that G'town needs a big as much or more than they do and they're being mentioned with multiple 2014 kids while we're hearing crickets on G'towns side..
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 28, 2014 19:06:45 GMT -5
Jabril and Tre are alternatives as PGs next year (and are going to do a better job playing PG next year than the current crew of centers is going to do playing center next year), and we can break the press with a team approach using Peak/White/Copeland, similar to what we did with Otto and w/ Monroe. Not to mention that we don't have to run our offense through our PG--we can run it through a wing like we did with Otto (and technically through a big, but hey, let's not do that next year). And the reason a big is the most important add for next year is that bigs (1) tend to develop more slowly; and (2) are more likely to get in foul trouble (especially the group of bigs, including Smith, that we currently have). Consequently, if we only had one schollie, I'd rather see it used on a big next year than a PG, especially b/c it means we'll have a sophomore center in 2015 rather than a freshman for the year we are most likely going to be in the best position to make a run at a national title (I mean, if we get Ivan Rabb in 2015, sure, we don't need a center as much in 2014, but is that something we want to count on?). Hayes is our only big guy on the roster in 2015, and that's the kind of hole that prevents a roster that's stacked at every other position from being a great team. Yeah, this. I would love to get both, but I think C is a much more pressing need. Two years ago Jason Clark started at PG and played half of the PG minutes and we were a #3 seed. I don't think it's ideal, but playing a combo at PG in our offense is fine. Idk what that proves considering A year ago we were at 2 seed with the same centers that are on the team now..
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 28, 2014 19:09:04 GMT -5
Arizona practically brought him over to the States so they could sign him... No doubt Yaboy and I understand that the recruiting budget is huge @ Arizona.. It's just that G'town needs a big as much or more than they do and they're being mentioned with multiple 2014 kids while we're hearing crickets on G'towns side.. Az is greedy as hell, they don’t need any more bigs. They need to learn how to share..smh
|
|
idhoya
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,177
|
Post by idhoya on Feb 28, 2014 20:26:48 GMT -5
they consistently recruit over their 3s, 4s, and 5s.
|
|
hoyarooter
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 10,216
|
Post by hoyarooter on Feb 28, 2014 21:01:21 GMT -5
I totally agree that we need a center, but one of the problems this season is that our forwards haven't been good, either (I don't include Jabril, who isn't a forward). That makes the hole in the middle look even worse. We seem to have taken a major step toward correcting the problem at forward, what with White, Copeland, Peak and Derrickson. Hopefully next year, with the first three on board, we'll be much better at the 3/4 than we are now. And that may make it easier for whomever is playing the 5, whether it's Josh (doubtful), Hopkins or Hayes, to function at a decent level. At least that's my hope. So I'd rather not sign a 5 who is yet another project and doesn't play. DLR may not be that guy - I don't know - but it's not clear that we'll get him, anyway. What I know for certain is that we absolutely need a really good 5 from the 2015 class.
As for our 1 situation, I think Tre gets thrown into the deep end, so hopefully he'll be able to swim. DSR can't play 35 minutes at the point and have the team be successful.
|
|
SFHoya99
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 17,772
Member is Online
|
Post by SFHoya99 on Feb 28, 2014 21:41:00 GMT -5
Yaboy, I don't understand your argument on DSR. Our offense is such that our point doesn't have to control the ball -- he judt has to guard points.
Moving DSR to guard the 1 allows more time for Peak, White and Copeland. I don't think thats s bad thing.
If we were to find a fifth year transfer or if Campbell was really thst amazing, sure. But otherwise, I want my best players on the floor.
|
|
|
Post by HoyasAreHungry on Feb 28, 2014 23:48:13 GMT -5
The point is, and I'm in agreement with Yaboy, having DSR as the primary ball handler is not good for him or the team. Now before everyone says "we don't have a true point" I agree however if he's the only one who's our single man press break, which happens more than we realize at times with Starks....we're in trouble. It's not only going to tire him out, but honestly he's not that great of a ball handler. His fitness has improved dramatically this year, but having him in that role is a mistake. He needs to be doing what he does best which is score the ball. The second point about everyone clamoring for a big is all well and good. We definitely could use one, but where are we going to find an impact player (which is what we need not a project bench player) or serviceable player in a freshman class? We won't. Our only hope is transfer or a de commit. Let's be a little realistic her. Reaching on a big just because there's a need doesn't help anything.
|
|
EtomicB
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 14,934
|
Post by EtomicB on Mar 1, 2014 1:12:43 GMT -5
The point is, and I'm in agreement with Yaboy, having DSR as the primary ball handler is not good for him or the team. Now before everyone says "we don't have a true point" I agree however if he's the only one who's our single man press break, which happens more than we realize at times with Starks....we're in trouble. It's not only going to tire him out, but honestly he's not that great of a ball handler. His fitness has improved dramatically this year, but having him in that role is a mistake. He needs to be doing what he does best which is score the ball. The second point about everyone clamoring for a big is all well and good. We definitely could use one, but where are we going to find an impact player (which is what we need not a project bench player) or serviceable player in a freshman class? We won't. Our only hope is transfer or a de commit. Let's be a little realistic her. Reaching on a big just because there's a need doesn't help anything. I don't buy this at all Hungry.. G'town was just whooped by Davante Gardner, who coming out of HS he had a 2.7 composite rating from the big 3.. Was he a reach or did Buzz do his homework and knew he found an undervalued talent? Stainbrook from Xavier is similar, so is Teague from Seton Hall or the Hamilton kid from Depaul.. G'town's bigs haven't worked out lately because they're not equipped to play in JT3's system, not to be a broken record but the staff needs to recruit to the system without fail.. Imo there are skilled bigs available for 2014 who may fit well in this system..
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 1, 2014 3:48:03 GMT -5
Yaboy, I don't understand your argument on DSR. Our offense is such that our point doesn't have to control the ball -- he judt has to guard points. Moving DSR to guard the 1 allows more time for Peak, White and Copeland. I don't think thats s bad thing. If we were to find a fifth year transfer or if Campbell was really thst amazing, sure. But otherwise, I want my best players on the floor. Basically what H.A.H said. We’re going to ask DSR to break the press, control tempo, get us into sets, and be the Primary ballhandler and scorer on offense, so he’s doing it against the other teams best defender. Then when the shot clock runs down you’re asking him to break down the offense and create for others. It’s a lot to ask of a guy being put in a new role that he’s never played before. If I’m an opposing coach I’m already seeing his handle is not a PG handle, so I’m pressuring him as soon as he’s in the gym. If I’m not getting To’s at least I’m forcing him to start his work 94 feet from the basket every play. Yes our offense can be ran without a true PG but it still needs a facilitator. Clark had Sims. Dsr won’t have anyone so he will have to play a more traditional role in that he will have to be the primary facilitator also. When he drives I’m pinching hard trying to force the ball out of his hands. On the perimeter the only guy I’m worried about other than him is Reggie Cam, so I can clog the paint and either force him to finish over bigger guys, or drive and kick to an average at best shooter. I’m telling my guys get into him and make him work, they're going to do that anyway but it’s different when you have to have the ball in your hands the majority of the time. It’s too easy to defend If I’m 3 I’m trying to figure out anyway to lessen his load and get him off the ball doing what he does best, Finishing plays. I need to be able to play him like a 20-15 split pG to SG to keep him fresh for a whole season otherwise he’s going to wear down. It’s not just physical but the mental aspect of running a team that will contribute. If nothing happens Imo our best chance is Josh comes back motivated realizing this is his last chance. He still is probably the best big available to us. If he can give us a little more than this year and get in better shape we have potential to be good. I would also look at playing PW at the point on offense and having him guard the 3 on D. He can see over the top and he has a pretty good handle. It allows DSR to relax and focus on what he does best, scoring the ball. You add a relatively versatile defender to the lineup in White. He ran the point against Curie (fwiw) for a period and looked comfortable initiating plays, and he is a good passer. Play him in a Kyle Anderson type of role he, doesn’t have to dribble through the press because he can pass over top. You probably take your lumps early but by seasons end maybe you have something. It definitely will cause opposing coaches to have to think about how to defend us if he is capable of handling the role.
|
|
|
Post by HoyasAreHungry on Mar 1, 2014 8:55:54 GMT -5
The point is, and I'm in agreement with Yaboy, having DSR as the primary ball handler is not good for him or the team. Now before everyone says "we don't have a true point" I agree however if he's the only one who's our single man press break, which happens more than we realize at times with Starks....we're in trouble. It's not only going to tire him out, but honestly he's not that great of a ball handler. His fitness has improved dramatically this year, but having him in that role is a mistake. He needs to be doing what he does best which is score the ball. The second point about everyone clamoring for a big is all well and good. We definitely could use one, but where are we going to find an impact player (which is what we need not a project bench player) or serviceable player in a freshman class? We won't. Our only hope is transfer or a de commit. Let's be a little realistic her. Reaching on a big just because there's a need doesn't help anything. I don't buy this at all Hungry.. G'town was just whooped by Davante Gardner, who coming out of HS he had a 2.7 composite rating from the big 3.. Was he a reach or did Buzz do his homework and knew he found an undervalued talent? Stainbrook from Xavier is similar, so is Teague from Seton Hall or the Hamilton kid from Depaul.. G'town's bigs haven't worked out lately because they're not equipped to play in JT3's system, not to be a broken record but the staff needs to recruit to the system without fail.. Imo there are skilled bigs available for 2014 who may fit well in this system.. Your point is fair about the guys you mentioned but how many of those started or played impact minutes as a freshman? Hamilton this year? (Didn't look it up so I'll retract if that's incorrect...I know stainbrook transferred and lost 40lbs before he was effective) Hamilton was highly touted early on but struggled with conditioning. He was definitely underrated coming out of hs pretty sure DePaul considered him a coup to pick up. That's my only point. Finding a, from day 1 ready, big is going to be tough to find. Not saying they don't exist but in the whole not many just fall through the cracks if they can ball. Hell even the 4 star bigs aren't ready to go right away. Still think our best bet is a graduated senior transfer or de commit. But realistically our most important recruit and it pains me to say it is Josh Smith if motivated.
|
|
|
Post by matersammich on Mar 1, 2014 10:44:56 GMT -5
It may not be best for the team, but it's best for DSR to play point. If he wants to have any shot at making the league, he needs to play with the ball in his hands and show that he can do something else at an elite level other than score. If we do right by him, we should at least give him the shot to play some point. If not point, he should at least get a lot of run being a distributor and running the offense. Joe Forte (Dematha/UNC) jumped to the NBA as an undersized SG without developing as a distributor and the NBA chewed him up and spit him out. I think he's playing in Iran right now. That case stands out to me because I was at UNC during the Guthridge/Doherty era and it was painfully obvious to most of us that while Forte was a GREAT college player he was not near ready for the NBA.
|
|
|
Post by johnnysnowplow on Mar 1, 2014 12:17:25 GMT -5
Just out of curiosity, how come Peak gets absolutely no mention as another ball handler? Is his handle that poor? Because you would think a guard who is used to having the ball in his hands ALL THE TIME in HS would certainly be comfortable having it in his hands at the next level. Not that he's going to run the point or facilitate offense, but as far as helping with press break, etc. when he's on the floor
We've been wildly successful in the past without having a true PG and by running the offense through a big or multiple bigs. No we're not going to have the one man press break in Markel anymore, but assuming that Thompson is going to ask DSR to just dribble through the press seems misguided. We've spent many season seasons using a much more passing-based strategy against the press (sometimes ineffectively, I'll admit that) and we certainly have enough guys next year that can handle and pass it well enough to break a press effectively. DSR will get plenty of opportunities to play off the ball, and I don't necessarily think he needs to be primary facilitator all the time as Starks has been. Assuming PW is as good as he seems, I agree that we could/should see a lot of offense run through him.
I guess what I'm getting at is that I expect the offense to look wildly different next year than it does this year. A transfer or de-commit that could contribute right away would be tremendous, but I think we can work with what we have in the backcourt. The prospect of a frontcourt of Hop, Moses, Hayes is utterly terrifying. At this point I'm ready to give his scholarship to a '14 big who has at least demonstrated that he has some idea of how this game is played. How can anyone we bring in possibly be worse than Moses?
|
|