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Post by strummer8526 on Jun 5, 2015 12:57:10 GMT -5
Cool sarcasm. I love a good fakeout. For a second, you had me thinking maybe I do know him, and then BAM, you pointed out that I don't. Good stuff. How do you know "he flew home before the semester to work hard on his conditioning before pre-draft workouts"? In any event, the fact that III barely mentioned him at the banquet says a lot to me. III has stood by every player who has come and gone from the program. A terse "We wish him the best" suggests to me that Smith left on less-than-favorable terms. And I think that's lousy after the opportunities Georgetown gave him. Maybe he'll come back and graduate. Maybe he'll be one of those alums who stays close to the program. If so, then I'll change my opinion based on the facts known at the time. Until then, I know he wasn't willing to stick around for a month and a half to get a diploma that a lot of kids around the country would kill for. I know that because I cared enough to find it out before jumping to conclusion....I apologize if it wasn't common knowledge to you and therefore left holes in your argument. The fact that III barely mentioned him is because he wasn't available to attend, and why draw attention to someone who is absent when the focus of the banquet was to celebrate the accomplishments of the graduating seniors. How would that make sense? It was neither the time nor the place, nor are Josh's personal plans obligated to be communicated to the public. I just don't understand how you think ou can speak to the nature of III and Josh's relationship without knowing them, much less not having known that Josh wasn't at the banquet because he wasn't in DC and has deferred the completion of his degree to a future date. Nobody is saying he wasn't given chances, but you act as if you're in his head and know just how much he appreciates the opportunities he's been given in life. Newsflash, you don't. He's barely 22 you act as if you were perfect or had your whole life figured out at that age. Excuse me if I don't hastily jump to conclusions about the future of one of our former players' life plans, especially when I'm not one of his parents or a part on his conscience. Like I said, his window to play professionally is quickly closing, and GU is going nowhere. I'd bet a similar, if not larger, number of kids around the country would kill for the opportunity to play professional sports (I.e. follow their passions so that they can do what most makes them happy). Imposing your own value system on Josh, based off of little to no evidence of what his future plans may be, is kinda unfair imo Let's take these in order: First, with one possible exception, I didn't jump to any conclusions. I don't think we're even disagreeing about any of the facts here. I just think that, based on his conduct, you can infer that the guy does not value a Georgetown degree as much as I think our players should (and as much as our program wants them to, given our "deflated ball" philosophy). Maybe he really does appreciate the importance of a diploma from an elite university, but if that's the case, he has a funny way of showing it. Remember, he was two months--not two years--away from graduating. The one thing I said that may have been too much was that I won't be happy if he dupes another coach into thinking he's changed. For all I know, he didn't dupe III and/or he really has changed his work ethic in a meaningful way. On those points, perhaps I'm wrong. But again, there's reason to think that: (1) III expected Smith to graduate, and (2) Smith still cannot dedicate himself to certain commitments, like finishing school. If III was fully supportive of Smith's decision, it would have made perfect sense, and would have been the perfect time and place, for him to have said so. As you state, they were celebrating the seniors. Even if Smith wasn't in attendance, III could have said something to celebrate the decision to go home and prepare for NBA camps. He obviously did not do that. Again, you don't need to be one of his parents or a part of his conscience to know his life plans. What he chose to do is perfectly clear. I, and others, just don't agree with it. At the end of the day, I don't think we're going to agree on any this, which is fine. I'm happy to leave it at that.
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Post by professorhoya on Jun 5, 2015 13:32:27 GMT -5
I gotta go with Rock here. He looked in better shape his junior than he did at UCLA, and he looked better his senior year compared to his junior year. I don't know where this "he put on weight during the year" nonsense is coming from. He definitely didn't look to have gained weight during the season. What was the risk in bringing the kid in? Honest question - what was JT3 and GU risking? He certainly helped on the court. We won a NCAA tourney game for the only the second time in the past 6-7 years. People act like he was some cancer that destroyed the program. In my opinion, reputational risk - I agree that he didn't destroy the program and I obviously did not frame it as a zero sum game but the kid did embarrass the program months after joining it by failing to meet his academic obligations and left school as soon as the season ended which, I'd venture, isn't appreciated especially at a program and university like Georgetown. I'm not going to debate lbs with you since neither of us know definitively, but it was simply an observation that I noted (even before posters brought it up here) as the season progressed. Yeah but nobody says that Greg Whittington embarrassed the program and Greg did it twice to the Hoyas. Most of the comments on Greg are of the nature of I hope he gets his head on straight and can make the NBA. There just seems to be alot more vitriol to Josh Smith than Whit even though Josh Smith contributed more to the program and did less damage. I realize that Josh comes across as an articulate nice guy, kind of a jolly fat guy, so is an easier target to get picked on. If Josh had a thug type aggressive bad boy attitude then maybe the abuse wouldn't happen and we'd all be saying how he has to get paid and good for him.
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Post by strummer8526 on Jun 5, 2015 15:57:43 GMT -5
In my opinion, reputational risk - I agree that he didn't destroy the program and I obviously did not frame it as a zero sum game but the kid did embarrass the program months after joining it by failing to meet his academic obligations and left school as soon as the season ended which, I'd venture, isn't appreciated especially at a program and university like Georgetown. I'm not going to debate lbs with you since neither of us know definitively, but it was simply an observation that I noted (even before posters brought it up here) as the season progressed. Yeah but nobody says that Greg Whittington embarrassed the program and Greg did it twice to the Hoyas. Most of the comments on Greg are of the nature of I hope he gets his head on straight and can make the NBA. There just seems to be alot more vitriol to Josh Smith than Whit even though Josh Smith contributed more to the program and did less damage. I realize that Josh comes across as an articulate nice guy, kind of a jolly fat guy, so is an easier target to get picked on. If Josh had a thug type aggressive bad boy attitude then maybe the abuse wouldn't happen and we'd all be saying how he has to get paid and good for him. I think there was plenty of Whitt-bashing back when he was around and relevant. Personally, I just don't even think about him anymore. Smith is fresh on all our minds. And it has nothing to do with personality. I think both of them seem like nice guys. In the grand scheme of things, sure, I hope they both have fine, successful lives. I just wouldn't get the same joy out of it as I would if/when guys like Wright, Markel, Jabril, Mikael, Adams, Otto, Jeff, Roy, etc. achieve great things.
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CTHoya08
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Bring back Izzo!
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Post by CTHoya08 on Jun 6, 2015 8:31:54 GMT -5
In my opinion, reputational risk - I agree that he didn't destroy the program and I obviously did not frame it as a zero sum game but the kid did embarrass the program months after joining it by failing to meet his academic obligations and left school as soon as the season ended which, I'd venture, isn't appreciated especially at a program and university like Georgetown. I'm not going to debate lbs with you since neither of us know definitively, but it was simply an observation that I noted (even before posters brought it up here) as the season progressed. Yeah but nobody says that Greg Whittington embarrassed the program and Greg did it twice to the Hoyas. Most of the comments on Greg are of the nature of I hope he gets his head on straight and can make the NBA. There just seems to be alot more vitriol to Josh Smith than Whit even though Josh Smith contributed more to the program and did less damage. I realize that Josh comes across as an articulate nice guy, kind of a jolly fat guy, so is an easier target to get picked on. If Josh had a thug type aggressive bad boy attitude then maybe the abuse wouldn't happen and we'd all be saying how he has to get paid and good for him. I think a lot of people would say that. We just haven't had much reason to discuss the kid in years.
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Post by professorhoya on Jun 6, 2015 11:44:40 GMT -5
Yeah but nobody says that Greg Whittington embarrassed the program and Greg did it twice to the Hoyas. Most of the comments on Greg are of the nature of I hope he gets his head on straight and can make the NBA. There just seems to be alot more vitriol to Josh Smith than Whit even though Josh Smith contributed more to the program and did less damage. I realize that Josh comes across as an articulate nice guy, kind of a jolly fat guy, so is an easier target to get picked on. If Josh had a thug type aggressive bad boy attitude then maybe the abuse wouldn't happen and we'd all be saying how he has to get paid and good for him. I think a lot of people would say that. We just haven't had much reason to discuss the kid in years. Posters were just talking about Whit a couple days ago as he has a try out with the 76ers.
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lichoya68
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
OK YOUNGINS ARE HERE AND ARE VERY VERY GOOD cant wait GO HOYAS
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Post by lichoya68 on Jun 7, 2015 12:53:46 GMT -5
Wish josh had graduated Wish greg had taken advantage of his opportunity NUF said feel bad for them both but good luck to them.
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calhoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by calhoya on Jun 8, 2015 8:19:59 GMT -5
Not really a fan of either team but watching the NBA finals is excruciatingly painful. Why bother having rules or officials if they will never be enforced down the stretch?
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hoyainspirit
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
When life puts that voodoo on me, music is my gris-gris.
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Post by hoyainspirit on Jun 8, 2015 8:49:24 GMT -5
Not really a fan of either team but watching the NBA finals is excruciatingly painful. Why bother having rules or officials if they will never be enforced down the stretch? That third quarter was really tough to watch as well.
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kchoya
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Enter your message here...
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Post by kchoya on Jun 8, 2015 11:38:33 GMT -5
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Post by rockcityhoya on Jun 8, 2015 15:14:15 GMT -5
Greg Whittington folks. /photo/1
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Post by rockcityhoya on Jun 8, 2015 15:18:25 GMT -5
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DanMcQ
Moderator
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Post by DanMcQ on Jun 9, 2015 12:37:07 GMT -5
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calhoya
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Post by calhoya on Jun 9, 2015 14:20:45 GMT -5
Given the number of games these officials work each year, it seems ridiculous for the league to act as if these non-calls were mistakes. The NBA's professional officials "consistently" miss travels and "touch" fouls, even of the variety that would warrant a call at any other level of basketball. Such routine mistakes at the end of games would be eliminated if the League wanted to enforce the rules on the books.
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Nevada Hoya
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Post by Nevada Hoya on Jun 9, 2015 17:20:11 GMT -5
I think they rely on make up calls. They called Mozgov for steps, when he did not walk, but made up by letting an obvious scamper off the hook.
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rockhoya
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NBA Hoyas
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Post by rockhoya on Jun 12, 2015 14:35:31 GMT -5
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lichoya68
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
OK YOUNGINS ARE HERE AND ARE VERY VERY GOOD cant wait GO HOYAS
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Post by lichoya68 on Jun 14, 2015 20:34:06 GMT -5
Any word on our free agents hoyas ROY JEFF GREG HENRY and maybe holis too just wondering .
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emkmd
Century (over 100 posts)
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Post by emkmd on Jun 15, 2015 16:00:35 GMT -5
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lichoya68
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
OK YOUNGINS ARE HERE AND ARE VERY VERY GOOD cant wait GO HOYAS
Posts: 17,440
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Post by lichoya68 on Jun 16, 2015 8:47:54 GMT -5
any word on them and WHAT CLIPPERS FAN TALKES about josh's " TENACIOUS REBOUNDING" hmmmmmmmmmm just saying
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Post by BubbleVisionBiff on Jun 18, 2015 12:01:56 GMT -5
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Post by HometownHoya on Jun 18, 2015 12:56:55 GMT -5
Good on Jeff. Not sure what is going on with the Grizz during the off-season but that seems like a well built team right now.
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