MassHoya
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Post by MassHoya on Jan 28, 2012 14:56:24 GMT -5
Someone will probably correct me on this, but didn't the Forty Niners have both Montana and Young for several years, with Young being the heir apparent?
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Jan 28, 2012 14:59:51 GMT -5
Someone will probably correct me on this, but didn't the Forty Niners have both Montana and Young for several years, with Young being the heir apparent? Yes, they did. And this was after Young had already been a starter for two years, then spent 4+ on the bench.
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hifigator
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Post by hifigator on Jan 31, 2012 12:09:47 GMT -5
It's somewhat ironic that at the very same time that so many people seem focused on the potential of this or that player to be "the guy" who can step in an play QB in the NFL right out of the gate, the same thing is true that has been true all along, and that is that at QB, far more than any other position, there is a clear learning curve and that virtually without exception, it simply takes time. The old adage that the "speed of the game" is so much greater than college is, and likely will always be true. And when the players under center pick their game up to another level, it starts when the game "slows down for them." Yes, guys like Ryan, Flacco and Dalton have done surprisingly well in their rookie seasons. But the truly elite guys are all guys that spent several years learning the NFL game. Even the Mannings, who both started as rookies, weren't remotely close to the players they are now. Drew Brees wasn't the superstar for a couple of years. Rodgers mired on the bench behind Favre for a couple of years. And even the aged veteran Brady, spent his couple of seasons with a clipboard watching Drew Bledsoe. And if you want to take it farther, you can look at guys like Alex Smith. He was being called the biggest bust that wasn't named Leaf for several seasons. Literally no one would have predicted that he would even be in the league 7 years later, much less leading a team into the NFC championship game.
Still, all the buzz is about Luck and now to a lesser degree, RGIII.
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hoyarooter
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Post by hoyarooter on Jan 31, 2012 13:35:22 GMT -5
I agree with you, hifi, but I think memories are short. People see the success that Cam Newton (and Dalton) had this year, and figure why not Luck and Griffin?
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hifigator
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Post by hifigator on Jan 31, 2012 15:07:00 GMT -5
To simplify and take the issue a bit farther at the same time, I think the QB position comes down, at least primarily, to three things: making the read, making the throw and making the play. The physical ability to make the throw is undoubtedly the easiest to measure, and perhaps, the most overrated. I don't want to say overvalued, because the ability to make the difficult throws is certainly something that separates the men from the boys, so to speak.
But the other two primary qualities are at least equally important. Yet many teams seem to feel confident that they can teach -- or at least that the player can learn -- the read. I'm not so sure that's the case. There seems t be an assumption that you can't teach the throw at this level. Either the guy has the arm or he doesn't. But for some reason, there is more confidence in the ability to develop the read. In any case, I think that the valuation of the first two skills is inconsistent. As for my third quality, when I say "make the play," basically I mean the physical and mental ability to ad lib -- to make something happen when something went wrong.
And in my opinion, maybe this is the easiest skill to develop. When should the QB give up on the called play? When should he try to make something out of nothing and when should he live to fight another day? These skills are not as innate in my mind, and are therefore, probably the easiest to improve at a later stage.
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MassHoya
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Post by MassHoya on Feb 5, 2012 9:55:47 GMT -5
Should be a great SB today. This should be very close. As a Patriots fan, I am rooting for Brady, Belichick and MHK to pull it out for New England. Very concerned about the Giants pass rush and the Patriots secondary though. I think it will be a 3-4 point game, maybe even OT.
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Elvado
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Post by Elvado on Feb 5, 2012 10:48:31 GMT -5
Last I checked MHK wasn't playing...
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MassHoya
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Post by MassHoya on Feb 5, 2012 11:20:12 GMT -5
No, but she will be present.
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Elvado
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Post by Elvado on Feb 5, 2012 11:48:29 GMT -5
And she would trump Wellington Mara how exactly? Let's leave the dear departed out of it. Players will decide this game.
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TBird41
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Post by TBird41 on Feb 5, 2012 12:38:59 GMT -5
And she would trump Wellington Mara how exactly? Let's leave the dear departed out of it. Players will decide this game. I don't know--I'd rather watch a ghost fight than this Super Bowl ;D
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MassHoya
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Post by MassHoya on Feb 5, 2012 14:09:13 GMT -5
There is no doubt Mara's death in 2005 was an inspiration to the Giants back then. Myra Kraft's passing in July has been an ongoing story for the Patriots this season. They have worn the MHK patch on their uniforms all year. The players presented the Kraft family with a painting before the Miami game. The players have repeatedly pointed to her memory as a source of inspiration for them.
I agree that that players make plays, but motivated players tend to make more.
Enjoy the game. Oh, yeah...Go Patriots!!!
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Elvado
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Post by Elvado on Feb 5, 2012 14:22:14 GMT -5
If they need her, they've already lost.
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DFW HOYA
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Post by DFW HOYA on Feb 5, 2012 18:45:18 GMT -5
2-0.
Somewhere, a sports book (or ten) in Las Vegas is saying, "they scored WHAT?"
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Elvado
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Post by Elvado on Feb 5, 2012 21:56:21 GMT -5
MHK. NFW. NYG. XLVI
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richfame
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Post by richfame on Feb 5, 2012 22:27:50 GMT -5
Mvp was a toss up between Eli Manning and Bachagaloop Jones. They always seem to give it to the QB... Always hating on the Linemen.
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hoyainspirit
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Post by hoyainspirit on Feb 5, 2012 23:26:37 GMT -5
Exciting game. I'm happy the Giants won, but they had a ton of bonehead plays - fumbles, wasted TO's, and dumb penalties. Still, enjoyable and entertaining.
Geaux Saints!
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Post by azhoya on Feb 6, 2012 1:31:15 GMT -5
No way, cannot believe I just saw a once in a lifetime game winning drive for the second time in my life. Go Gmen!
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Post by flyoverhoya on Feb 6, 2012 9:27:03 GMT -5
Next year, definitely betting on the NFC 5/6 seed with 9 wins that barely squeaks into the playoffs.
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hoyainspirit
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Post by hoyainspirit on Feb 6, 2012 10:31:32 GMT -5
BTW, how do you cut a guy less than 24 hrs before the Super Bowl?
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Elvado
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Post by Elvado on Feb 6, 2012 10:43:49 GMT -5
No great leap in ethics for Bellicheat. Karma baby. No titles since Spygate.
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