The Stig
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Post by The Stig on Jun 28, 2010 8:56:54 GMT -5
With the news emerging that Bengals' WR Chris Henry had a degenerative brain disease caused by repeated blows to the head at the time of his bizarre death ( sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5333971 ), the dangerous link between football and brain injuries is becoming a lot stronger. How much longer can the sport survive this trend of increasingly severe head injuries? How much longer before a big chunk of parents refuse to let their kids play football because of the risk of debilitating injury? The NFL may be the most popular sport out there right now, but this issue is becoming a real elephant in the room. |
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DFW HOYA
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Post by DFW HOYA on Jun 28, 2010 9:29:45 GMT -5
Sadly, debilitating injuries are not new to football. Georgetown's George Bahen was paralyzed in an 1894 game and died three months later.
The answer, then and now, is two-fold. First, the sport has moved from the days of the leather helmet to leverage better and safer headgear and mut continue to do so. In addition, rules changes that prevent helmet on helmet hits and to sideline players for concussive effects can serve to send a statement that while hard play is part of the game, unsafe play is not tolerated, much as the crackback block has all but been eliminated from football.
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rosslynhoya
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Post by rosslynhoya on Jun 28, 2010 9:34:31 GMT -5
How much longer before a big chunk of parents refuse to let their kids play football because of the risk of debilitating injury? Not sure where you grew up, but a big chunk o' parentry already refuses to let their kids play football because of the risk of injury. It's a major rationale for how soccer got its foot in the door in American youth sports -- they needed a place to put all the delicate flowers who weren't interested in running for the cross-country team. (now that we're knocked out it's safe to be a hater again, right?) |
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Jack
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Post by Jack on Jun 28, 2010 9:53:34 GMT -5
Sadly, debilitating injuries are not new to football. Georgetown's George Bahen was paralyzed in an 1894 game and died three months later. The answer, then and now, is two-fold. First, the sport has moved from the days of the leather helmet to leverage better and safer headgear and mut continue to do so. In addition, rules changes that prevent helmet on helmet hits and to sideline players for concussive effects can serve to send a statement that while hard play is part of the game, unsafe play is not tolerated, much as the crackback block has all but been eliminated from football. And yet there is also persuasive evidence that head injuries are not all the result of big hits and post-concussion damage, but that linemen who are subject to dozens of smaller hits to the head on virtually every play and throughout the practice week are gradually turning their brain to mush, and the younger they start, the worse off they are. Better helmets and changes to the rules aren't much help in those situations. |
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Post by AustinHoya03 on Jun 28, 2010 10:20:11 GMT -5
With the news emerging that Bengals' WR Chris Henry had a degenerative brain disease caused by repeated blows to the head at the time of his bizarre death ( sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5333971 ), the dangerous link between football and brain injuries is becoming a lot stronger. How much longer can the sport survive this trend of increasingly severe head injuries? How much longer before a big chunk of parents refuse to let their kids play football because of the risk of debilitating injury? The NFL may be the most popular sport out there right now, but this issue is becoming a real elephant in the room. Does the fact that a man who played football for decades against fully-grown men developed a brain injury suggest that teenagers flopping around with other teenagers is unsafe? Has concussion/brain injury research primarily been conducted on high school students or NFL players? This is certainly an issue for football going forward, but I don't know if Chris Henry's injury proves high school football is unsafe. ON EDIT: Haven't read about the study Jack mentions. Does anyone have a link? |
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hoyainspirit
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Post by hoyainspirit on Jun 28, 2010 10:44:10 GMT -5
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Jack
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Post by Jack on Jun 28, 2010 10:59:14 GMT -5
ON EDIT: Haven't read about the study Jack mentions. Does anyone have a link? That is my recollection from Malcolm Gladwell's piece in The New Yorker last year: www.newyorker.com/reporting/2009/10/19/091019fa_fact_gladwellThe parts about dogfighting are interesting and a topic for discussion in their own right, but maybe not totally germane to this conversation. |
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ksf42001
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Post by ksf42001 on Jun 28, 2010 11:43:22 GMT -5
With the news emerging that Bengals' WR Chris Henry had a degenerative brain disease caused by repeated blows to the head at the time of his bizarre death ( sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5333971 ), the dangerous link between football and brain injuries is becoming a lot stronger. How much longer can the sport survive this trend of increasingly severe head injuries? How much longer before a big chunk of parents refuse to let their kids play football because of the risk of debilitating injury? The NFL may be the most popular sport out there right now, but this issue is becoming a real elephant in the room. Does the fact that a man who played football for decades against fully-grown men developed a brain injury suggest that teenagers flopping around with other teenagers is unsafe? Has concussion/brain injury research primarily been conducted on high school students or NFL players? This is certainly an issue for football going forward, but I don't know if Chris Henry's injury proves high school football is unsafe. ON EDIT: Haven't read about the study Jack mentions. Does anyone have a link? You can only tell if some is suffering from CTE by dissecting the brain after death, so there's no real research on younger athletes. At the same time though, Henry was a WR. I wouldn't be surprised if he took less direct head contact in his career than the typical lineman does just through college. If it's available online, Real Sports did a great piece on the subject a few years ago, when the NFL was still in full denial mode. They updated in the last year or so as well. |
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hoyarooter
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Post by hoyarooter on Jun 28, 2010 12:09:46 GMT -5
I look for this issue to explode over the next few years.
Slightly off topic, there was an article in today's LA Times about the former dirtiest player in pro football, Conrad Dobler. He's had 10 knee replacements, and has had amputation recommended for one of his legs, but he refuses, because he is the primary care giver for his wife, who is a quadrepligic as a result of a broken neck suffered nine years ago when she fell out of a hammock and landed on her head (talk about your freak injuries). He's tried to walk with a cane, but is unable to do so due to shoulder pain (he also apparently needs a shoulder replacement). And the good old NFL has rejected his claims for football related injuries.
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derhoya
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Post by derhoya on Jun 28, 2010 15:55:20 GMT -5
I read Malcolm Gladwell's article a couple months ago. As a former lineman who played from 4th grade through 4 yrs in college, it certainly scared the be-jesus outta me.
But as mentioned, when does this head to head contact really begin to affect one? Is it slightly after one evolves from chicken arm blocking to leading with your head and hands, or is it only after you've played for many years or are playing against ppl of a certain size? Time will tell, but still scary stuff.
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Post by HoyaSinceBirth on Jun 29, 2010 10:00:28 GMT -5
Clearly football needs to be outlawed at least as a college sport. Too dangerous.
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TC
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Post by TC on Jun 29, 2010 11:40:06 GMT -5
Clearly football needs to be outlawed at least as a college sport. Too dangerous. There has to be a better defense of football than this and Rosslyn's "soccer is for Edited". Why is no one offering it? Hockey is a contact sport. No one gets hurt anywhere near the rate of football injuries, and although you do have tragic accidents like Travis Roy and the kid from Norwood, MA this year, the rates of long-term damage aren't close to football's. I think also the spectator and participation arguments need to be separated. Evel Kneivel is fun to watch, but I don't think anyone is going to argue that his stunts are something that would be beneficial for everyone to try to perform. Not everyone enjoys watching soccer or hockey, but at least they are sports everyone can participate in past high school. |
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Boz
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Post by Boz on Jun 29, 2010 12:02:56 GMT -5
Head injuries in hockey are also on the rise, FWIW.
The nature of hockey and football are far different and that difference plays directly into the frequency of contact to the head.
Head injuries in hockey are particularly gruesome (see Marc Savard, Patrice Bergeron, anyone Colby Armstrong comes near for some reason), but I think they are rare in comparison because you have a small number of players in constant motion. It's really not that easy to go after someone's head in that instance, even if you were trying (and thankfully most players not named Matt Cooke aren't).
Also, when young players are learning hockey, they are taught that the last thing you want to do is aim high. Not necessarily because of the injury potential, though it may be a factor, but more because you're more likely than not to miss if you aim high. Hockey players are taught to go for center mass because, when traveling at speed, it's the best way to ensure you'll land your hit and won't get deked.
When shots to the head DO occur in hockey, it is almost always illegal. Almost.
Contrast that with football, wherein a large number of the players begin the play with their heads mere inches from each other and at the snap of the ball accelerate immediately into their opponent. Head contact is going to happen on almost every play.
Football also by its nature places players in very vulnerable positions where it is more difficult to protect against your head snapping or slamming into the ground, if not into another player. QB's blind sides, WRs going across the middle, Ray Lewis being within 15 yards of you, etc.
I don't know what the answers are. I do think better equipment can help, but it won't eliminate the problem. I think the nature of football is always going to lend itself to a high degree of head trauma over the course of years. It may not be one hit like Patrice Bergeron received. It may be 100 smaller hits that repeatedly bruise and damage the brain and cranium. I don't know really if there's anything that will prevent it as long as it remains the sport that it is.
EDIT: You also have players -- in all sports -- continuing to get bigger, stronger and faster than they have ever been before.
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RBHoya
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Post by RBHoya on Jun 29, 2010 12:09:29 GMT -5
. In addition, rules changes that prevent helmet on helmet hits and to sideline players for concussive effects can serve to send a statement that while hard play is part of the game, unsafe play is not tolerated, much as the crackback block has all but been eliminated from football. This is valuable in games, but doesn't help for practices where a lot of the collisions take place. I remember in high school we used to run the meat grinder and EVERYBODY tried to lead with their head, because that's what looked the best and made that "crack" sound that everybody pops for. I'd think that hits like that are probably what does the most damage, and while they may penalize you for it in games, it's still going to happen in practices at all levels (I think we actually used to try to lead with our heads in pop warner too  ) and most football coaches are going to continue to permit it or even encourage it. There'll need to be some changes to the "macho" culture, I think. The same happened early last decade when a few guys at various levels died from heat stroke. Prior to that a lot of coaches would push hard as hell, and water was "for sissies", but after Korey Stringer and a few other high school and college players died, coaches sort of came around on that. Hopefully as more comes to light with regard to head injury you'll see more coaches at all levels wise up to that too. |
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Post by HoyaSinceBirth on Jun 29, 2010 13:03:58 GMT -5
Clearly football needs to be outlawed at least as a college sport. Too dangerous. There has to be a better defense of football than this and Rosslyn's "soccer is for Edited". Why is no one offering it? Hockey is a contact sport. No one gets hurt anywhere near the rate of football injuries, and although you do have tragic accidents like Travis Roy and the kid from Norwood, MA this year, the rates of long-term damage aren't close to football's. I think also the spectator and participation arguments need to be separated. Evel Kneivel is fun to watch, but I don't think anyone is going to argue that his stunts are something that would be beneficial for everyone to try to perform. Not everyone enjoys watching soccer or hockey, but at least they are sports everyone can participate in past high school. oh i wasn't trying to defend football. I hate football and would love nothing more if it were banned. Especially for College since then all these conference realignment problems go away then. |
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CAHoya07
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Post by CAHoya07 on Jun 29, 2010 13:37:46 GMT -5
This is a legitimate issue, and if I were a parent I would definitely give it some thought before letting my child go out for football.
As someone who did cross country and track in high school and wishes he had gotten more into soccer growing up, I say this in defense: at least less of our people after they leave the sport end up getting really fat. ;D
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hifigator
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Post by hifigator on Jun 30, 2010 12:16:33 GMT -5
I understand your points, but is the sport getting significantly more dangerous or are we simply more aware of injuries? I don't know.
As for parents not letting their kids play, I think that has some merit. The difference between a potential knee injury and a potential brain injury could be viewed drastically differntly by a lot of parents.
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hoyarooter
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Post by hoyarooter on Jun 30, 2010 19:59:54 GMT -5
I understand your points, but is the sport getting significantly more dangerous or are we simply more aware of injuries? I don't know. As for parents not letting their kids play, I think that has some merit. The difference between a potential knee injury and a potential brain injury could be viewed drastically differntly by a lot of parents. Off point, this reminds me of a funny story. My wife is a neurologist. Back when Magic was still playing, he was injured in a collision, and suffered a concussion. An announcer (don't think it was Chick - I think it was a nationally televised game) made some comment about how fortunate it was that Magic only had a concussion, and hadn't blown out his knee. My wife went completely bonkers over that comment. I tried to explain to her that a blown out knee could cost Magic an entire season, whereas with a concussion he would likely return in a few days, but she wouldn't hear any of it, saying something like any brain injury is worse than the worst knee injury. |
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hifigator
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Post by hifigator on Jul 1, 2010 15:15:00 GMT -5
Well, listen to her, I guess. She is the neurologist.
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The Stig
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Post by The Stig on Sept 14, 2010 16:44:42 GMT -5
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) and most football coaches are going to continue to permit it or even encourage it. There'll need to be some changes to the "macho" culture, I think. The same happened early last decade when a few guys at various levels died from heat stroke. Prior to that a lot of coaches would push hard as hell, and water was "for sissies", but after Korey Stringer and a few other high school and college players died, coaches sort of came around on that. Hopefully as more comes to light with regard to head injury you'll see more coaches at all levels wise up to that too. 