the_way
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
The Illest
Posts: 5,422
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Post by the_way on Apr 6, 2009 12:23:53 GMT -5
It has become increasingly clear to me that from a comparative standpoint, the raw strength of our guys did not measure up with the Pittsburghs, Connecticuts, and Marquettes of the world. Size is great, but a guy like Wesley Matthews was able to terrorize people on the boards because he got to the point where he was benching 300 pounds in the weight room. I'd be amazed if anybody on last year's roster could do anything close to that. Here's hoping everybody--not just Monroe and Sims--are hitting the weight room hard this offseason. Will hitting the weights affect their ability to run the princeton though? Don't want to get too muscle bound...or they will lose their range of motion and won't be able to make their cuts like they did this year. ;D
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Post by harwoodhoya on Apr 6, 2009 12:31:52 GMT -5
REMEMBER ALOT OF THOSE TEAMS LOST ALOT NEXT YEAR. mARQUETTE PITT LOUISVILLE UCONN. wE BRING ALOT BACK COMPARED TO BIG EAST TEAMS. lOOK OUT FOR THE CUSE AND CINNCY. i FEEL IF WE CAN BRING IN 2 MORE GUYS THIS YEAR AND 2 MORE STUDS NEXT YEAR WE'LL BE OK.
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chep3
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,314
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Post by chep3 on Apr 6, 2009 12:47:11 GMT -5
Yeah the BE is going to be markedly different next year. Marquette, Pitt, UConn, and Nova are all ripped by graduation. UConn, L'ville, and possibly Pitt (depending on Blair) might be wracked by early entries as well. Even Providence is losing a bunch. The only tourney teams that are bringing a good number of people back are Cuse and WVU.
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prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 23,373
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Post by prhoya on Apr 6, 2009 12:51:21 GMT -5
Regarding Hollis, given that JT3 is pretty jazzed about how this experiment went with him, is this something that could start happening more and more with our recruits? Or is Hollis more an exception? I ask from a position of ignorance, given that I don't know the requirements of what's needed from the recruits' perspective to enroll early (ie: academic thresholds met). If anyone could explain those further, I'd appreciate it. I think Hollis was more of an exception, or the situation played like the perfect storm to jump. His parents had moved twice in two years before he decided to come for the second semester. Basically, he was joining a new high school and team in the middle of his senior year, he had the credits to graduate after that first semester and made the jump.
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Post by homeonthehilltop on Apr 6, 2009 12:53:17 GMT -5
Let's not sleep on Villanova either. They have eveyone coming back except Cunningham and Anderson (which are significant losses) but they also have the best recruiting class in the Big East. Also, let's not forget that St. John's beat us twice and they have everyone back (plus may add Stephenson...)
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sleepy
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,079
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Post by sleepy on Apr 6, 2009 12:57:56 GMT -5
I don't like this good mood on hoyatalk. It is generally followed by something terrible, such as a St Johns loss, or the early departure of our leading scorer(though that might not be THAT terrible).
The_ways always here to save the day. Yes, it would be much better if we lost our core group rather than return them, because obviously they won't get better and we don't need any continuty. Returning everyone that hasn't already left is what everyone should be hoping for, because it has lacked the past two offseason.
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kellycpcm
Bulldog (over 250 posts)
Posts: 318
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Post by kellycpcm on Apr 6, 2009 13:04:26 GMT -5
I am glad that III was so positive about Henry, because he was really down about collecting splinters this season. One shouldn't count on Latav to make it to the hill-top, he appears to have similar problems to Braswell.
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RDF
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 8,835
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Post by RDF on Apr 6, 2009 13:06:49 GMT -5
Monroe/Sims/Thompson are all YOUNG for their age--so development within a year could be a great leap--they are kids who are all younger then most of the McDonald's All Americans THIS Year.
Look--you can keep looking at negatives if you want--or you can look at the positives. This team wasn't that far off from being a good team--which is showed in certain games, just not enough. All it takes is for 1/2 players to have seperate agendas to ruin a season--and that is not accusing anyone who has departed the program. It's that thin of a line between being a contender/having season fall apart.
Will say that whenever the FR group was in together--the team played it's best basketball on BOTH ends of court. Wright with them too. I think this team WITH Greg and returning group, add a player/2 to mix and it's a contending team. That's just my opinion and would have to be proven on court--but it's not that far off from being a great team. Just depends on what you want to see in terms of positive/negative.
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hoyarooter
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 10,245
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Post by hoyarooter on Apr 6, 2009 13:06:58 GMT -5
REMEMBER ALOT OF THOSE TEAMS LOST ALOT NEXT YEAR. mARQUETTE PITT LOUISVILLE UCONN. wE BRING ALOT BACK COMPARED TO BIG EAST TEAMS. lOOK OUT FOR THE CUSE AND CINNCY. i FEEL IF WE CAN BRING IN 2 MORE GUYS THIS YEAR AND 2 MORE STUDS NEXT YEAR WE'LL BE OK. harwoodhoya, have you decided to start channeling lic? Heaven help us!
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SirSaxa
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 747
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Post by SirSaxa on Apr 6, 2009 13:23:49 GMT -5
Monroe/Sims/Thompson are all YOUNG for their age--so development within a year could be a great leap--they are kids who are all younger then most of the McDonald's All Americans THIS Year. Look--you can keep looking at negatives if you want--or you can look at the positives. This team wasn't that far off from being a good team--which is showed in certain games, just not enough. All it takes is for 1/2 players to have seperate agendas to ruin a season--and that is not accusing anyone who has departed the program. It's that thin of a line between being a contender/having season fall apart. Will say that whenever the FR group was in together--the team played it's best basketball on BOTH ends of court. Wright with them too. I think this team WITH Greg and returning group, add a player/2 to mix and it's a contending team. That's just my opinion and would have to be proven on court--but it's not that far off from being a great team. Just depends on what you want to see in terms of positive/negative. I agree with you RDF. Next year's team has the potential to be VERY good... if they buy into the system and totally commit to it.. on O and D. And maybe JT3 adds a few tweaks, works on the break, emphasized Boards, and... adds another guy or two to the mix. Watching freshman Reggie in the Title game just now on ESPN Classic reminded me of just how amazing he was... on D as well as O. An excellent rebounder despite his thin frame. Incredibly athletic. Still, he was #1 in the country out of HS. Not fair to put those kinds of expectations on Hollis. Maybe I am the only one, but I am also hoping Julian Vaughan can have a big summer too and be more of a factor in his second GU season. Lots has to go right for this team to be really good next year, but the possibilities are all there and I have confidence in JT3 to put it together.
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sleepy
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,079
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Post by sleepy on Apr 6, 2009 13:26:56 GMT -5
Monroe/Sims/Thompson are all YOUNG for their age--so development within a year could be a great leap--they are kids who are all younger then most of the McDonald's All Americans THIS Year. Look--you can keep looking at negatives if you want--or you can look at the positives. This team wasn't that far off from being a good team--which is showed in certain games, just not enough. All it takes is for 1/2 players to have seperate agendas to ruin a season--and that is not accusing anyone who has departed the program. It's that thin of a line between being a contender/having season fall apart. Will say that whenever the FR group was in together--the team played it's best basketball on BOTH ends of court. Wright with them too. I think this team WITH Greg and returning group, add a player/2 to mix and it's a contending team. That's just my opinion and would have to be proven on court--but it's not that far off from being a great team. Just depends on what you want to see in terms of positive/negative. Lots has to go right for this team to be really good next year, but the possibilities are all there and I have confidence in JT3 to put it together. Most important is bringing everyone back next year. Or atleast everyone who is left.
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SaxaCD
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,402
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Post by SaxaCD on Apr 6, 2009 14:18:09 GMT -5
SirSaxa -- and the thing is, I remember thinking how clueless and lost Reggie looked for a good part of that freshman season, especially the first half of the year. You could see flashes, but there were tons of freshman mistakes, until he started putting it all together right at the end of the season and into the post-season. From there, it was up, up and away! Monroe/Sims/Thompson are all YOUNG for their age--so development within a year could be a great leap--they are kids who are all younger then most of the McDonald's All Americans THIS Year. Look--you can keep looking at negatives if you want--or you can look at the positives. This team wasn't that far off from being a good team--which is showed in certain games, just not enough. All it takes is for 1/2 players to have seperate agendas to ruin a season--and that is not accusing anyone who has departed the program. It's that thin of a line between being a contender/having season fall apart. Will say that whenever the FR group was in together--the team played it's best basketball on BOTH ends of court. Wright with them too. I think this team WITH Greg and returning group, add a player/2 to mix and it's a contending team. That's just my opinion and would have to be proven on court--but it's not that far off from being a great team. Just depends on what you want to see in terms of positive/negative. I agree with you RDF. Next year's team has the potential to be VERY good... if they buy into the system and totally commit to it.. on O and D. And maybe JT3 adds a few tweaks, works on the break, emphasized Boards, and... adds another guy or two to the mix. Watching freshman Reggie in the Title game just now on ESPN Classic reminded me of just how amazing he was... on D as well as O. An excellent rebounder despite his thin frame. Incredibly athletic. Still, he was #1 in the country out of HS. Not fair to put those kinds of expectations on Hollis. Maybe I am the only one, but I am also hoping Julian Vaughan can have a big summer too and be more of a factor in his second GU season. Lots has to go right for this team to be really good next year, but the possibilities are all there and I have confidence in JT3 to put it together.
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Post by Hoya TMF on Apr 6, 2009 14:34:57 GMT -5
Let's not sleep on Villanova either. They have eveyone coming back except Cunningham and Anderson (which are significant losses) but they also have the best recruiting class in the Big East. Also, let's not forget that St. John's beat us twice and they have everyone back (plus may add Stephenson...) I assume it will be impossible for anyone to sleep on Nova and Cuse next year. Nova gets King, Yarou and a few other good players. Right now we don't get anyone. Still, I can't imagine the Big East will be as punishing next year as it was this year. Its just nice to hear any positive news about this team.
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Post by FromTheBeginning on Apr 6, 2009 14:37:55 GMT -5
Hollis is the rarity these days - most elite players have spent so much time on the AAU circuit instead of in school, the problem is getting them eligible by the time they finish 4 years, not having to worry about whether they can come in early.
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SirSaxa
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 747
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Post by SirSaxa on Apr 6, 2009 14:43:40 GMT -5
Hollis is the rarity these days - most elite players have spent so much time on the AAU circuit instead of in school, the problem is getting them eligible by the time they finish 4 years, not having to worry about whether they can come in early. LOL! Good point FTB. Hollis was actually able to get in early! wow. Sleepy -- yes indeed! Keep as many as we can to benefit from the learning curve... and just for the sake of keeping some of these darn kids around! We HAVE to change the momentum on the roster turnover issue. And Saxacd... thanks for the reminder. It's easy to forget their early troubles when we remember guys like Reggie. Most of my memories are from their incredibly successful upper classmen years... and Reggie's amazing Freshman finish. You provided a good reality check for us.
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pws
Member
Posts: 67
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Post by pws on Apr 6, 2009 15:12:57 GMT -5
I saw Yarou play for the first time this weekend, and I was not impressed. I understand that this is an n=1 scenario, but he seems like a guy who is very raw, and I would be surprised if he made a major impact next year.
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Post by HeartAttackHoya on Apr 6, 2009 16:52:46 GMT -5
wow..great news if he comes back..spent the weekend in vegas and was wondering why odds on us winning championship remained high in sports room: 30 to 1 (which were better odds than UConn and most Big East Schools)
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Post by bigtymehoya on Apr 6, 2009 18:21:03 GMT -5
I don't understand why any of you believe what JT3 says after this season. He is going to start the group he feels like starting come the start of the season--what he says now matters little. He is probably trying to make sure that Sims, Wright and Freeman don't transfer. Moreover, he probably sounds encouraged by next year because he realizes that he messed up this season by not being tough on some of the players he should have been tough on. Call me crazy, but don't be surprised if we see Wright and Freeman sitting on the bench a lot more next season when they mess up. In my opinion, JT3 wants to keep his job, so he is saying enough to ensure his players come back. After that, they are in for a rude awakening because he is going to put an end to last year's nonsense. I think he let the bad play go on because he was more concerned about this upcoming season and keeping kids from electing to transfer. Now he wants to come out and predict line-ups? Come on...since when
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SFHoya99
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 17,791
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Post by SFHoya99 on Apr 6, 2009 18:25:45 GMT -5
I'd like see a vote between JTIII being too nice and JTIII being too mean. There's a whole cadre of posters who blame III for not imposing martial law, and a whole cadre of posters who blame III for not letting the players play (and driving away players because of it).
I don't say this to say one way is right or wrong. I do highlight this to point out how tough motivation is -- carrot or stick? You want buy in, but you can't run a democracy. It's a very fine line, and anyone who has managed knows that most motivation comes from the employee. You can supplement, but you can't do everything for someone.
Not only do different people often need different styles, but different people need different blends of different styles in different situations.
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Post by bigtymehoya on Apr 6, 2009 18:38:25 GMT -5
Those are great points. I just think that many times this year there were certain players that should not have remained in games longer than they did. In the past, JT3 would bench a player for his continuous mistakes, even if the player coming in wasn't as good. I just think he would have been better served to doing that will all of his players to send a stronger message. Why didn't he do this? I think it may have something to do with the fact that his most important players are sophomores and freshmen--those more at risk of transferring. This is also why I think he is not too bothered by Summers leaving because he would have been a senior any way. I think in this case, Jt3's moves were calculated enough to keep a competitive team for next season. Should he have laid down the hammer on his younger players, I think they would have transferred by now. All in all, I'm saying that next year will likely to be different because i'm sure he already believes that Greg is going to transfer and his Juniors will no longer be a risk to transfer and are essentially locked in for the rest of the ride. It is a calculated risk that I don't agree with, but will probably ensure a competitive team because I think we will see a change in his substitution patterns going back to things we have seen in years past.
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