Buckets
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,656
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Post by Buckets on Feb 8, 2009 20:31:44 GMT -5
Part of Sapp's problem is that he loves TOO much to take the big shot. It might just be perception on my part, but I feel like every time we get on a run, he too often tries to go for the kill and ends up usually taking a bad three that ends up killing our momentum. The Seton Hall debacle was just the latest in what I perceive to be a lengthy resume of trying to make shots that we don't need to take for Sapp.
And gojeff I think we're just going to have to agree to disagree on the quality of Sapp's performance over the previous few games. As far as Sapp being down - surely everyone would be discouraged by the situation he was in sitting on the bench, but would a leader sulk about it or try to show some energy and encourage the guys on the floor in a close game that was very important to the team? He certainly didn't act like a leader in yesterday's game.
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Post by aleutianhoya on Feb 8, 2009 20:49:50 GMT -5
If there isn't more to the situation than just what we've seen on the court, then I think his expression and demeanor was completely understandable. Freemoney, you're right, of course, that a great leader does just what you've described. But it's hard to swallow that role (i.e. the role of "I'm not going to be playing but I'm going to lead from the bench") in the middle of a game. The guy had just had a huge slump and then had what he felt was his "I'm back" game. I would have to think he came into this game ready to contribute and, well, lead. And then, after the first few minutes of the game, he basically sits for the remainder. He took one wild shot as I recall in those first few minutes but certainly wasn't worse than anyone else. So, I think his demeanor is understandable and excusable, given the circumstances. Now, if he's not going to play much the rest of the year and Coach lets him know this, then I would hope he could morph into that "lead from the bench" guy, but to expect that from him in the middle of a game I'm sure he was itching to contribute in is a bit much to ask.
I would assume Coach will play the guys he thinks are best suited to allow this team to win now. I don't think he's mailed in the year or will mail in the year and he won't play the young guys more than he otherwise would just to give them game experience. That's not to say he won't play them more and won't bench Jesse, but if he does, it'll be because he thinks it's best for this year.
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tashoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 12,314
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Post by tashoya on Feb 8, 2009 22:55:44 GMT -5
aleu... what about JT3 that you've seen would make you think anything other than he's fair... maybe he's tough and I think he is. It's part of what I like best about him. It's what I loved most about his dad. His way or the highway. That being said, Jesse playing hard but not getting the results he normally does does not get him benched the way he was and has been.
As for free, if you know for a fact about things, enlighten the group. Jesse isn't getting benched for not scoring or filling up the stat sheet. He's NEVER been that kind of player anyway. If you're so much in the know, I suppose you know why he's being benched. At the least, confirm that it's not because he isn't scoring. He's never been a primary offensive option. I agree that we miss his leadership on the floor and I'm sure it's not JT3's favorite thing to do to bench his lone senior that should be holding the reigns of this young team. He's not holding the reigns and, clearly, Jesse has done something to be benched other than find his way into a slump and seem to start to come out of it prior to Cincy. I love Jesse and would like to see him play. More than that, I trust JT3's decision to sit him. There HAS to be a reason other than poor play as, as bad as Jesse has been at times, there is, as you said, no one on the squad with more heart. As Jesse's heart and desire to win should be unquestioned by all Hoya fans, as should JT3's ability to make reasoned, reliable decisions regarding his personnel.
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DanMcQ
Moderator
Posts: 30,458
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Post by DanMcQ on Feb 8, 2009 23:00:10 GMT -5
MOD NOTE:
Let me remind people that we do not allow "I know player X and he said YZ" posts here. Those qualify as unsubstantiated rumor posts, so further such posts on the reasoning behind Jesse Sapp's playing time should not be made. The people involved (the coaches and players) can make whatever statements they want about it.
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sead43
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 796
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Post by sead43 on Feb 8, 2009 23:18:14 GMT -5
Jon! Fix it! Really, what's he doing right now? We can't bring him and Tyler on as assistant coaches? I know Tyler has been around campus A LOT this year, and I think Jon has been around some too. If you think we on the board are upset, I can't imagine how heartbroken they must be to be witnessing what's happening to their team. (especially considering they probably know whatever it is we don't about what issues, off-the-court or otherwise, are at play lately.)
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Buckets
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,656
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Post by Buckets on Feb 9, 2009 1:09:29 GMT -5
As for free, if you know for a fact about things, enlighten the group. Jesse isn't getting benched for not scoring or filling up the stat sheet. I'm not sure where you got that I was suggesting I was in the know. I was actually deliberating trying in my posts in this thread to stay away from any sort of speculation to imply that. I'm only posting from what I see on game days.
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Post by aleutianhoya on Feb 9, 2009 6:44:36 GMT -5
I never intimated (or, if I did, I didn't mean to) that I believe JTIII is unfair. Quite the contrary, I absolutely give him the benefit of the doubt on personnel and other decisions. Boiled down to its essence, my point was this: Jesse had to have been extremely disappointed Saturday, given his most recent performance previously and his lack of playing time against Cinci. In such a circumstance, it's unrealistic to expect anyone -- let alone a college student -- to immediately take the high road. We can expect that in the future but not immediately.
As for JTIII, it seemed odd to me that Jesse was completely benched. Limiting his limits certainly wouldn't have surprised me, but the obvious benching surprised me. But that's a far cry from my saying that JTIII is unfair. It only means that I didn't quite understand it.
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tashoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 12,314
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Post by tashoya on Feb 9, 2009 11:28:53 GMT -5
free.... sorry. My mistake. I meant gojeff. Apologies.
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DanMcQ
Moderator
Posts: 30,458
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Post by DanMcQ on Feb 11, 2009 7:47:31 GMT -5
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calhoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,351
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Post by calhoya on Feb 11, 2009 8:20:36 GMT -5
Amen
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lichoya68
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
OK YOUNGINS ARE HERE AND ARE VERY VERY GOOD cant wait GO HOYAS
Posts: 17,436
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Post by lichoya68 on Feb 11, 2009 8:52:56 GMT -5
good and accurate artilce by barker says it all i think says it all leadership stepping up go jesse and do dajuan and as austin said composure and as greg said togetherness thats what they need to do to beat cuse thats is and they can start a run if not ... long season GO HOYAS ITS FEBRUARY TIME FOR LEADERSHIP NOW ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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GPHoya
Bulldog (over 250 posts)
Posts: 466
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Post by GPHoya on Feb 11, 2009 10:06:29 GMT -5
The Washington Times prints speculation and rumors without attribution about Jesse and Dajuan and it becomes gospel. The same speculation and rumors are written on the Board and are chastised and threatened with censorship. The distinction between the internets and print so-called journalism remains a mystery to me (not really).
I understand drawing the line when people on this Board speculate or spread rumors on personal matters such as grades or health. When folks are taking about basketball based on what they see on the court and what inferences they draw from it coupled with what little inside information they may possess, I don't get the paranoia that leads to shutting it down or discouraging it.
The reality is that beat reporters like Barker are really house organs for the team who will only print what is going on inside the team when they receive tacit approval to do so from the coach. If they break that rule, they get shut-off from scoops. It has always been thus. By imposing the same rules on the people who make contributions to the Board, we extend the Pravda-like control that the coach has over print media. Since we receive no reciprocal perquisites to peek under the tent, I don't get the bargain.
Offered with great respect for my hard-working friends who moderate the Board. Bottom line, lighten up a little. Your jobs will be easier and the free flow of information (good and bad) will be served.
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lichoya68
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
OK YOUNGINS ARE HERE AND ARE VERY VERY GOOD cant wait GO HOYAS
Posts: 17,436
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Post by lichoya68 on Feb 11, 2009 10:19:00 GMT -5
one thing non rumor and not unsubstantiated austin has said as a quote they need composure thats true and greg has said they lack togetherness thats true unless those two get solved longgggggggg season..and i expect jesse and dajuan need to provide leadership for that as the upperclassman go jesse go dajuan need you to play AND lead too go hoyas composed togetherness will go a long way to your return go hoyas beat cuse TOGETHERLY COMPOSED
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MassHoya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,786
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Post by MassHoya on Feb 11, 2009 11:35:54 GMT -5
No matter how much we like and respect Dajuan and Jesse for their past contributions, Davis' article does hit the nail on the head. The team, particularly the youngins, need their leadership. Despite whatever slights real or imagined from teammates, the refs, JT III himself, or whoever, these guys need to rise to the challenge and lead this team the rest of the way. Regardless of the outcome, leadership and effort is what the tradition of Hoya basketball expects of Juniors and Seniors in a situation like this. Come on guys, YOU are Georgetown.
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the_way
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
The Illest
Posts: 5,419
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Post by the_way on Feb 11, 2009 11:46:49 GMT -5
you can't blame Dajuan and Sapp for what they aren't.
people are quick to assume, that
"well hey, they are upperclassman, they need to be leaders"
"well hey, they are upperclassman, they means they are leaders"
well, not everybody is a leader. people fail to understand this.
its not a character flaw or that somebody is a bad person. its just a trait that people either have or don't.
Summers and Sapp are what they are.
you can't say Sapp isn't fighting his guts out, when he is on the floor (or if he is on the floor). He is doing the best he can. The best he can isn't going to make us a top 10 team.
you can't say Summers has regressed as a player. Summers has been what he has been his entire career. a solid talent, that is cosistently iconsistent. again, Summers being the best player HE can be, isn't going to make us a top 10 team.
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guru
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,595
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Post by guru on Feb 11, 2009 12:04:23 GMT -5
you can't blame Dajuan and Sapp for what they aren't. people are quick to assume, that "well hey, they are upperclassman, they need to be leaders" "well hey, they are upperclassman, they means they are leaders" well, not everybody is a leader. people fail to understand this. its not a character flaw or that somebody is a bad person. its just a trait that people either have or don't. Summers and Sapp are what they are. you can't say Sapp isn't fighting his guts out, when he is on the floor (or if he is on the floor). He is doing the best he can. The best he can isn't going to make us a top 10 team. you can't say Summers has regressed as a player. Summers has been what he has been his entire career. a solid talent, that is cosistently iconsistent. again, Summers being the best player HE can be, isn't going to make us a top 10 team. the_way, it's really amazing how negative you are. If you're anything like this in real life, you must be absolute death at a dinner party. I just looked through your posting history - you didn't post from last July until January 23, not coincidentally right about the time that this year's team was imploding. Since then, you've been a very regular poster, pointing out all your perceived weaknesses with this team. And it's a pretty consistent pattern with you - show up after losses or during extended bad periods, and hand down your proclamations of doom and I-Told-You-Sos. Kinda gets old and definitely takes away from your credibility.
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the_way
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
The Illest
Posts: 5,419
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Post by the_way on Feb 11, 2009 12:14:40 GMT -5
guru, you choose to stalk somebody you find completely negative.
aaaaah....you try too hard.
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DanMcQ
Moderator
Posts: 30,458
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Post by DanMcQ on Feb 11, 2009 12:34:28 GMT -5
We try to exercise some caution with respect to what gets posted here about players. With all due respect to the former sportswriters that participate here, the line is often quite fine. With respect to whether what is dropped on the doorstep in ink on paper, one can at least identify who actually wrote the article and have a reasonable degree of certainty that person has actually talked to the parties involved. That is not always the case with what gets posted here. It is up to the reader to determine the veracity of what shows up in print in those venues.
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SirSaxa
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 747
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Post by SirSaxa on Feb 11, 2009 13:37:42 GMT -5
Dan -- GPHoya made some good points, but so did you. It is a "fine line". Maybe better to err on the side of caution as you tend to do.
TheWay. You are correct in pointing out what Jessie and DaJaun have done/been in the past. But I don't agree we should not expect more from them as they get older, more experienced. That's the whole point of being on a team, coaching, learning, developing your game... individually and as a team. We DO expect much more from our Seniors than we do from our freshmen. Barker made the whole situation pretty clear. I share the disappointment that neither of those guys have risen to the occasion now that this is really "their" team.
Earlier this school year, I was posting how this would be JT3's first team without the remarkable class of '08 and that it would be a new era. Maybe the first year of the Monroe era. I looked at it as an exciting opportunity. The team more than lived up to that promise through the first 'Cuse game. Then the wheels came off -- completely.
There is still time for this TEAM to recover. We all know it will take all of the players and coaches to pull it off. Saturday is their big test. Will they lift up their game and remember TEAM first? I can't think of a more hostile environment for our Hoyas than the Carrier Dome facing a our biggest rival, a team we already beat... badly, and one that has also undergone a deep swoon. It will be very interesting to see what happens, and if JT3 changes the starting line-up.
GO HOYAS!
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Post by daytonahoya31 on Feb 11, 2009 13:39:57 GMT -5
Barker's story hit the nail on the head. It wasn't speculation and rumors.
remember, beat writers are there each and every day, each and every practice, each and every game. there are a ton of stuff that doesn't get printed but stuff that a beat writer knows.
This wasn't a regular story. I was an analysis piece, sort of like a what's wrong with g'town b-ball type of piece. He got comments from other analysts, but he sees everything that's going on, and he wrote about it.
glad somebody finally did
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