SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Jul 8, 2008 8:06:43 GMT -5
Hughes and Gordon definitely need to go. Possibly Hinrich if you aren't comfortable with him at the 2, though he's not a bad defender (overrated, though) and can hit an open shot.
Beasley has to prove he's going to play some D to be a true star. There's no doubt he can score, but using a summer league game as evidence is silly. DeShawn Stevenson averaged 30 ppg about five years ago.
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on Jul 8, 2008 8:31:59 GMT -5
Bird, Magic, AI, Sir Charles, etc never played defense. All of them are/were stars.
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bmartin
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Post by bmartin on Jul 8, 2008 8:35:39 GMT -5
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Post by HoyaSinceBirth on Jul 8, 2008 8:46:37 GMT -5
what part am i supposed to be looking at? the 10 pts? the lack of a single rebound? the 50% shooting?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2008 8:56:13 GMT -5
what part am i supposed to be looking at? the 10 pts? the lack of a single rebound? the 50% shooting? The 5 fouls in 20 minutes?
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bmartin
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by bmartin on Jul 8, 2008 9:03:54 GMT -5
0 rebounds and 5 fouls against no name centers. Good thing the guards were rebounding.
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vcjack
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Post by vcjack on Jul 8, 2008 9:45:48 GMT -5
Hughes and Gordon definitely need to go. Possibly Hinrich if you aren't comfortable with him at the 2, though he's not a bad defender (overrated, though) and can hit an open shot. Beasley has to prove he's going to play some D to be a true star. There's no doubt he can score, but using a summer league game as evidence is silly. DeShawn Stevenson averaged 30 ppg about five years ago. Nobody's going to take Hughes' contract (and if so only to unload another big money drain like Ben Wallace) so Chicago is stuck with him. Both Gordon and Deng will become restricted FA and the priority has always been to resign Deng so it seems like Gordon will be the one to go, but who knows? But Hinrich has the second largest contract on the team BUT he has trade value due to his supposed defensive abilities. I could see teams like New York, GS, and Washington who lack defense from the point position to be interested in him. Therefore it makes perfect sense for him to be kicked out
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Post by schiavoed on Jul 8, 2008 12:18:25 GMT -5
i might be wrong on this but i think the foul limit is higher in summer league games so players dont hold back as much. i think i remember oden getting up to around 8 in a game last year
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DudeSlade
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I got through the Esherick years. I can get through anything.
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Post by DudeSlade on Jul 8, 2008 12:39:28 GMT -5
I didn't mean to give the impression that I think Beasley will be better based on this game alone. I have felt from the beginning that he was the #1 player in this draft and the best fit for the Bulls with their awful big men (Noah, Thomas, Aaron Gray, etc.). Deng is not a big-time scorer. He's a good 3rd or 4th option, but not a 1 or 2 option. Gordon can score in bunches, but he's streaky. Hinrich is not a top floor distributor, but he's a generally above average PG. In my opinion, the Bulls needed a top big man scorer to draw the defense away from its guards. With Rose, the defense will key even more on the guards. He will create a lot of opportunities for his teammates and be a great player, in my opinion. I'm not knocking him. But I do believe that Beasley is the catch of this draft and have always felt that way. Rose was a solid player that improved throughout the year, but he was never considered a #1 pick until he had a great NCAA tourney against under-sized competition (though, you could argue Chalmers had the last laugh against him).
Beasley chewed everyone up all year long, including Kansas and a USC defense that held Durant in check the year before in the NCAA tournament. For a supposedly immature kid, he sure rises to the occasion in big moments and doesn't seem to show nerves. Against Kansas, the NCAA Tourney, and even his 1st summer league game which could make anybody a little anxious--all these situations he approached with the comment, "It's just basketball. I've been doing this all my life. I'm just gonna come out and play as hard as I can." To me, that seems like a kid that will never get in a situation over his head and that will always keep his composure in the tough situations.
He will undoubtedly need to grow up and mature more off the court, but what 19 year old doesn't? I guess I've always liked the fun-loving attitude, so I'm not as put off by it. He seems to have a great sense of humor and I tend to think that will help in creating team chemistry. I more than understand the concerns about him in South Beach, but you'd have to worry about any kid in South Beach. I also agree that Beasley needs to improve his defense and with his hops and ability to attack the boards, he could certainly become a shot-blocking presence and in my opinion, be comparable to Josh Smith on the defensive end. Now that's a far way to go, but it's possible--just as possible as Rose taking that next step to become an elite PG, in my opinion.
It will be interesting to watch. I hope both do real well on their respective teams, because it's good for the league and more entertaining for us fans to watch elite talents. Frankly, I am far more interested in how my Lakers blend Andrew Bynum with Pau Gasol and how our Hoyas (Jeff, Roy, Pat) fare in the NBA, but I think Beasley will be the Rookie of the Year and it will only be 4-5 years from now when we really know which team made the better selection.
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Post by youngjeezy on Jul 8, 2008 12:42:40 GMT -5
i might be wrong on this but i think the foul limit is higher in summer league games so players dont hold back as much. i think i remember oden getting up to around 8 in a game last year i'm pretty sure you either can't foul out or you get 10 fouls before you foul out, something ridiculous like that. surely 5 fouls aren't as telling of a sign in summer league compared to the regular season, but i think the 0 rebounds is a much more impressive red flag for our good friend mr. lopez.
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DudeSlade
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Post by DudeSlade on Jul 8, 2008 12:44:33 GMT -5
Back on the topic of this thread, though, when are the other games Jeff is in and who are they playing? I hope he continues to be assertive and develops a strong rapport with Westbrook.
Any chance Roy will be playing summer league? What about Pat?
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mdhoya97
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Post by mdhoya97 on Jul 8, 2008 12:49:52 GMT -5
I think teams shouldn't be divorced from their name, that way when they get moved you get weird oddities like the Jazz playing in a city not known for jazz music or a Memphis team named after a type of bear that doesn't exist around the city. This is going to shock you, but there are also no longer Velociraptors in Toronto. also i don't see many rouge colored people in DC -M
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on Jul 8, 2008 12:55:07 GMT -5
Back on the topic of this thread, though, when are the other games Jeff is in and who are they playing? Try NBA.com Not likely. Although the Indiana brass will be able to officially talk about him, Rush and the other acquired players tomorrow.
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RDF
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Post by RDF on Jul 8, 2008 13:02:09 GMT -5
Greg Oden fouled out of Summer League first game last year--don't judge this too much--That guy who looks like Sylvester Stallone was dropping like 38-40 in first few games last year-and he did what exactly? Bellini or whatever his name is--and Randy Foye is "Mr. Vegas" and then sucks to a point that Wolves fans laugh at McHale even more for trading Brandon Roy to get him.
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DudeSlade
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Post by DudeSlade on Jul 8, 2008 13:08:11 GMT -5
This is going to shock you, but there are also no longer Velociraptors in Toronto. also i don't see many rouge colored people in DC -M Only a couple of lakes in LA and I think most of those are man-made. And I have yet to figure out what a Dodger is, though with gang violence in LA, I can start to guess. Come to think of it, we don't have any Kings here, either, and I'm pretty sure, Galaxies can't be contained in a city. Of course, Sparks are real in LA, but only when someone's car backfires or our mountains catch on fire like they are now. At least the Raiders and Rams left town, so we don't have to worry about finding them in a back alley someday. And the only Angels in LA are in the city's name.
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bmartin
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Post by bmartin on Jul 8, 2008 13:20:44 GMT -5
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FewFAC
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Post by FewFAC on Jul 8, 2008 14:05:29 GMT -5
I hope Jeff lights it up and shows that he is the #2 man in OKC now. I don't want to hear anymore about the Durant-Westbrook combo. It's Durant-Green-Westbrook and I hope the media recognizes that. Anyone know what names are being considered for OKC's team? Cyclones, Mustangs, Dust Bowl? Chicago is going to wish it took Beasley before the year is up. Rose will be a good PG in the league, probably an all-star, and likely one of the top 5 PGs somewhere behind Chris Paul & Deron Williams. But Beasley will be a star. He flat out can score in bunches and can rebound. His performance today was against Joakim Noah and Tyrus Thomas, who are established NBA players and not your typical summerleague players. In my opinion, Beasley will end up a top 10 player in the NBA within 4-5 years. Rose as I said will probably be a top 5 PG. Both will be great picks. But with Hinrich on board already and seeing today what Beasley did to their current big men (Noah & Thomas), Chicago will realize that Beasley would have put them closer to a top Eastern Conference team quicker than Rose will. Lets not jump to conclusions. Its one game...an early summer league game at that. We all know Beasley is talented but so is Rose. Besides the problem with Beasley is still possibly his maturity rather than his talent and obviously Beasley had something to prove against the Bulls. That being said as much as I like Rose' game I never bought into that hype that he is the next Kidd, Paul or Deron Williams. You just can't predict those things. I especially got sick of all the talk about him being a "big" point guard at 6'3. The dude was well under 6'2 without shoes at the measurement. That makes him about average at the NBA level in terms of height but he's not big ala Jason Kidd. Plus his maturity is now coming into question too. It does my heart good to read all the griping by Bulls fans about the play of Noah and Thomas, particularly Thomas who was a one-tournament wonder at LSU. Both guys are those super athletic types with all that supposed "upside" that you keep hearing about during draft time. But both are lacking in the skills department and can't do much on offense. And now both got whipped by a guy only a few months removed from his frosh year in college playing his first NBA level game. Just perfect. One correction though is that these two ARE typical summer league players. Sure perhaps former lottery picks like Thomas don't typically play three straight years in the summer, but when you are a very young player who still hasn't proven himself and still have so many glaring holes in his game like Thomas, you are gonna get shipped off to summer play. Soon-to-be second year guys like Noah are always filling out summer league rosters too. But a guy like Jeff who was not only a top five pick but made the all NBA rookie team is a rare type of player for the summer. Perhaps Jeff wanted to participate. I read that Pacers' head coach Jim O'Brien is coaching the Pacers' summer team. Now that is rare. Not to get too far away from the topic but... The funny thing about Noah and Thomas is that the Bulls clearly tried not to go with "upside" front-court players given their experience with Curry and Chandler, and they still got the same thing. Though I also agree Beasley probably wasn't the "fit" guy Chicago needed, I don't think the Bulls' front office is exactly in a position to be making such strict demands on its players as well as that worked with Skiles, but history is clearly in the making there, as no one seems capable of learning from their past mistakes. As for Jeff, I really wonder if his best fit is in OKC, though I am pretty sure he can be a hugely complementary piece on any NBA organization. I just happen to think that he is significantly better than the "glue"-type player he is beginning to be typecast as, and I doubt there is sufficient oxygen in the Sonics organization for him to really showcase his skills, leading perhaps to his summer endeavors, where he might be better served getting some rest...the NBA season is a long one...
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Jul 8, 2008 15:43:15 GMT -5
I know you were joking, but "Dodger" refers to the fact that long before the Dodgers were actually named that, people from Brooklyn were often referred to as Dodgers, because the main transportation was trolleys that really wouldn't stop much. The people of Brooklyn, especially the kids, would dodge the trolleys as they crossed the street. The Brooklyn club was named all sorts of things at one points, most prominently the Robins, but I *think* all the trolleys were gone from Brooklyn by the time "Dodgers" stuck.
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bmartin
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Post by bmartin on Jul 8, 2008 16:16:37 GMT -5
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bmartin
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Post by bmartin on Jul 8, 2008 16:22:44 GMT -5
Durant is playing for OK City.
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